The Archers: Will Lillian decide what MATTers JUST IN time? Discussion #82

[DadDadDad]

Discuss The Archers here, the long-running thread series started by PseudoBadger. Maybe my puns will tempt her back to take the reigns?

I think Sleeping Beauty references can wait until the next thread which will probably cover much of December.

Lurkers de-lurk! New to The Archers? you're welcome here; the friendly crowd will answer your questions.

That's true - they were on the verge of collapse and yet they managed to spend money on a holiday and half portugals production of salt cod

Nancy Banks Smith back in the Guardian today!

All this talk of 'the herd'... Never do we ever refer to the cows as 'the herd'. The vet would say 'the cows look well'. Or we might refer to 'the milkers' 'the dry cows' 'the heifers' 'the calves' 'the bulls', maybe 'the youngstock' but I have never heard any dairy farmer refer to 'the herd' in the context they use it on TA. They never call the sheep 'the flock', do they?

I think I would use 'the herd' if I was referring to all animals of all ages of a type 'dairy herd' , 'beef herd'. It grates on me every time

And wasn't Pip modest when Alistair sad 'you should be proud of yourself Pip'
'I know' Surely the correct response to that is 'thank you' ?!!!

She's such a twat

I really hope someone has a long term plan that involves her dying horribly due to her own incompetence and Ben stepping in to take over the farm (Josh will be avoiding tax in his private jet in IOM)

Even more hideously, I think her response to "you should be proud of yourself" was a smug "I am"!

I am confused about Josh's involvement in The Big Important Decision re the cows.

I thought it was Ed who discussed it with Pip and they disagreed on the approach? Pip wouldn't ask Josh's opinion on anything. It must be lovely for Josh to spend so much time working on the farm and being expected to be available to work on the 'family' farm whilst being reminded daily that its Pip's farm as the FoB.

Is Ben still alive?

The advantage of listening at this time of night is I can fast forward the Dopeys.

given the Sam the Cowman episode, the New Zealand episode, and the Brookfield move bollocks

I'm not a Ruth fan but I hate how we are routinely reminded of the great affair and how lucky and grateful Ruth must be.

Ruth was quite depressed at that time post her mastectomy and generally run ragged trying to be both a farmer and run the family (but never quite well enough for Jill or David). David was a total shit to her and went off schmoozing with Crystal Tips. Ruth begged him not to keep going off with here - he told her he would do what he damn well liked and she had to put up with it. He was vile.

Sam was sympathetic and quite kind (as well as having the hots for her). The whole affair consisted of a snog in the cowshed. When she did reach the point of wanting to walk out, leaving David to Crystal Tips, she ended up not going through with it because Pip called her.

The Great Move was precipitated by the road and then David was dribbling at the money Justin wanted to pay. He reversed the decision without consulting Ruth after they had found a new farm and made plans. David has always done what suited him and Ruth has had to fall in. The trip to NZ is the one time I can remember her doing something entirely for herself and not letting David or the kids overrule her.

Am I the only person who remembers it this way??

That's not how I remember it! I remember them all being pretty awful around the time of sam the cowman and not really understanding what Sam the cowman was doing. Why do you call her crystal tips? I don't remember that!!

I can't really forgive Ruth for leaving Ben alone in the cereal cupboard so she could have a break inNZ. And she has always been a massive hypocrite 'you never involve me' 'don't worry, we won't tell your dad'.

The great move north I can forgive her for because soc made it all a pile of shite

Why do you call her crystal tips?

Because I couldn't remember her name and we used to call her Crystal TIpps - I think it was actually Sophie :)
They were all pretty awful but David was especially so and vindictive afterward. The bit I remember most was an episode when a very unhappy Ruth asked David to stop going out with Sophie (it was pretty frequent) and he was horrible to her. That was before Sam and mad so much as a sniff at Ruth (I'm sure he only made an actual move after the row with David).

Of course it doesn't help that I don't like any of the Brookfield Archers very much (well except Ben as we know nothing about him now). Josh probably annoys me less but they are all very unlikeable.

"had made" not "and mad"!

Josh is a product of his upbringing so I can't hate him

I gues pip is too

The Brookfield parents are self absorbed and I guess that's what makes them so annoying!

We're R & D away for a fortnight?
I really didn't make the most of that.

C8H, who is saying Ruth must be lucky and grateful? The point is that she was banging on about how wonderful Brookfield is when she has repeatedly been quite prepared to walk away from it, on at least two occasions for ever. She's the one who's saying how lucky she is to live there.

And the Great Move was to a hefty extent driven by Ruth's conviction that they had to live near Heatherpet, even though that meant pushing Jill out of her home and making Josh and Ben move schools - in Josh's case in the middle of A levels - and tearing them away from all their friends.

I am confused about Josh's involvement in The Big Important Decision re the cows.

Sorry, I must have phrased it badly.
Pip had a decision about the cows: short term gain or play the long game (health of the herd)? She discussed it with Ed and Jill, and chose long-term.
Josh had a decision about TractorsRUs: short term gain or play the long game (look after family / keep promises)? He chose short term gain and left D&R abandoned at the airport. It's not the first time his ethics have been shaky - remember that business with Neil and the eggs.

They were hardly abandoned!

And tbh, if my parents treated me the way his do I would be tempted to abandon them at the airport!!

Picking up 2 able-bodied, comfortably-off adults, just off a short-haul flight, in the day time = short term gain (R & D aren't going to think that much of it).

Going to a business engagement as you build your network....well, I'd be inclined to see that as more of a long term investment myself!

TA annoys me intensely but I still have to listen
Can we please have this as the next thread title (and possibly all those following)?

" dumping on friends and family so you can go to a business engagement as you build your network....well, I'd be inclined to see that as more of a long term investment in myself!"

Well there's another compare & contrast. Josh at the start of his career with F&F but no money. Matt at the end of his career with money but no F&F.

Long term lurker here but Lillian is so infuriating,I've had to come out my closet to rant ! She is a 70 year old woman, with her own business, a large and supportive family, lots of friends , great social life and until this week , a secure home. Why on earth would she bother fannying about with either Justin or Matt, thus putting all her security at risk ? Particularly in light of being robbed by wretched Matt previously .This is the most ridiculous story line yet in over 45 years of my listening and I'm close to switching off.

The hit and run on Matt is increasingly starting to look like a replay of the AE Russian gangster storyline. It’s too over-dramatic for my taste. I like the idea of Lillian being torn because, as she said herself, she and Matt have a long history and she is all he’s got (he had her down as next of kin). I can’t be bothered to engage with Matt as a master criminal which necessitates guest appearances by people like Lillian’s chum Mina to explain the plot. Sam the cowman plot is an interesting comparison because that too was a moment of high drama at the time, but it had unfolded gradually as described by the previous poster with the unpronounceable name. It felt believable. This doesn’t - especially when the Hercules Poirot role in the Whodunnit is being played by Harrison - a man who couldn’t even track down Fallon’s stolen bunting.

I actually quite liked yesterday. I thought Lilian sounded more intelligent than usual. She was definitely following up on finding out what Matt has been up to.
I actually wonder how much of what Matt has been doing winding everyone up has been part of a huge magician's distraction. He wound up the Vets - so they haven't been spotting that he's bought some of the wrong horses. He distracted Lilian (and Justin) so they didn't keep tabs on him.
It vaguely reminds me of The Producers.
If it all comes out beautifully at the end - I will think it will be a real genius bit of scripting/playing the long game - and a tribute to Huw Kennair-Jones.

Josh's family behave rather shittily to him, doncha think, though? He is wise to build his own business when it's being made clear that it is his sister, not him, that features in his parents' vision of the future. He's got oomph, and resilience, despite receiving zero encouragement. David was even vile about Josh using the 'farm business computer' for his own work. Anyway, out of the audible Brookfielders, I like him the best (which is not saying much) and hope he succeeds!

However this plot comes out Huge Canoe can hardly be described as playing the long game. When you need random new voices to fill in the blanks for the listener then you know a plot is being rushed through quickly. That’s what Ambridge Extra used to be for. I was never much of a listener because imo that’s not really the point of TA. I agree with your rant thebelleofstmarys.

Does anyone au fait with the racing world know why somebody would buy a past its sell by horse for nefarious purposes?