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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Jordan Peterson on Question Time next Thursday

187 replies

HandsOffMyRights · 02/11/2018 20:44

As somebody fairly new to the self ID debate, could somebody please tell me how Jordan is connected? And what (if anything) this means for next week?

OP posts:
gladysisbackintheroom · 04/11/2018 13:23

The thing is @TrashyTerf, 1970s feminism was routinely patronised by mainstream discourse as a phase or a fashion. So it's really not a big or clever response.

Electron1 · 04/11/2018 13:30

1970s (and earlier) feminism achieved quite a lot.

the Equal Pay Act 1970
the Sex Discrimination Act 1975

Sadly, we are still working on it!

OldCrone · 04/11/2018 13:31

Posie isn't on the thread, she has posted a pic of her with JP online a while back so it's easy to spot the PP/JP/TR trope when I see it, it's used a lot by many of the anti mumsnet/fairplay for women/WPUK agitators on twitter.

It was really the use of 'you' - presumably to someone on the thread, about someone who wasn't on the thread - which I found odd. Do some people think we're all clones or something?

Almondcandle · 04/11/2018 13:32

Some things are just a fashion though.

Helen Lewis did make Jordan Peterson look intelllectually thin.

He still has some interesting ideas though.

TrashyTerf · 04/11/2018 13:36

@gladysisbackintheroom

No, he didn't mean that gender identity was fashionable. He meant that a person's individual gender identity is simply their fashion sense. He has a point with that to be fair.

Electron1 · 04/11/2018 13:39

The "you" is a libfem message to rad fems or gc fems.

Peakpants · 04/11/2018 13:51

Yes, happy to confirm it’s directed at Posie Parker. It’s hardly a smear- are you saying that she didn’t proudly tweet a picture of herself with him and that she didn’t say there was a conspiracy against Tommy Robinson?
I am not telling anyone what to do but don’t get all shocked when people accuse you of associating with the alt right.
Rod Liddle IS a wife beater and writes horrible misogynistic columns about how no men fancy women who have a modicum of intelligence. Why shouldn’t I shout about it? He is abhorrent, as is TR and JP.

OldCrone · 04/11/2018 13:55

Peakpants
Posie isn't on this thread. Why are you directing your comments at her?

I am not telling anyone what to do but don’t get all shocked when people accuse you of associating with the alt right.

This 'you' again. Go and tweet Posie or something if that's who you want to talk to.

TrashyTerf · 04/11/2018 14:00

I also don't get what this thread has to do with Posie Parker or Tommy Robinson? 

Logical inconsistencies like this are what JP thrives on btw...

Electron1 · 04/11/2018 14:27

are you saying that she didn’t proudly tweet a picture of herself with him

Nope, quite clearly said upthread I have seen that.

and that she didn’t say there was a conspiracy against Tommy Robinson?

Nope, quite clearly said up thread I've no idea who the bloke is.

LassWiADelicateAir · 04/11/2018 14:39

are you saying that she didn’t proudly tweet a picture of herself with him

She did. So what? Posie is a fan of his. So what? Many people are.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 04/11/2018 14:47

this idea that the FWR hive mind is a fan of JP

I can assure you that I have not time whatsoever for Jordan 'I could never respect a man who couldn't fight me' Peterson

he believes his wife's dreams sometimes foretell the future Hmm

does this mean I have to turn in my FWR membership card?

Electron1 · 04/11/2018 15:02

Now you have publicly denounced him I think you are in a safe space BernardBlacksWineIcelolly

Wink

Those of us denouncing denouncing are the ones in trouble.

Confused
Floisme · 04/11/2018 15:11

I'm waiting for dogs to be denounced - did you see that German Shepherd who posed for photos with Hitler?

Cult thinking will be the death of us all.

Imnobody4 · 04/11/2018 16:17

Good grief - this is getting ridiculous. Some people seem to think the mere mention of someone's name is akin to summoning the devil. I don't, I think you should consider and stress test all ideas.

CaptSkippy · 04/11/2018 16:36

What is FWR?

QuietContraryMary · 04/11/2018 16:52

There are a few threads about Peterson on FWR. Often the posters seem to be random fanboys (boys not girls) with no posting history on FWR.

As far as I know gender critical thought is strongly negatively correlated with support for Tommy Robinson.

As an argument 'you lot (gender critical) like Posie for standing up to TRAs, Posie likes Tommy Robinson, Tommy Robinson is a Nazis, therefore you lot are Nazis' is pisspoor and anyone going that way should be embarrassed

DeRigueurMortis · 04/11/2018 16:57

FWR - you're on it :-)

Feminism & Women's Rights - it's basically the name for this part of MN.

CaptSkippy · 04/11/2018 17:12

Ah, that makes sense. Thnx DeRigueurMortis. :-D

TigsytheTiger · 04/11/2018 19:13

Just been discussing this with DP and he has his name down on the guest list for this Question Time. Apparently you get a phone call the day prior to confirm your space and at this point you are invited to submit two questions.

He's happy (if he gets a seat in the audience) to ask a self ID question - how best to word it? suggestions?

LassWiADelicateAir · 04/11/2018 19:41

There are a few threads about Peterson on FWR. Often the posters seem to be random fanboys (boys not girls) with no posting history on FWR

I have occasionally posted postive comments about JP. There are things he says I agree with.

2rebecca · 04/11/2018 20:13

Agree, seem to having an agree with Lass day. I think he is a fairly positive influence on young men and does encourage them to take responsibility and behave well. He does have some sexist assumptions of women although his experience of 3rd gen feminists in Canada and the US may have contributed to his view of feminism. I do agree with him that there are some differences between men and women. The 2 sewing workshops on using overlockers were all women but no-one was getting worked up about the lack of "diversity". The push for that does seem to be just one way. Men were traditionally tailors though so I do think gender stereotypes play a big part in women mainly doing sewing in the west. India still has lots of male tailors.
I've read his 10 lessons book though so will be interested to hear him.

Jlynhope · 04/11/2018 20:30

I like a lot of what he has to say and view him as a positive role model for men. I loved his book and find him quite fascinating. I don't agree with everything he says, but I don't agree with everything anyone says.

ReanimatedSGB · 05/11/2018 01:08

Ugh, FFS. Peterson is a revolting, obnoxious bellend. Also, how many revolting, obnoxious bellends does Posie Parker have to snuggle up to before you start thinking that, maybe, she isn't the world's greatest role model?

CaptSkippy · 05/11/2018 07:21

Some of the things that Posie Parker says make sense, but I have also heard her insisting, during a debate, to be called "mrs" because she is married like she derives some kind of status from it. So with Posie it's a hit and miss.

Anything remotely sensible that Jordan says is something I have heard plenty of feminist say years before. So he is not even expressing his own ideas, but ripping off feminists without giving credit and then slagging off feminism as a whole.