Hey MNHQ. Would it be possible to have a discussion about how SN issues/threads are handled on the main boards.

[Pagwatch]

I know you are fire fighting a bit and I'm not trying to stir things up.

I just think that there are endless threads that require you to get involved and try to (for the sake of a better word) mediate between pissed of posters with no real experience of SN/disability and pissed off member of the SN/disability community.

I think you try really really hard to be fair and even handed. It's an understandable response but I have growing doubts about it.
There have been half a dozen threads recently where posters I recognise as living with SN/disability issues deal with a continuous stream of posts from any random who pops up on a thread making the same stupid, ill informed or frankly goady post.
It's like swimming through a tidal wave of shit.
Then, as posters get increasingly exasperated by each arriving poster saying 'well I'm not putting my buggy away if my baby is asleep' or 'why can't I use the disabled toilet if it's empty' or 'but people with SN can be violent. I know of stabbing someone and attacks all the time' they get rude and the thread descends into eurrgh.

I'm still reading constant posts where anyone affected by disability is berated if they are angry, the message being 'be nice, be grateful or we don't have to be fair'

It seems to me that the status quo of 'fairness' is simply unfair.
Posters already dealing with immense difficulty shouldn't be forced to defend themselves against every person who turns up and says unpleasant things under the umbrella of debate. You said a long time ago it was not our responsibility to educate but the reality is that, with no palpable support from you guys, we are endlessly having to educate.

I am not pretending to have the answer but is it possible to contemplate methods by which you could actually say to posters saying 'if someone in a wheelchair can't use their space because I'm not putting my buggy away' that their comments are wrong and not in the spirit of the site?

You link to the This Is My Child campaign but the posters who are the problem won't care and won't read it.

I don't know - I just wonder if you could think about this.
Sometimes there are not two sides to a debate because only one side is directly affected, exhausted, distressed and having their lives and their children's lives made harder.

But I do go on to explain why in my own personal case anyway.

I wouldn't be able to use a normal cubicle. I would need the facilities offered to be but I don't count myself as disabled

Which again suggests that the post deleted was worse

I've checked the post report emails and i don't have yours as one of my reported ones MNHQ have fed back on NeedACleverNN

I don't really care. I'm not terribly interested in posters being upset because someone has to inconvenience themselves because they are not disabled.

And I tend to switch off if someone uses normal on that context.

I haven't had any responses since Monday so I don't know either.

Like I said it doesn't matter now anyway. It's gone.

Need, you could report it again and ask mnhq what you said?

My deleted posts i'd guess were for troll hunting - though i didnt say the op was a troll so much as the situation was bullshit. The one i was a bit about of mine that went was congratulating the op for "lighting the wanker batsignal and bringing them all in". Neither troll hunting nor a PA?

Yy pag re the 'hand wringing and gosh i just dont understand' - people being disingenuous winds me up more than those who are out and out goady

I'll try that actually.

Would be nice to see where I went potentially wrong

I see theyve finally locked the thread. I think that, alongside the time taken to respond which only so much can be done about, what would have made a big difference to a lot of the upset was mn said they would comment about disabilism on thread - along the lines of "saying xyz is not acceptable and will not be tolerated". It didnt happen :(

(I think iona unlocked it to comment and then locked it again, and ended up with a load of x posts?)

The lock thread message is a good one though. It acknowledges that there are disablist and goady posts as well as the troll hunting ones on the thread and all will be addressed but it will take time.

I am so pissed off with mn hq today they leave PA!s standing
Allowing troling disablist bollocks
Say on this thread that they understand... Then allow a thread like that one!,
I think my time has come ro say goodbye

samcro I got to that point a while back but then decided I would be the bigger looser.

i am all of a quandary I have been on here for 10 yrs(ok a year out ) but I like talking to people. but the full on disablist posts that are allowed.
"she didn't look like she was disabled"
"disabled people have to fit in to the norm"

just are getting too frequent.
as
dd in a gf derailing a thread. making PA'S and they are still there......
what is the point??

'Brigade'??

FFS

Hi all,

We have just caught up with this thread and it does make for an upsetting read and we know you are tired of hearing it but we do apologise.

We are making changes behind the scenes slowly, we have mailed folks about disablist posts and deleted threads with a deletion message indicating that it was removed for disablist comments.

At the moment, when we delete a post the message is always 'Deleted for breaking talk guidelines' it is a standard message and we are unable to edit it at the moment but it is something we will look to do in the future.

Some of the posts here really do point some anger and hatred towards MNHQ and that is incredibly upsetting for all of us. We never want to cause upset and we work hard to try and keep the boards a nice place to be. We apologise that this is not the case and that you don't feel listened to.

In all honesty, we have had an incredible amount of reports over the past few days about various threads across the site and we are thin on the ground with staff as we go through the recruitment process. None of this should be your issue at all but I felt we needed to explain why things are taking longer to deal with. We are not intentionally ignoring anyone, we will and do deal with the issues raised.

Please do bear with us, we will deal with things and we will get back to you, although it may not be a personal response every time.

As we have previously said, we do also have to remove posts that break our guidelines in other ways too, so we ask you to not troll hunt or personally attack. We know it's tricky when things get heated and you feel attacked but it means less time for us to deal with folks who post disablist posts.

The very last thing we want is to make anyone's lives harder or to upset anyone. Apologies again, we will have a look at the new thread now.

Lack of a better way of putting it Worra. I've been on reddit too much

Because right here on this thread there are more people who can relate to why thats wrong than I will probably meet in real life.

Bacause whilst we're frustrated, today has been a particularly bad one for that, MNHQ are trying. Okay not as reactionary as we'd like and they haven't yet fully caught the batton to lead the campaign but we do have their attention and they do say they want to learn.

Just imagine how much better things could be here if we keep plugging away.

I dont know the numbers off the top of my head for posters and lurkers on here but on the daily threads email hot threads run to 15,000 views. Thats a lot of exposure for a minority issue. Something it would be very difficult to get in real life without a big expensive rally!

Each time things kick off a few posters openly offer support, many more lurk and learn. Thats what keeps me going.

There will on here, as in real life be goady people. Maybe they have their own complex issues and inhibited abilities in their lack of empathy for the damage they cause. I have no trolldar. Cant spot one when everyone is shouting it out.

You've go to do whats right for you but rather like when people talk about going no contact, low contact is an option here. Let others do the fighting, report if you feel up to it/ let others if not, switch threads if they start to kick off.

Sorry massive cross post. That last post of mine was to Samcro

@FlouncyMcFlounceFace

Sorry massive cross post. That last post of mine was to Samcro

And it's an excellent post too Flouncy

yes it was thank you
I think I will just take time out from the shit untill I feel better

Wow sounds like I missed a lot. Was out having dinner with friends. .yay for respite

I can only speak for myself

I don't expect a personalised response to every report. I'd rather MNHQ spent the time actually dealing with the reported posts and the posters behind them. Whether or not they're deleted I can see on the thread.

But...

I DO expect reports to be viewed and responded to in a reasonable amount of time (the thread currently being discussed has been up for over TEN HOURS)

I DO expect MNHQ to follow their own guidelines and delete disablist posts as they are illegal - just as racist ones would be.

I think it's reasonable to expect bigoted posters to be told why their post/s were deleted. I'd LOVE if other mners were also told (as in it was on deletion messages).

I think it's reasonable to expect repeatedly bigoted posters to be banned - I suspect this doesn't happen very often but of course I have no way of knowing

I personally don't think this is asking too much of a large company in the uk in 2016