What would you do in my situation!!

[Grumpynewmum23]

Just needing advice really about what you would do in my situation as I am on my last straw, very run down as a result of my marriage and genuinely at a cross roads and my husband seems oblivious!

For general life context, we have been married 11 years. My husband is good looking, well respected in a full time professional job, plays semi professional sport outside of work, very social, lots of friends and likes to be busy. He is helpful at his sports clubs and helps with youth fixtures etc. His working hrs are often about 7.30-5.30pm. Sport taking up about 3/4 evenings a week, all day Saturday every weekend all year round from about 10am to 7/8pm. He's very committed, won't miss a game for e.g. family holidays/weddings etc.
I am in a professional role too working four days a week, and as he is never there really during waking hours (except Sundays), I do the overwhelming majority of everything else and childcare.
We have 2 small children, 1 year and 3 years.

He provides financial for all of us and it means we don't generally need to worry about money (not mega money but we live in a 3 bed semi, which we brought when we were young and the mortgage is quite cheap compared to our salaries).

On the face of it, it kind of works, except me never really getting a break, and him being almost pathologically busy.
My main problem though, is when he is at home, he is not loving or affectionate. If I was to try and give him a kiss or have sex etc he will brush me off and reject it. For reference without sounding annoying, I am generally regarded as pretty, and I look after myself well - people often comment on both my appearance and personality. I'm not sure why but it happens.
This refusal to be affectionate started around 9 years ago when I had a carcinoma removed (I was about 21) and it really freaked him out, and I had suspicion at the time he might have cheated but no evidence and he point blank refused. I'm not sure why I have tolerated it for so long but I think I almost blamed myself and really internalised how stressful it was for him.
My other gripe is he just doesn't engage well with our children, like to the point he has never looked after them by himself EVER for more than an hr. If it is over an hr he gets his parents round to help him. When one of our kids was sick and he was supposed to stay with him when I went to work, he packed them off to grandparents and went and got a coffee and did some work instead.
Lastly, there are too many to list but there are so many constants which don't feel hug and aren't like phsycailly abusive or anything but to be honest for me have caused major resentment. E.g. naming our son whilst I was unconscious after giving birth to him despite me saying I wanted to wait, going out the next day after we got home from the hospital (with both kids after they were born), leaving me when I was heavily pregnant and ill with an ill toddler to go out drinking despite me begging him to stay, drinking and throwing up all over our toddlers bed on first day of the holidays, whenever we've had to take a child to hospital he just texts or calls hope they're OK, and carries on with his life (bar about 2 occasions where it was life threatening), when I had sepsis from mastitis wouldn't leave work to look after the baby so I could rest in hospital meaning the nurses had to, when I was in bed after being discharged from hospital after said sepsis only looked after the baby for 12 minutes out of the whole day whilst I tried to shower and although he was supposed to be spending the day helping me again went out the gym for a coffee etc. There's many, many, many more things but I could go on all day.

He basically never shows up for us when we need him to.

Last weekend I had an honest chat with him and said I feel like I've given up on him to show up for us, and also to be affectionate. I've tried for such a long time and I just cannot any more. He sulked for an hour, said that made him feel shit and refused to eat tea and then an hr later carried on as normal. This week he has continued his normal schedule.
Part of me thinks I could handle the busyness if he was madly in love with me, affectionate, an engaged enthusiastic father and was really caring whilst he is here but he is not.

I feel like I might know my answer deep down but I would like advice on what you would do, what would your next steps be, how would you approach any further conversations.

You don't need his permission to separate and divorce. I would recommend that you find a good solicitor that specialises in divorce.

In terms of the split of childcare between you and your husband, I believe that normally the starting point/default is 50/50. However, it sounds unlikely that he would want the responsibility of caring for his own children 50% of the time, but he may do this to avoid paying maintenance, with the intention of delegating all his childcare responsibilities to his parents.

You sound like a great mum with your head screwed on. Hopefully, he will agree that the marriage isn't working and will co-operate with the separation and divorce. However, he sounds pretty self-centred and conceited and you taking the initiative and leaving him could hurt his ego, making him obstructive and difficult.

Do you think that your in-laws will remain friendly and helpful or will they take the side of their son (even though they are obviously realising that he is a pretty shit husband and father). Obviously, it would be better for everyone if relationships remained friendly for the sake of the children.

I wish you the best of luck, whatever you decide to do.

Did you point out that HE does whatever he likes, WHENEVER he likes?! That he doesn’t ask you if you’re okay with HIM taking time out to do what HE wants to do?!
I’m astounded, he really has no idea does he?
Just tell him the marriage is over, that you may as be a single parent due to the lack of anything he brings to the marriage, that you want him to move out NOW for your own sanity. And tell your parents, his parents and your best friend exactly what’s going on.
You can do this, you’ve proved how strong you are by running your children’s lives, the household and everything in between over the last few years.
Sending lots of support

He sounds awful. His reaction to this that it’s not a big deal (to HIM!!) is such a kick in the teeth and shows you exactly how little he gives a shit about your feelings.

FWIW my XH was always busy, never spent time with the DCs, not particularly interested in spending time with me and actually said once that when I asked him to spend time as a family it made him angry and he didn’t know why. We divorced and weirdly he stepped up a bit once the pressure to be involved was lifted. He managed to be attentive and involved one day a week, and with that little break for me, the DCs ended up with two much happier parents. We’ve both since moved on and met other people who are a much better match, the DCs are grown up and well adjusted, DD does have some abandonment issues because of her dad not being around much as she grew up and DS1 is very disappointed with how little their dad has been present for them, but tbh it’s miles better than it would have been if we were still married and I was picking up the slack for him. As a single dad he’s had to cook, take them to school, buy them birthday and Xmas gifts, keep in touch, even if only by WhatsApp, whereas when he lived with them he barely spoke to them as he was either locked in his office, or out in the garden while I did everything.

it could honestly be the best move for all of you to divorce him. Don’t waste another day with this cold fish.

I'm not sure what is holding you back?

You do it all yourself anyway. That won't change.
You can support yourself financially.
I assume you will get child support and/or a divorce settlement.
You have a supportive extended family.
You have an extended family you can rely on financially too.
You have zero affection/sex in your relationship so you won't miss that.

What exactly will be different apart from you no longer feeling used or angry about him repeatedly letting you down.
You can just focus on your kids and let him fanny about with a ball or whatever he does.

Just coming on to add to the chorus of voices that this hopeless and you’re clearly flogging a dead horse as far as your marriage is concerned. Given his latest response, i would say he doesn’t truly think you exist as a person. For him, you are a domestic appliance and your thoughts and feelings are utterly unimportant. Fortunately, you are very well-placed for divorce. Please get working on that.

And it’s common for people like your H to cultivate a very respectable public face. There’s even a term for it: street angel house devil. It’s definitely a thing. Please don’t get hung up on how this will look to third parties who don’t know what’s going on. It’s not important.

OP, he’s shown you who he is and how little he thinks of you.

As PP have said, he hasn’t had to give up anything. He still gets to do what he wants, when he wants.

If he were single he’d probably go to the gym/out to a coffee shop even more so that’s what he views as his compromises!

Also, he’s right in that when you have babies/toddlers it’s not unusual for sex to go off the boil temporarily. But not for all other types of intimacy - you can still cuddle up, hug, kiss. Your total lack of intimacy and affection isn’t normal in the slightest. The fact he shrugs it off shows that he’s not interested in rekindling it.

What are you thinking OP - do you want to try and repair your relationship by trying to make him see the light?

Or are you at the point where you can see him for what he is, and all the horrible things he’s done, and you’re ready to end things?

From what you’ve written him, I think most of us would urge you to do the latter because fundamentally he’s a very selfish man who doesn’t value you. However it’s your life and what’s black and white on paper rarely feels as simple in real life 💐

He has told you loud and clear you are on your own and he will carry on as is. Sadly just crack on with divorcing him.

My heart breaks for you OP. Only 30 and can't even get a kiss from your husband the sad pathetic loser. I agree with others who say he won't change while he has you doing everything. I genuinely believe that being a single parent would be the best thing for all of you. Time to lawyer up before this situation breaks you into tiny pieces.

Your 30 , you have financial backup , why on earth are you condoning this .
please muster up some self esteem and show him you are stronger than he think you are - a wife who lets him do anything he wants when he wants whilst she - works, looks after the kids, cleans,cooks, and waits for him to come home at 9pm and says a few words then goes to bed
leaving you angry, sexual frustrated all at the age of only 30
You couldnt write this !

please I mean this in the kindest way possible
leave him - he 109% deserves it, he probably would be glad on the inside
but outwardly to others - his world as ended (NOT)
I wouldn’t waste my time engaging with him about how you feel - he isnt arsed
sorry

Thanks everyone again for your replies. I think like one poster says what seems black and white written down rarely feels so simple in real life. My husband and I have had some intense conversations about this today, and are incidentally on holiday this week together.
Whilst I am going to try and talk to him one last time about it, if he does not understand how negatively this is affecting me and continues to disregard the impact everything has then I think I will begin the process of leaving.
I think I'm most aware of what kind of marriage I want to model to my children, and although it does break my heart, as long as I've tried everything I can then the right decision probably is to go.

In my head, I keep coming back to the same point of being able to handle all the busyness if he really demonstrated that he loved me and didn't take me for granted, because his work and sport do both generate good income. However, at the moment he does not demonstrate this and really that's the deal breaker.

I do really appreciate every single response I've had, you've given my so much confidence that what I'm asking for is not too much at all and given me the validity I needed I suppose to pursue a life that is healthy and happy x

please stop trying to talk to him. he doesn’t want to participate in his family.
make your plans to leave. Don’t consult or include him, get it all set up then execute. Tell him you’re done trying to talk , he clearly doesn’t want to be a dad or a husband and you will no longer have your children damaged by living in the same house with a man who does nothing for them unless other people are watching. Tell him to put his contact request together and for now you plan to drop the dc to him in a public place or at his club as that’s the only place you’ve seen him parent so it seems safest. Offer to buy him out, and say clearly if not we will move and sell the house. You’ll be the dad who forced their kids out of your home, and don’t think people won’t know I offered to buy you out. If there’s money in your family and he’s a sports person consider hiring a sports pr person so you have the ability to leak truths out if he decides to try and make out ‘the divorce came out of nowhere’

This conversation your last message says you’ll have. Stop it being about your activities are ok. Make it about you are never here for your dc and never do anything for them. You’ve never actually looked after them on your own or cooked them a dinner. You’re not really a dad in any meaningful sense and it breaks my heart watching them reach out to you and get rejected, hear them ask where you are. I’m done with it, I love our children and it’s at the point where my job as a mum is to protect them from your lack of love and basic care.

Right... My mum could have written this.... My dad behaved almost exactly the same.

I soooo wished she'd left...
It was so damaging for us kids for our dad to completely ignore us for the latest huge competition... Nothing EVER came between him and these sports..
Birthdays /serious illnesses/holidays...

My relationship with my dad never ever recovered.

It also meant that I set up at a young age with thr first older man that showed me kindness and interest... That was a disaster... Not a bad man but not for me

The saddest thing was for my mum..
She missed opportunities to be genuinely happy with someone else

Honestly she could have written this 45 plus years ago..

You are beating a dead horse trying to speak to him about your feelings and what you’d like the change.

He knows exactly how he’s treating you and your children and he likes that way because it means he gets to live the life of a single man with no responsibility whilst you take care of his kids and keep his house clean and fridge full.

He had the cheek to say as a parent of young children you should expect not to have any time to yourself etc….does he not realise that he too is a parent of young children.

He doesn’t view you as his equal, he doesn’t respect you and he seems to not really like you.

Think it seems quite unanimous what everyone would do in my situation. As we are away I am really trying to stay positive but I feel sick to my stomach as I think deep down, I know it is over.

Again, we've just been to the beach and he is quite happy to leave DC to it with me whilst he sits there with a coffee and I just can't really do it anymore. Keeps complaining he is tired, but I'm the one getting up with the 1yo through the night with tonsilitis etc and then doing all the things. My trouble is I have got to the point where everything grates on me, and previous grievances still grate on me, then when I mentioned a fresh start yesterday and he just scoffed and said I keep banging on about the same things and i just can't get over it.

@Grumpynewmum23 I wonder whether seeing it written down would make it real for him?

So do a list of what you’ve both done every day for the last week. Include household chores, work, his pro sport stuff, and leisure activities. You could even colour code it so it stands out.

That might make him see how much he has compared to you.

Personally, I think the examples you shared are so terrible and span such a long distance of time, I don’t think anything will change and you’d be better off on your own. He’s a selfish pig. But I completely understand why you might feel as if you wanted to give it one last go.

Do come back for support if you need it 💐

Gosh, you poor love. It sounds as if he has completely checked out of the marriage and fatherhood. Time to make some tough choices, OP.

Thank you ❤️

I'm so sorry OP that's honestly one of the saddest things I've ever read on here, you deserve so much more and there is really no excuse for his behaviour. You would be so much happier without him as you would no longer be hoping for him to step up just for him to let you down every time.

Yeah probably. I just feel like he is just going to do enough to gaslight me into thinking I'm crazy but not enough to affect his life. So really need to be clear on what I want x

Before you raise anything with him line up your Mumsnet ducks. Get together all financial info, savings, pensions etc. See a solicitor to understand what you are entitled to. Decide what you want for children's residence and access. Then talk to him from a position of knowledge.

Put a dossier together of all the things you are responsible for in your family vs him and an annex of all the times he’s let you down. Then provide a separation agreement which details what separation looks like.

If he questions why you are doing this or your reality just say ‘refer to the dossier’.

Thanks @OchreRaven @Glidinglikeaswan two good practical points xx

He said what to you?! That things change when you have young children? Well they haven’t changed for him!
OP, he is so dismissive of your feelings and the position you are in, it’s just awful. I honestly do think you would be far happier on your own with your children. I mean, you wouldn’t miss much would you?!
Im angry on your behalf

Oh and your children are so little, so much better to split now rather than ten years down the line. Good luck.