Considering legal advice on ex-husband’s pension

[Anonymouseky]

I split from my ex husband about 6 years ago. We divorced about 4 years ago. We were married for 6 years, together for 12. I supported his career, moved my whole life to another UK based country. I gave up my job and had to start again somewhere else. I had career aspirations myself and, had I followed these aspirations, I would have been a very higher earner now. He is a very high earner. He talked me out of it as he wanted me to move to be near him. We ended up marrying and having kids. He built up a good pension which I didn’t go for in the divorce. This has enabled him to consider an early retirement. He is now talking about 50% custody. Now the hard work is done and he has his pension pot to look forward to. I must admit, I am sickened by this. The whole reason he can do this is because of my sacrifices. He has our children 2-3 days a week anyway but I feel he is pushing for 50% because he wants to reduce maintenance. I’m now considering taking legal advice re the pension. We didn’t sign a financial order in the divorce. I wouldn’t have gone for the pension but feel I have been pushed. Has anyone done this before? We’ve been divorced a few years now, but he has clearly benefitted from my sacrifices. I’m very annoyed that now the hard work is over with the kids, and now it suits him, he suddenly wants the kids more.

How did you go the final divorce order without the financial order?

At least in England they count the years you have been cohabiting before you get married too, so it's likely to be around 10 years. But we don't know where OP lives yet.

you don’t have to have one

That's crazy, without the financial order you aren't financially separate, so every decision the other makes affects your finances. My solicitor was so clear that we must not apply for the final order until the financial order was signed and approved by the courts.

I understand why you are cross. A claim is possible but it will be long and hard fought and everything will be on the table including disclosing all assets and spending now.

Your concern is financial reduction in maintenance. How is your relationship with him? Can you not say to him that you support him seeing his kids more but the maintenance should not reduce as a result and remind him you didnt fight for his pension? Agreement is always better than a court battle.

Of course it’s good advice to get one but no one is going to make you.

Would maintenance not naturally reduce anyway if he’s retired though? Presumably his pension income is less than his salary was.

its sort of related but not related really. Apart from its the trigger that set OP off

What do your children want? If they are happy with 50/50 the great!

Ask your kids what they want.

The ship has never sailed even if you both signed an order. And you didn't. Because you sorted it out between yourselves, there is every chance there will be a mistake a lawyer can go to town on. Particularly if your ex was topping up his pension to make his earnings look lower

You haven’t signed a financial order and my understanding always was that unless that is signed, claims can be made in the future.

See a solicitor i think you can still do it. 6 years is not a short marriage and sacrifices you made sound significant.

If no financial order was signed then yes you can persue him for a proper financial settlement. Particularly if you have made sacrifices that have benefitted him.

Unfortunately fairness doesn't pay the legal bills if she doesn't get as much as she is hoping for.

A six year marriage is not a long one, so he would have an argument that she should only get a portion of the pension to account for the length of marriage. Depending on what his contributions were during that period it could be substantial or could be very little. She needs to weigh that against the thousands she will spend pursuing this.

Men like this will fight dirty and will brief their solicitor to slow down the proceedings as long as possible to bleed the other party dry. It's a very common tactic that a lot of solicitors are happy to oblige because they get the billed hours.

So as I said she needs to weigh up what the possible contributions could be during those six years and what proportion she is asking for. Then consider how that will weigh against years of legal wrangling. They are already divorced so suspect it won't be a quick case.

During the proceeding he could also get 50/50 custody formalised with no maintenance due so that that could solidify his position. Men like this don't go to court without counter demands once the can of worms is opened.

I've know a few people in this position who have spent a small fortune on legal fees to get very little in return and end up even more bitter.

Better to make a decision to proceed based on 3 things: 1. do you currently have the means to carry the legal costs for a number of years without a guaranteed outcome, 2. Does the amount your pursuing outweigh what you could potentially spend on legal fees and 3. What is he likely to demand in return and are you willing to accept that if he gets it.

Fairness is one thing but a cool discompaasionate head is a better way to go when deciding the next step.

I completely agree that legal fees are an enormous risk to this- I think it’s fair to say this is the sort of case that people sink £80,90k on because they can’t back down.

however, OP could be a litigant in person. Some basically advise £500, maybe £1-2k in court fees. This isn’t a particularly complex case.

Completely agree.

We also don't really know the figures at stake here or what else could be introduced in any financial settlement discussions from either party. It may be more complex than we know or fairly straightforward.

I note the OP has been employed since they moved to the new area, so her smaller pension pot during the 6 years in question may also be taken into account in any award as well. Not saying he will make a claim against her pension but it may influence the percentage awarded to the OP.

But whatever course of action is decided, do it with eyes wide open and considering all outcomes. Then if it makes sense to do so, move forward and put forward a claim.

My exh bullied me into being 'fair' and giving him the house because the deposit was from his inheritance. He also 'banned' me (using threats) from getting a solicitor involved so I did the divorce myself so there was no financial order made. He thought that he was so clever but never realised that I continued to have a valid claim on the house equity and assets.
When he sold the house 5 years later I went to a SHL for advice and I negotiated a chunk of the equity and SHL also told me to consider pension sharing arrangement too. I decided against going for his pension as mine was fairly equal to his because I had kept up a good job and he'd been able to flit about from various jobs doing what he'd wanted while I was the main breadwinner so I may not have benefitted.
I had already gone down to part time hours after we separated because I had DC 80% of the time and the ex said that he couldn't afford child support because he had the house to pay for now and he was on his own because I'd left him. This was the same house where I'd paid all the bills while he wasted all his wages on 'stuff' and his car.

You can absolutely do an application to court for a pension sharing order yourself OP but you do it before he retires or applies to retire so time is of the essence. I would recommend seeing a very good solicitor for advice, read up on how to do it yourself and decide if it's worth it because your exh may well fight back. Mine tried to drag me through the mud and threatened all sorts but he agreed/paid up before it needed to go before a judge. I accepted less to save court time and to get it done quickly and only used my SHL to apply some pressure and to give advice so it cost me less than 1k - exh's legal bill was already at 3k before he saw sense because he used a shit solicitor to write every letter & response.

@Backedoffhackedoff No, they don’t! You can get a barrister for a day for £5,000. You are quoting ridiculous sums for normal family solicitor work! The op should get legal advice! DIY has not put her in the best position and she needs to do it urgently. A solicitor knows exactly what to to and if it’s going to cost the sums you quote, it’s a complex case. On the face of it, this is not. Not dealing with it personally gives op help! She needs help not more DIY where she settles for way below what she should because she’s bullied.

A barrister on the day still means she will do all the legal work and preparation for that.

The costs would be incurred by a solicitor sending constant letters back and forth and multiple hearings.

i don’t know if you’ve misread but I haven’t quoted anything- I said this is the sort of case people end up paying huge amounts in legal fees for

@Backedoffhackedoff No thry don’t have multiple hearings! Unless you are bloody rich and someone is hiding squillions! Yes, solicitors prepare but the op must use mediation first. If the proposals are reasonable, they go to court and get the financial agreement. It does not cost each party what you are saying for a straightforward pension and savings case. There’s not even the house! That’s done and dusted. To get a share of a very decent pension pot, the op should get professional help. Nearly everyone because future financial security is at stake. She’s possibly been generous over the house and she needs advice. Look where no advice got her! Shafted by ex! No share of his pension. You should not say costs will be just shy of .£100,000 or there will be multiple days in court. This is relatively straightforward and what you say simply is not true.

You seem really rattled and unwilling to read what I actually wrote so let’s just leave it there

What country are you in? Divorce settlement rules are different in Scotland vs England as example

You have a legal right to go after his pension, but I'd think long and hard about whether it is the sensible thing to do and whether you're putting your children first by doing so. Your motivation seems to be = your husband wants a greater share of custody, for whatever reason, so you want to punish him for previous lack of involvement and redress your regrets about the agreement made at the time of divorce.

That's very easy for your ex husband to spin into a story of 'Your mum doesn't want me to see more of you so she's taking me to court to take my money to try and stop me' (which there is an element of truth in), especially if exh has already told the children what his plans are.

If you go ahead with this I'd say it's a certainty your relationship with your children will be affected. Is that worth it? Teenagers need a lot of parenting too and they are very emotionally vulnerable at this age, and you run a risk of being portrayed as vindictive and not putting your children first. I would move on with your life if I were you.

I imagine they have no child arrangement either! He wants 50. % to reduce his contribution. The op has an absolute right to want a financidl order snd it’s not a clean break divorce without it. All marital assets are on the table and it’s totally separate from child arrangements. She should not relinquish being the resident parent and resist any change to long standing arrangements. Custody is not something recognised by courts. The op
is the resident parent and that should remain. If DCs are over 10, they have opinions too.

You need proper legal advice but (under English Law at least) I reckon you have missed the boat. What the position is under Scots Law I could not say.

Your best approach might be to try for an allowance for the children, but that would most probably end when they reach age 18.

I think it’s important you get the financial order done, regardless of whether you will or won’t claim part of his pension pot.

Just like currently you have a claim, so does he. Now or at some point in the future. I know that seems unlikely as he sounds wealthy but you never know what the future holds.

You could approach this with him as wanting a clean financial break and start negotiations from there (if you decide to go ahead with trying to het part of his pension).

What ppl say re kids and their position in the is true too, this can potentially bring some issues.

@CorporalJohn No, a financial order can be entered into if there isn’t one and the pension is not yet paying out. Part of it will have been a marital asset. It needs to be done for the clean break divorce.