How do you get back to sleep when ‘bad’ thoughts creep in?!

[Redlocks30]

I’ve always been a pretty good sleeper until Menopause but it’s shocking at the moment.

I’m on HRT and seeing the GP next week to look a increasing the dose but I just wondered if there’s anything I can try a 3am when I wake up, my brain IMMEDIATELY pings into stress mode about (real) awful things-bad health issues, parent dying, financial planning.

Things that I can sort of deal with (or push out of my mind) during the day, but make me spiral in the middle of the night-proper palpitations, dread, fear etc I literally go from fast asleep to, ‘ooh, what was it you are currently stressed about-oooh, yes, there it is!)

I try thinking of other things-listing boys names starting with each letter of the alphabet etc but my mind just meanders back to the bad things! It’s nothing I can do anything about-crap situations that have to be dealt with, unfair situations I can’t change, unfortunate decisions that we have to live with but it is ruining me. I feel dreadful in the days-it’s giving me headaches and my eyes hurt.

What can I actually do? The horrible stuff is ongoing and won’t go away-I just wish I could be like a Jilly Cooper character from the 70s where you take a Mogadon tablet and the world goes black till you wake up! (I’m presuming they were probably not a perfect solution, anyway…!)

I count backwards from 100 in time with breathing. If a bad night, I alternate between French, English and German on each exhale, e.g. cent, neun und neunzig, ninety eight, etc..... I find it requires just enough concentration to stop me thinking of anything else. Rarely get below seventy.

I read Mumsnet until I fall asleep!

Yes Spotify had a sleep timer. 15 mins is often long enough for me

Sleep time is the clock symbol

I take the second half of the nytol that I had earlier.

Yes by all means make sure your HRT is optimised. Sleep was one of my first symptoms to improve on HRT, thank god.

If I wake in the night with my brain humming I try to say the alphabet backwards, it’s just challenging enough to distract me and you can only do it maybe two or three times before it gets too easy, if you haven’t fallen asleep by then, try something else.

Snoozeband and podcasts for me too. My iPhone and the SB both have timers so I only listen for an hour, am usually out long before that.

I need a podcast to be the sort of thing I’d listen to at any time, not one of this deliberately boring sleep pod things, the best kind for me is like eavesdropping on a gentle, civilised, nerdy, ad-free, music-free conversation about history or feminism but everyone is different.

I keep some OTC (Sominex) sleeping tablets in my bedside table and occasionally take a half if I need help dropping off. They’re just antihistamines so they’re not addictive or dangerous but they only work for a few days so you can’t depend on them for long periods.

I don’t generally enjoy yoga but yin yoga can be good for sleep and tension. Sometimes if I’m all locked up and stiff I find a YouTube video and do that.

Calm App. Use one of their back to sleep meditations, or listen to a sleep story.

Cat calming music works on me and also my twin kittens that are another reason I’m a awake

I’m lucky that I have another bedroom free now ds has moved out, I take a book (not my phone) and read a couple of chapters until I feel really sleepy again. But I’m usually awake for about 90 minutes in total and it’s a pain in the arse.

antihistamines can really work but the strong ones give me an awful hangover. I ended up taking a quarter of a Phenargan occasionally but tend not to do it because I don’t think I’m safe to drive the morning after.

I either put on a podcast or try to slowly count back from 100 to 1 in my head. Your brain has to concentrate a little harder than counting forwards which means it blocks out the noise a little. I’ve never still been awake at 1.

Could you read for a bit?

I use a large silk eyemask, sounds weird but the slight pressure round my eyes means if i wake up with racing thoughts im more sleepy and less startled as im in total darkness.

I got mine from a company i saw on instagram called oloa wellbeing and like it, drowsy sell them too.

I also press my fingers into my palm pressure points and try to keep the room dark.

I had found that the minute I start spiraling, I get up and go to another room and do 15 minutes reading or soduku and then go back to bed. It was on
a programme a few years ago about insomnia and it said staying in bed is not at all helpful. Sounded mad, but it has really helped.

Try the Giles Brandreth Rosebuds podcasts. I cannot stay awake with it on. Something about his voice sends me straight to sleep!

Sounds lame but a mental list of all you are thankful for. A warm bed, safe kids, nice house etc. friends.
also if you can pop an earphone in and listen to radio 4. Nothing like Farming today to get you back to sleep as you hear about the European tomato crisis and the price of hay.

If I’m properly doing my head in with negative thoughts I’ll get up and have a herbal tea and find my cat for a cuddle. Maybe do wordle or puzzles until I’m ready to sleep again.

I get up and make myself a cup of tea. I usually fall asleep quickly then.

I use the Calm app and listen to sleep stories. They are read in a way to make you fall asleep. I particularly like old stories like Ann of Green gables, little women, Peter Pan.

Back to sleep meditations work for me, keep your body still, box breathing, and training your brain. The meditations help with that, learning to let your thoughts float away, acknowledging them but letting them pass by you for another time.

I do Archers characters in alphabetical order!

So first, if you haven’t already, try magnesium. I’m pretty sure it’s helped me through the 3am thing although of course I can’t prove it!

Second, make sure you aren’t hungry when you go to bed - cracker and a bit of cheese or similar not a terrible idea.

Third, some techniques for when you are awake. It’s miserable I know. I have a couple that usually work. basically you need something that’s sufficiently interesting to distract your brain from all the panic, but boring enough that it won’t keep you awake.

1. the alphabet game. Pick a category and work through the alphabet finding that category that starts with that letter - apple, banana, clementine etc.
2. tell yourself a story. I have a fairy story that I start telling myself that I’ve made up, it has a set opening that’s always the same and then usually I’m asleep before I get to a bit I haven’t done before, but i keep going if I am still awake. Happy to share mine if helpful (a princess has to choose how she will govern her country, there is fallout from diff choices)….
3. put on a semi-interesting podcast - rest is history is good for me for as they are interesting but not that interesting….if I’m really struggling I’ll do ‘in our time’ as it’s that bit more erudite so makes me drift off more.

Fourth, if nothing is working after 45 mins or so (try not to look at the clock but you will in the end) then get up, make a cup of tea or get a glass of water, go to the loo, maybe read for 10 mins, then turn off the light again and try one of the above or other ones you can find online.

I know others find journaling helpful (write it all down so your brain knows you’re dealing with it), that isn’t great for me as it wakes me up too much.

And if you aren’t on HRT, good reason to talk to the doc!

Hope some of this works for you.

I had a breast cancer scare a couple of years ago and had a similar experience during the two week wait - waking up at 3am with palpitations and sense of absolute dread.

Reading worked for me - I read until I fell back asleep. Audiobooks also helped, although I have a tendency to zone out and have to really concentrate on listening.

All those people making podcasts they think are fascinating and we use them for insomnia 🤣.
I'm well past menopause but the middle of the night waking for hours has never gone away.
Moving to the spare bed helps.
Ocean waves or rainfall sounds.
Word games.

I’m another who uses the Calm app. There’s a narrator called Eric Braa whose voice is like Father Christmas. I’ve no idea what the end of any of his sleep stories are because his voice sends me to sleep so quickly. It’s so soothing.

The Calm is well worth the money if you might use all the other features too.

I started typing when this had no responses and only just posted, sorry it will now seem I didn’t RTFT. Hope something works tonight!