Channel 4 undercover re Farage

[Ihateboris]

Oh dear...how's he going to explain this?
Https://www.channel4.com/news/exclusive-nigel-farage-filmed-undercover-celebrating-secret-new-foreign-donations

This discussion about authoritarian versus non authoritarian
It's a slightly sticky wicket. People associate authority with order and order is appealing.
Nigel shouting ' order' allies him with clever organised debate and - well- order. He's telling them- you are the parliament.
Most people including myself would choose order over chaos. A people regulated and in command of themselves over one which isn't.
But we know instinctively that order requires self command first and foremost.
And self command is built in the primary task of emotional health and relationships with children.
We see that played out on this site in how people talk about their parenting - where lack of regulation in kids is associated with a lack of authority- the authority that crushes bad behaviour. Some posters I'm convinced as infiltrators.
The hand that rocks the cradle etc.
One might ask what was missing or problematic in Robert Jenrick's rearing - for example- to display such extreme and avoidant reactions when confronted with that situation on TV.
But all these people are responsible for children and learners of some kind. Kids are seeing them as role models.
It's one big safeguarding issue as far as I can see.

Interesting re kids. Never thought of it before.

I can throw something into the pot though.

DP and I have a DD. And she and her cousin, who she is close to, are really the first generation from both our families that have not been subjected to violence at home. We are not in the UK, we are a cross cultural family, and the whole concept of not smacking kids ( or battering them as I was), does seem to be a world wide thing. And it's really a new thing.

Does this slot into your thinking?

Farage praised Bridge and his group’s efforts at a conference event on Saturday, telling him: “What your campaign has done is wake up vast parts of this country.”

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/sep/07/ryan-bridge-leader-raise-the-colours-flag-campaign-charged-offences

Well actually I was thinking more of the range of kind of techniques people use not just physical.
But now you say that and I've not thought much about it, my story is exactly like yours. I had older parents and physical chastisement was common. Except it only happened to boys in my family so not me. My kids have never been hit by parents.
Some things though in general children experience can be abusive without physical violence.
Taking down the cartoon characters off the wall, like the withdrawal of the ' right to childhood' That's pretty out there.
Some of the content created online and infiltrated into community groups. Also very abusive.
Apart from grooming gangs we have little concept of community based child abuse. Safeguarding is not well developed in this area. If it were big SM corporations would have evolved totally differently

I remember all the outrage when anti kid smacking laws were being brought in. Cries of "nanny state", the government have no right" and the usual " It never done me any harm".

Someone somewhere will have done/ will be doing a study into if it is connected to the rise of Reform etc. I think it is likely connected given the number of far right protest organizers with convictions for DV.

"What do you mean I am not allowed to slap the bairn ? How else is he supposed to learn ? This is shite. Those lefties have gone too far"

And I think that feeds back into what you posted earlier. Quote :"This discussion about authoritarian versus non authoritarian"

That is, they want to be authoritarian over someone, anyone. And their easiest target has effectively been taken out of their sights by law. I think I follow what you are getting at, and it makes sense to me.

@Ihateboris

What would Reform/Farage have to do to alter your vote?

A better question would have been,

What should the other parties be doing to attract more support rather than mud slinging?

How about not potentially breaking election law. And not having an ethics professor on the books as an advisor, who is advising dishonesty.

How about not potentially breaking election law. And not having an ethics professor on the books as an advisor, who is advising dishonesty.

If found guilty of those, how will that solve the issues that bothers UK citizens the most such as:

• the cost of living (90%)
• the NHS (80%)
• the economy (74%)
• international conflict (63%)
• crime (58%)
• immigration (56%)
• housing (54%)
• climate change & environment (54%)

Source:

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/wellbeing/bulletins/publicopinionsandsocialtrendsgreatbritain/april2026#important-issues-facing-the-uk

Does that mean that no politician should be investigated for rule breaking?

Boris Johnson did put her name forward but she was apparently ineligible as a sitting MP, along with two other Conservative MPs. The disappointment came as a surprise. The situation was never fully explained satisfactorily and many people believe Rishi Sunak could have intervened, or that his office kept quiet so the MPs did not have the opportunity to give up their seats in time, which of course would have forced by-elections.

Sunak later elevated one of the disappointed MP's, Alok Sharma, to the House of Lords in his outgoing list. I fully expect Nadine Dorries to be a Reform peer one day though - if Reform win a few dozen seats at the next general election it's going to be very difficult to deny them the opportunity to nominate a few life peers at least.

We also have one of the lowest ages of criminal responsibility in developed countries
At 10 we can expect police to take an interest.
And of course in reality ( because 10 year olds just aren't able to take that level of responsibility) what they get is tailored support, or no support because admitting the problematic behaviour is suddenly impossible. Politically Id be surprised if 10 is low enough for some of the worst adults And if course they would want the death penalty restored. Another adult obscenity for children to gaze on. It changes a lot if you change the viewpoint.

If we go back to your previous post, quote : "What should the other parties be doing to attract more support rather than mud slinging?"

It is interesting that you pivot to a public opinion survey and quote the results of that as some sort of evidence that possibly arresting the people this thread is about will achieve nothing.... while the people we are talking about have been accused of taking dodgy money to.... wait for it.... commission favorable polls to sway public opinion.

And on the ONS survey you linked, you failed to mention one result that scored high as an area of concern. This one

• Almost 4 in 5 adults (78%) reported being most concerned about the spread of misinformation, disinformation, and “fake news”; this makes it the most commonly reported issue when thinking about future elections in the UK.

I won't post a link for that. It is in your link in your post.

I am not saying the ONS survey is wrong in any way. Absolutely not. I think these things are great. Indeed, upthread you will see posts about the polling company Reform has used are in trouble with the pollsters governing body for breaking the rules. It is well regulated. Or maybe they are on another thread ? Sorry, can't remember.

But lets consider the " mudslinging" part of your post now. And we can choose immigration as the subject part of that. And I will add in a bit of Trump here too, because he and Farage do something in common on this.

They encourage illegal immigration when they are not in power.

They yell " OPEN BORDERS, FREE MONEY, 4* HOTELS, FREE HEALTH, FREE HOUSES, FREE PHONES".

And they do this while the actual Government in power have people in far off lands trying to get the message out that none of this is true. The actual government in power working to discourage it must feel like they are pissing into the wind with the sheer volume of misinformation being pumped out by the likes of Trump and Farage.

In other words, Farage and Trump spread disinformation designed to undermine the efforts the Government in power are making to tackle immigration. They want this immigration to happen, because they use it as the cause that they hope will propel them to power.

What newspaper articles will the people traffickers be showing to folk as they try to sell them a place on a lorry/boat ?

And of course, when Farage and Trump yell, OPEN BORDERS, FREE MONEY, 4* HOTELS, FREE HEALTH, FREE HOUSES, FREE PHONES", that also sways domestic public opinion too. We see it on this site. Where posters repeat and embellish the mistruths that are peddled to them. And people take to other social media to spread and amplify it.

So for sure, mudslinging goes on. And it is Farage and palls who are slinging it.

As an add. On the Dover and Portsmouth threads, many posters post links about immigration numbers being down. Because they are. And what is the reaction ? FAKE NEWS ! And who is it that peddles that concept ? Oh, that is Farage and Trump again.

Does that mean that no politician should be investigated for rule breaking

Laws apply equally to everyone. Point was that parties seem to spend more time point scoring rather than explaining how they will tackle issues that affect people.

• Almost 4 in 5 adults (78%) reported being most concerned about the spread of misinformation, disinformation, and “fake news”; this makes it the most commonly reported issue when thinking about future elections in the UK.

After watching the documentary Brexit-A very British civil war, this is believable. The US president at the time, Obama, was prompted by remain campaign to say the UK would be at the back of the queue for a trade deal with the US.

I don’t rate polls as reliable based on previous history, but some do. Recent polling shows Reform at the top of the pile. Is that due to the 78% now know that remain campaign was based on scaremongering, ie disinformation?

So, Farage should be investigated,.

Seems we are in agreement

Yes, we are all in agreement Farage should be investigated thoroughly for all the alleged rule breaking. We don't allow foreign donations.

Spot on @RedTagAlan . We saw the outcome in Ceuta , where would be migrants to Spain believed they would be allowed to settle. They all had Twitter messages saying so on their phones. Someone is going to a great deal of trouble and expense to subvert democracy and the rule of law throughout Europe

Farage is being investigated, but Reform remains top of the polls. A fact which likely irritates the other parties.

Also, don’t forget that Christopher Harbone has also made donations to the Conservative Party.

Except they are not top of the polls? They are below Labour and the Tories now. Because people can see Farage for exactly what he is.

The Conservatives declared the donation.

Goodness me. That's quite a deflection from what I said in my post. I did consider asking you something directly but I though my post laid out some pretty clear points, that you avoided. You went for the " but Obama" defense.

So question. Do you think Farage encourages or discourages boat migration when he says the UK has open borders, and that people arriving here get lots of free things, etc ?

On Polls. Yes, I know from other threads that you don't have much faith in polls. And frankly, now we know what we know about how Farage and Reform work to present "dodgy" polls that benefit them, and fund them in potentially illegal ways, I am not surprised.

Why do some people keep insisting that "Reform are top of the polls" like you have? Its absolutely not true, so is this genuine ignorance or deliberate spreading of misinformation 🤔

Labour is currently top of the polls. Get your facts right.

Yup. It was all over the Dover and Portsmouth threads. And they were corrected loads of times by other posters. But that is the "alternative facts" playbook. And when someone factchecks them, the factchecker is accused of being a " smug elite", or some other thing.

AND NOW, it turns out that reform have been caught commissioning dodgy polls... for their voters who don't believe in polls.

It's alternative facts all the way.

Polls vary. Some have Labour slightly ahead. Some have Reform ahead.

Not that it makes any difference due to the FPTP electoral system. Labour have 63% of seats even though they received 34% of the vote in 2024.

Reform received 14.3% and have 5 seats. Liberal Democrat’s received 12.2% and have 72 seats.

So, polls don’t mean anything.

So question. Do you think Farage encourages or discourages boat migration when he says the UK has open borders, and that people arriving here get lots of free things, etc ?

Farage neither encourages nor discourages boat arrivals as he is not in a position to control them.

However, it’s correct to say that those who arrive by boat receive free accommodation at the taxpayers expense. The last figure I remember was £6 million per day.