How can we manage financially as Universal Credit support reduces?

[elliejjtiny]

We have 5 dc aged between 19 and 11 all with disabilities. Dh was a manager up until youngest was born, then he became unwell and had to take a massive pay cut. I'm a Sahm and get carers allowance. We get UC. Dc1 in his first year at uni, dc2 about to start in September.

We are just about managing at the moment but barely. In September we are going to lose the child element of universal credit for dc2 and I'm worried how we are going to manage. When the dc were younger I thought I would be working by now but I'm only getting 4 hours sleep a night and my 11 year old needs constant supervision when not at school so I don't know how I could fit work in. Dh has to work away about 15 weekends a year (from friday morning until late Sunday night) which leaves me completely exhausted each time. We spend 9 weekends a year picking up/dropping off/visiting dc1 and I imagine spending the same amount of time with dc2. There is no childcare for children my dc age with SN and they have to be picked up and dropped off at school. The dc have appointments about once a week on average and dc4 stays in hospital about 1 night a year when I don't get any sleep at all.

Realistically I can't think of any employer who would employ me with the amount of time off I would need and on so little sleep. At the moment I spend the time dc are at school doing the housework, cooking the dinner and trying to catch up on a bit of sleep.

I'm trying to think of anywhere we could save money but I can't think of anything. Dc1 doesn't cost any less money while he is at uni.

Doesn’t matter whether they can get a job or not, the fact is the majority of the welfare bill is pension support. The rights and wrongs of whether we should spend so much on pensions don’t change the stats.

its not a borderline majority, the next biggest spend after pensions is UC which is around 28% of the bill, so just over half the pension amount.

Linking to a thread on Mumsnet doesn’t disprove the way welfare benefits work. UC for people who are able to work, is always more beneficial if you are working. The more you work, the more you have in your pocket becuase of the taper system. The old style of income support which had a 16 hour cliff edge is long defunct.

Are you aware that there are more ways of raising revenue than income tax? I think most people overestimate their contribution.

But ok. Let's look at it another way. Let's say we're all contributing a few pence each week towards child related benefits for larger families. (Difficult calculation because large families are uncommon and everyone pays different amounts of income tax so let's even it out.) What is the alternative? These families, though few, exist. Some need to rely on child related benefits to some extent or other. What happens if we withdraw our few pence? And would that outcome actually be more societally and economically costly than accepting that we have to pay taxes and some go to people or things of which we disapprove?

Pragmatism. Makes the world go round.

Here's the thing I find hard to understand.

DLA / Disability payments are made on the proviso that a child or adult requires more care than the equivalent age child/person.

Most people can only provide care to a few adults or children at a time.

So if your child has greater care needs, how can you manage to care for them with their significantly greater needs AND have a larger than average number of children as well?

It's like being a TA to 4 children who all need 1:1 - it shouldn't be possible.

So, it suggests that if your child has profound needs, which is why we pay you carers allowance, increased UC and DLA then it should be impossible for you to manage to care for (and indeed conceive, carry and give birth to) multiple other children - who you say also have medical or extra developmental needs.

OP gets 4 hours sleep a night. That is a sign she is struggling.

I just wanted to add a bit of positivity to the mostly negative and judgemental comments. I think that’s it’s fantastic that you have raised your two older DCs to a point where they are independent and able to attend University. Sounds like you are doing a fabulous and more than full time job being their Mumma!

I’m really saddened by some of the negative and judgemental comments on this post. Life can be hard and unexpected. People don’t plan to have children with disabilities, but they love them when they do. For certain disabilities, particularly autism and ADHD it can take years to diagnose and is rarely obvious at birth.

Being a parent carer is one of the hardest and most undervalued jobs out there. If you were to believe everything you read you get tonnes of benefits, free cars, blue badges and queue jumps at theme parks, but in reality there is very little support and funding out there.

Eh?

Why would it mean she’s unable to conceive, carry and birth children?

I have a disabled son, but he hasn’t disabled my uterus.

Don’t disagree with any of that, however you stated to PP that it was none of her business which is clearly not the case. If we disapprove of an issue we are well within our rights to say so without someone suggesting you have a hidden agenda (undertone) and are being a busybody!
yes there are many other ways of raising income, which most of us also pay but feel that we see very little in return for.

You must have been reading the thread very selectively, if that's really what you think.

What “return” would you like from my disabled child, for “your” expense on his needs?

I can send him round to cut the grass? He’d do a terrible job but we can try!

@ChunkyMonkey36 I'll clarify. When you're up all night caring for your children there should be less time for sex and less energy for it.

When you're utterly exhausted, caring for your multiple children with additional needs the last thing you are prepared to do is go through another pregnancy which will make your tiredness worse.

When you have multiple children who you care for, taking time off to go into hospital to give birth and recover is not usually possible, unless you have a lot of family support.

OK, I'll phrase it a bit more clearly for you, it's been a warm day after all. What I mean is, you're coming off like someone who doesn't mind helping those who are less fortunate provided you happen to approve of their life choices.

large families aren't few.

About 1.2m families in UK have more than 3 children. Around 45% of families with more than 3 children live in poverty. It's a huge number and entirely by choice. It costs us all billions. @ForWittyTealOP you wouldn't believe this, but a lot of us on this forum are net contributors, some paying 62% of marginal tax rate and it's entirely reasonable to be upset by being forced to support this.

I read OP's posting history. It's very sad - both she and her DP are ND and would struggle to exist on their own, so this was almost certain that their kids would be more severely ND. Yet they went for five kids. I suspect this was OP's "out of jail card", to focus on her family instead of having to work. If there were some family advisors helping people like this to understand the consequences of their choices.

Without DLA for kids OP's benefits are approx 34k pa, this is equivalent of 45k pa pre tax salary. She told this on another thread. With DLA it can easily be infamous 70k per tax salary.

ETA:
Are you aware that there are more ways of raising revenue than income tax? I think most people overestimate their contribution.
Well, OP in one year consumed almost all my income tax in that year. Do you want to tax me more to pay her more when her eldest doesn't bring benefit money in anymore?

DLA/PIP is to level the costs of a having disability. If the extra cost is needing an adapted car, walking aids, more expensive food (for example), why would that mean someone couldn’t care for multiple people using those aids? Not every disability means people require 24/7 hands on care and that they can’t do anything for themselves.

You can disagree of course. But it's like me disagreeing with David Beckham's tattoos. Futile and judgemental on my part. Nobody cares what I think of them and it's not going to change anything.

Who's going to look after them, then? OP has already told us There is no childcare for children my dc age with SN.

This thread just gets worse.

@willingtolearn

Sorry, that’s an intrusive and also bizarre take.

We don’t know that they don’t have family support for when she was in labour. We don’t know what support they had when the children were small.

We also don’t know what the children’s care needs were like at the time of her pregnancy.

7 years ago we had a toddler who slept terribly. We now have a 10 year old who still does. Let me tell you - it’s different. The tiredness of having a sleep disrupted toddler is common, most mums have felt it. Do that for another decade and then consider the exhaustion. But 2 years in, when OP maybe started initially considering her other children? Just usual mum tired.

Also - none of us here are the sex police. Keeping a relationship going with disabled children is hard, and requires a real effort from both parties to keep it going and maintain that stressful existence together. Sex, for some, is part of that. We are still allowed nice things, and meaningful relationships with our partners.

@HobGobblynne Disability Living Allowance (DLA) is a tax-free benefit to help with the extra costs of looking after a child (under 16) who has a disability, illness, or health condition and needs extra care, supervision, or has difficulty getting around

'Extra care, supervision'

The OP stated ASD and ADHD - they don't need aids and as for food - you have to feed them anyway as part of your parental responsibility - which the government helps you to do with child benefits and UC, plus free school meals, plus healthy food vouchers, plus school holiday additional grants.

It's not that they aren't allowed to shag.

It's more that when you are absolutely on your knees with tiredness, totally touched out from endless caring it's not usually a priority.

It is not anyone else's business though. Are the people who don't want their taxes going to OP now allowed to pass comment on her sex life now?
Wow.

We decided (after much soul searching!!) to terminate a surprise third pregnancy as it would have impacted the quality of life for our other two DC, even with both of us working full time. But I was basing that on the fact we pay for everything ourselves, with zero handouts or child benefit.

Baffling you decided to have five kids you can’t afford to pay for.

I might sound harsh. Maybe because I’d have loved to have a houseful of kids, but it wouldn’t have been affordable. We also don’t have pets as it would add complications and costs to our already busy lives. Maybe I should stop planning logistics and go with the flow and hope someone else pays for it 🤔

You’ll need to find night or weekend work to fit around when your husband is home with the kids.

Again as said by others - it is our business if we're paying for it.

Contraception is free.