Stonewall Lobby World Rugby

[SunsetBeetch]

Ffs I am so sick of this agenda-heavy lobby group and their war against women's rights!

(Note that they are controlling who can reply to them too.)

“We are asking rugby clubs at all levels of the game to stand with us against a ruling that is exclusionary and that will impact some of the most vulnerable people in the community”.

Join us and
@LgbtiqS
in calling
@WorldRugby
to #TackleTransphobia lgbtiqsportalliance.org.uk/uk-lgbtiq-sport

twitter.com/stonewalluk/status/1296801438211944455?s=20

I think it's great that Stonewall are pushing this. The safety issues and risks to women's safety of born males playing against women in rugby are openly understood.
Carry on Stonewall - you're doing our work for us!

@Student133

I've been involved in rugby my entire life, and though some higher ups at the RFU may pay lip service to this, I can assure you, the odds of any local clubs getting behind this is just tiny. Aside from the rights or wrongs, most clubs are run by blazer wearing blokes in their 60s, who are like harry Enfield sketch material, they wont even know what a 'trans' is, let alone let any women's teams be threatened by mtf players, its just culturally alien to 99% of the folks who are involved in rugby.

You may think that Student but I can assure you it IS happening. One young woman I know has been ostracised by some of her team members for not wanting to play against a man who plays for a woman's team in her amateur league. She was told to 'be kind'...

The tweets are not going well for Stonewall.

Kit19 is this a review about trans in sports by Gendered Intelligence or are they part of a National group including independent science, psychology, etc etc

Highname - interestingly having just checked they talk about the review but now say they are working with women’s groups too. I’d be very interested to know which ones!

www.sportengland.org/corporate-information/equality-and-diversity/transgender-inclusion-grassroots-sport-and-physical

Roswell sorry I meant they weren't seeing these things at the moment because of Covid, not in general and not that it isn't happening. It will be much more to the forefront when life has settled down......perhaps

Covid hasn't made much of a difference imo.

The whole point of half this stuff is that it's done by stealth. Women have been and are continuing to be blocked banned arrested etc in the desperate bid to keep everything quiet.

Everything is done in secret. Thats the point.

Boxing does not include everyone, there are 'exclusionary' weight divisions every few kilos.

The average man weighs more than a few kilos more than the average woman.

Yep gendered intelligence review will be totally objective 🤦🏻‍♀️

twitter.com/genderintell/status/1296376000402599937?s=21

@Savananan

Its also incredibly selfish. I cant imagine what the man who breaks the neck of the transman just by tackling or accidently falling on them would feel. Would he ever feel he could play again.

Well exactly. Of course stonewall aren't arsed about transmen as they are biologically women and eurgh women, but it's a very valid point and one often overlooked.

absolutely, because most men are decent and understand that their increased size and strength are a risk to women. We wouldn't suggest that is it ok for adults to compete in sports against children because of the difference in size and strength. There is a measurable difference between men and women therefore they cannot compete fairly against each other. Specifically mixed sex sports where all parties have consented to playing and presumably safety precautions are taken are obviously fine.

Audiences, they'll be important. I saw a clip and a lot of the audience were booing. We hate unfairness and you can't arrest the whole bunch unless they're going to police sporting venues.

I assume this is the US and we're not at that state in the UK.

It will be interesting to see what comes out of Sport England reviews. They are acknowledging the issues though and how contentious this is, so it will be interesting. I would imagine loads of backlash when the report is published if it isn't clearly women focused

That post was great. It's amplified how ridiculous it is. Think Stonewall have really overreached on this one. Last time I looked it had been retweeted 1.2K times. It's a great way to show them up for what they are. A big misjudgement on their part. 99.9% of people think it's insane.

They, and their woke supporters, have to die on this hill. If they admit MTF trans people have male bodies the whole house of cards comes crashing down.

Wasn't it gymnastics England that implemented the mixed sex changing.

Swim England backed down thanfulky after the man Friday campaign.

I was just thinking about what JKR would be thinking of this, wondering if she might tweet about sports soon - I just looked on her page and she has retweeted something about the Stonewall tweet

Let Stonewall carry on - let the world see what a ridiculous misogynist organisation it is.

Imagine this being the hill you choose to die on. Of course sport isn't inclusive. Who would watch it? No one wants to see me playing sodding tennis in the name of "inclusivity", do they?

There aren't even any attempts to deconstruct the GC argument. If you want to debate, you have got to engage with the reasoning of your opposite number.

Watching with interest to see how this will pan out - how much pressure will be put on World Rugby, versus whether this outbreak of sanity will spread to other women's sports?

Praying that it's part of a push-back in favour of common-sense and science.

My position has always been "Trans? Happy to back you all the way against genuine prejudice in the majority of situations where biological sex does not matter (I treat your belief that you ought to be a woman as I would treat a religious person's belief in an immortal soul - I don't share it, but you holding it shouldn't stop you getting most jobs or access to your own, as opposed to shared, housing). But in the minority of situations where biology does matter: women - the old fashioned, uterus-having kind - must be protected."

Sport is definitely in the category of situations where biology not merely matters, it's pretty much everything.

@KingFredsTache

I was just thinking about what JKR would be thinking of this, wondering if she might tweet about sports soon - I just looked on her page and she has retweeted something about the Stonewall tweet

Let Stonewall carry on - let the world see what a ridiculous misogynist organisation it is.

I came on to say the same. With JKR retweeting, the unfairness will be seen by a massive audience and that tweet perfectly encapsulates the problems.

I'm just going to leave this here. If only we could use clear language when talking about this specific issue, like JL uses in this clip. I liked the whole thing, but she is very direct from about 5.10 to 6.00

What the hell is this all about? Stonewall must know how crazy this is; they must be aware of how it looks to people.

If you told me this was some kind of mad experiment to show how insane ideas can be pushed through society, a bit like KLF and their "get to number one with a bonkers song" experiment, I'd be like "yeah, that makes sense."

Stonewall seems hellbent on destroying their own brand and influence. I don't understand it. It's like a constant stream of Ratners moments.

There aren't even any attempts to deconstruct the GC argument. If you want to debate, you have got to engage with the reasoning of your opposite number.

They don't want to debate. They want us to shut up.

It's just delusional. I just despair that everything female is now reduced to "feelings."

It's like Stonewall are trying to peak as many people as possible at once. They have got ex-rugby players, who have never tweeted about trans issues ever before, standing up for women's safety.

it's like Stonewall are trying to peak as many people as possible at once.

It's a hell of a position to take that no right minded person would support. But why are they taking it?

Money? Sunk cost fallacy? Misogyny on an institutional scale? What power does the Stonewall trans advisory panel hold over the rest of the organisation and how did they get the power?

I really don't know, but genuinely baffled

“We are asking rugby clubs at all levels of the game to stand with us against a ruling that is exclusionary and that will impact some of the most vulnerable people in the community”.

Cheating men are the most vulnerable in the community? The civil rights movement must have truly exhausted itself and there is nothing more that society needs to fight for.

@Packingsoapandwater

What the hell is this all about? Stonewall must know how crazy this is; they must be aware of how it looks to people.

If you told me this was some kind of mad experiment to show how insane ideas can be pushed through society, a bit like KLF and their "get to number one with a bonkers song" experiment, I'd be like "yeah, that makes sense."

Stonewall seems hellbent on destroying their own brand and influence. I don't understand it. It's like a constant stream of Ratners moments.

I suspect they've fallen into a kind of logical trap.

Their premises are, TWAW, and that it is impossible for recognising the "rights" of someone to be unfair for others. Rights in this case meaning right to identify as a woman.

Somehow they have accepted these ideas to the degree that no matter what ind of research or analysis comes out about actual empirical facts around male and female bodies, they assume it's flawed or incomplete or something.

Money? Sunk cost fallacy? Misogyny on an institutional scale? What power does the Stonewall trans advisory panel hold over the rest of the organisation and how did they get the power?

It’s money. Large charities exist primarily for the benefit of the privileged, liberal educated people who land lucrative roles within them. Sometimes they manage to offer some benefit to the communities they purport to serve. Often, though, they’ll fuck these communities over (quite literally in the case of Oxfam’s sex for aid practices), just like Stonewall has done by condemning homosexuality in order to carry on bringing in the $$. These organisations have time and again shown themselves to be unabashedly and self-servingly racist, misogynistic and homophobic.