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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Munroe Bergdorf 'What Makes a Woman' Channel 4 16/5

415 replies

R0wantrees · 16/05/2018 14:38

Extract from Radio Times:
www.radiotimes.com/news/tv/2018-05-16/what-makes-a-woman-review-munroe-bergdorf-transgender-activist-debate/

"There are more moments of vulnerability when Bergdorf attends a discussion by a feminist group called We Need To Talk. There’s a real sense of menace in the air as transgender people gather outside to protest the meeting of so-called TERFS – Trans-Exclusionary Radical Feminists – who believe trans women are not female but are in fact men threatening to infiltrate women’s space.

Bergdorf is extremely articulate in one to one interviews so it’s a shame she doesn’t feel able to stay and debate them, but it’s also understandable – the atmosphere inside the meeting is toxic and she’s surrounded on all sides.

“When we [see] events like this, which directly are designed to deny [transgender women’s] very identities and the fact that we even exist, it’s extremely hurtful and concerning,” she says as she leaves. But she later sits down with one of the organisers, Venice Allan (aka Dr Radfem, just in case you were in any doubt).

They have an interesting debate about female and transgender rights, but it ends tellingly with the good Dr declaring “feminism is about women!” when surely feminism is about equality....

Concludes:
What Makes a Woman provides a valuable grounding in the ins and outs of the transgender debate for those of us who could use it – but it’s also a profile of a intriguing, sensitive, likeable person who is herself still on a journey of discovery."

What Makes a Woman is on tonight, Wednesday 16th May, at 10pm on Channel 4 and available afterwards on All4

OP posts:
ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/05/2018 22:58

Is MB not listening / understanding what they are saying Hmm

TerfTerfTerf · 16/05/2018 22:59

On a positive note, MB is very good at being careful to use 'sex' and 'gender' correctly...
...shame MB is utterly deluded about what makes a woman though

MrsWooster · 16/05/2018 22:59

MB doesn't HAVE a womanhood. MB has a gender identity as a woman.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/05/2018 22:59

Fuck off.

cistersofterfy · 16/05/2018 22:59

Interesting that the "science" put MB in a different group to women. That'd be science saying that.

MrsWooster · 16/05/2018 23:00

Nearly a whole bar of green and blacks. That was a ride...

JoanSummers · 16/05/2018 23:00

"Who's the realist woman"

Me, I'm a realist. Munroe, you are really not.

I laughed out loud so many times during that.

Except for the bit that made me angry. And that made me really angry.

Weebo · 16/05/2018 23:00

Ugh, pish.

spontaneousgiventime · 16/05/2018 23:00

Hmm, not as bad as I thought it was going to be. I think it's probably peaked more than a few people. Own goal? Yes, I think it was.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/05/2018 23:00

YY. Woman is all of us. Including men.

All in all I suspect that might have peak transed a few people. I'm sure folk will feel.sorry for MB, but that is not the same as accepting they are a woman.

Lefthanddown · 16/05/2018 23:01

What a crock of shit that programme was.

CoolCarrie · 16/05/2018 23:02

Well I’ve had 4 glasses of wine on a school night to watch that!

JoanSummers · 16/05/2018 23:02

It was definitely a Peaker!

Bet the mainstream media fawn over it tho, they'll have their orders, churnalism striking again.

I wish I could wake up tomorrow to a review by Julie Burchill..

2rebecca · 16/05/2018 23:02

Seems bizarre if you are really gender dysphoric to want all that facial surgery but be happy to keep the most male part of you. A penis is never female.

Terfing · 16/05/2018 23:03

I just had a look on Twitter, the feedback is overwhelmingly negative towards Munroe. The public are not foooled.

bialystockandbloom · 16/05/2018 23:04

"If I had to say what makes a woman... it's all of us". Truly profound. Yep that's totally it. Nailed it. Yes it's not the XX chromosomes, the uterus, the Fallopian tubes, the periods, the menopause, nope none of that. You're a woman because you say you are. Not.

Laughable programme, massive own goal. Wtf are C4 thinking?

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/05/2018 23:04

Can't help wondering if some of the requested females involved in the making of that were (or became) terfs...

MrsWooster · 16/05/2018 23:04

I'm glad MB has found a way of living that feels more congruent to them but they can cordially fuck off if they think it's ok to dictate terms on what's ok for women based on their 27 years of life, incorporating being male, male gay, out male gay, trans identifying man, person identifying a
S a woman.

DJLippy · 16/05/2018 23:04

Why doesn't anyone break down the vagina claim. Vulva + clitoris + falopian tubes + uterus + ovaries + cervix = vagina.

Vagina is not a space for a penis. It's not a wound. Vagina's are awesome. It's where we all came from....

spontaneousgiventime · 16/05/2018 23:05

Terfing Agree, I've been following the hashtag. Not supportive of MB or what MB had to say. That's trans and women.

MrsWooster · 16/05/2018 23:05

Yes, itsallgoingtobefine!

Thankyouverymuch1 · 16/05/2018 23:06

much more balanced than I was expecting.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/05/2018 23:07

I will be interested to hear what Bergdof thought of it...

Ereshkigal · 16/05/2018 23:07

I'm sure we will! Will watch on catch up tomorrow.

NotTerfNorCis · 16/05/2018 23:09

Missed the bit with the brain scan, what was it? MB has a trans brain? Did they give any detail on what that means?