Emma Watson's dig at JKR

[IamSarah]

It appears she said at the BAFTAs 'I am here for all of the witches... bar one'

Disappointing but not unexpected.

twitter.com/emwatsonbestof/status/1503505167207084034?s=21

The only way the words "by the way" are coming out of that mouth shaping, is if EM is operated by a ventriloquist. Which is not a possibility I am ruling out at this stage.

Well, it's fair to say she frequently talks out of something other than her mouth.

I'm not asking for proof that we haven't exhausted all avenues. That was my point in the first place. Which apparently was silly.

It was you who claimed that you knew for definite that this is a psychological issue.

I don't know why people are trans. I'm interested to know. I'm happy to accept that there may well be an answer discovered in the future. Until then, I don't think it's anyone's place to claim to have all the answers.

Really?

Do you have any links to GC women attacking any gender ideologist?

Or do you equate disagreement with attack?

Because we mean real and physical attacks. On the person, employment, facilities, legal protections etc etc.

@BlindGirlMcSqueaky

I'm not asking for proof that we haven't exhausted all avenues. That was my point in the first place. Which apparently was silly.

It was you who claimed that you knew for definite that this is a psychological issue.

I don't know why people are trans. I'm interested to know. I'm happy to accept that there may well be an answer discovered in the future. Until then, I don't think it's anyone's place to claim to have all the answers.

Yet when proffered 'proof' you won't read it, engage with it.

Never mind. The world still turns.. and it really does turn.

Genuinely no idea why the clear photos on my iPad are coming up as blurry. Anyway. I've got the book pus two decades of living, actually living this, not just reading about what other people think. Or more often, believe.

For me this is like watching very adamant folk arguing about the nature of souls. Gender dysmorphia exists, but so does fetish and kink. Women and kids are being marginalised and hurt. Some women and men are having their psychological distress minimalised. A drug company is making a huge amount of money and lots of people are bandwagoning this for their own needs.

As you were.

I imagine it is blurred to best represent the ineffable quality of the contents. The unknowable, ever changing dialectic.

Or some such existential twaddle.

As we were, indeed!

Or threats of rape and death. "Choke on my lady dick, terf" perhaps isn't a direct threat but it's still got a tone I don't see on the other side of the fence.

I see I had a few posts removed yesterday (I never received any messages from MNHQ). Needless to say, I think they should have stood, although I accept that if I want to post here, I have to abide by the mods' rulings. But while they might have been a bit sarcastic about someone's claims of confusion, they were definitely not in the realms of "die in a grease fire, terf".

Did someone ask for a picture of a gender identity?

@SamphiretheStickerist

Really?

Do you have any links to GC women attacking any gender ideologist?

Or do you equate disagreement with attack?

Because we mean real and physical attacks. On the person, employment, facilities, legal protections etc etc.

Do I have an entire file on my computer containing every single instance of any attack on a trans person originating from a GC person like some of you seem to have for the reverse situation? No.

Am I going to clear my schedule for the afternoon and not return to work in order to make this file so that I can share it here? Also, no.

You're not blind and you're certainly not an idiot, you know as well as I and everyone else does that the attacks happen both ways. In each "camp" there are extremist dickheads who take things way too far. When the attack is on a very famous person such as JKR, obviously it's going to be world news, as opposed to "lesser mortals". If you're about to tell me that never ever ever has a GC person, or group of people attacked a trans person or someone who stands with trans people, then I'll take back my "you're certainly not an idiot".

Now, I will await your post saying "SEE you didn't provide any PROOF so its not TRUE hahahahahah" and tick that off of my Mumsnet Feminist Sex and Gender board bingo sheet - with this thread, I've almost won an inflatable palm tree.

If you were sending me the pages of a book that contained the sum total of all human knowledge, yes I would accept that as final and conclusive evidence.

I won't accept suppositions as proof. It's a theory that people who are trans are mentally unwell. It's not an irrefutable fact.

There may well be further research on this in the future that identifies the cause. Until that time, it's not my role on earth to make derogatory comments about women's intelligence to try and make a point.

@SamphiretheStickerist are you really attacking someone online, who is living it, I'm a trans widow btw, for not agreeing 100% with you? Eesh. Simple solutions are for fascists and teenagers. This is complicated and we are real people behind these screens. Thank you

This thread will get deleted because what should be a debate with evidence, has been derailed into nasty. This is how no debate works. This is how women's evidence winds up in the bin.

[quote gigglewater]@SamphiretheStickerist are you really attacking someone online, who is living it, I'm a trans widow btw, for not agreeing 100% with you? Eesh. Simple solutions are for fascists and teenagers. This is complicated and we are real people behind these screens. Thank you[/quote]
I think we have crossed wires there. I was wholeheartedly agreeing with you. I should have added an emoji. I know full well that sarcasm doesn't always read properly online!

Apologies for any and all pissed offness incurred.

I won't accept suppositions as proof. It's a theory that people who are trans are mentally unwell. It's not an irrefutable fact.

I’m not sure I like the short hand that being described in the DSM V, means you are “mentally unwell”. A disorder is not an illness.

@BlindGirlMcSqueaky

If you were sending me the pages of a book that contained the sum total of all human knowledge, yes I would accept that as final and conclusive evidence.

I won't accept suppositions as proof. It's a theory that people who are trans are mentally unwell. It's not an irrefutable fact.

There may well be further research on this in the future that identifies the cause. Until that time, it's not my role on earth to make derogatory comments about women's intelligence to try and make a point.

I think you will find that @gigglewater took the time and effort to repeatedly do just that. And I then provided a link to the same information online.

No supposition. Gigglewater has explained that this is their lived experience and I, as I have said before on such threads, taught psych at FE and HE level for a number of years.

You can take that up with the APA as you choose but dysmorphia is a well documented illness, in many guises.

@5zeds

I won't accept suppositions as proof. It's a theory that people who are trans are mentally unwell. It's not an irrefutable fact.

I’m not sure I like the short hand that being described in the DSM V, means you are “mentally unwell”. A disorder is not an illness.

Aye! And nobody who wrote any part of or used any part of the DSM in any iteration, would say the same.

[quote autienotnaughty]@Waitwhat23

I mean all women. I don't feel I have the right to decide who's female and who's not. Except myself of course. [/quote]
As others have said (and I bet you do know yourself) this is not something you or anyone, decides. Evolution has done it for us.

In any case, I am interested if there are other biological facts that you feel you do not have the right to decide? How about age? Can you tell the difference between a child and an adult?

Species?

Why are posts that are not in any way rude or abusive being deleted? That last one wasn't even mildly sarcastic.

Once again, Simon Fanshawe OBE has something to say on this: www.holyrood.com/inside-politics/view,cofounder-of-stonewall-calls-for-calm_14648.htm

“I have never seen a feminist placard that says, ‘Death to trans people’ but I have seen many placards that say, ‘Death to Terfs’ [trans-exclusionary radical feminists] or ‘Punch a Terf’. The violence coming towards lesbians is completely staggering.”

@BlindGirlMcSqueaky you definitely give good effect to the saying that there's no so blind as those that will not see.

I'm perfectly content accepting that I don't know everything there is to know about everything. I wonder what makes other people feel so confident in their opinions that they mistake them them with fact?

At least people have had the opportunity to have a nice bitch about Emma Watson though.

@Iwishihadariver Bye then. Perhaps take eeeICouldRipATissue with you? You both just continue to sneer again and again at posters stating their own opinions as we expect on mumsnet. You're not adding anything new, just being persistently, predictably boring 😴

Ah yes, sneering at oh so very (supposedly) adult and (supposedly) educated women who are calling another woman mean names as if we're all 8 years old again on the school playground. How very dare I.
But, no bother, next week there'll be another thread about JKR and someone will say "ah, I don't really like her" and there'll be cries of "how dare you tear down another woman!".

@DrSbaitso I thought that too. I can only assume we are being heavily Monitored.