Please or to access all these features

Conflict in the Middle East

US-Iran peace agreement discussion, part 4

1000 replies

RedTagAlan · 13/08/2026 11:40

Thread 4 for those following and commenting on the above subject.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
85
rainingsnoring · 12/09/2026 23:48

trumpredcard · 12/09/2026 09:43

Others might think that the widening of conflict in the ME is a problem for Trump while he might beg to differ.

His schedule for today. Huddled in talks with his advisers and gov't officials Watching the Irish Open after a cover story of meeting with the Irish President Connolly, who has criticised US foreign policy in the past, and the PM Martin, who is expected to press Trump on how he plans to end the conflict with Iran and what his objective is for the war.
I wouldn't mind being a fly on the wall at Farmleigh this morning.

I would like to have been a fly on the fall when he spoke to MBS the other day and declined to help him against the Houthis!

rainingsnoring · 12/09/2026 23:58

trumpredcard · 12/09/2026 21:39

I believe that any critical analysis of actions in the Iran War cannot be taken in isolation. This article is worth a read because Houthi Red Sea control has potential impact on the Iran war and asks the question of whether other countries including the UK could get drawn into the ME mess. Would SA even ask for help from its defense pact allies?

I'm dreading seeing a headline of 'Conflagration in the Middle East". The mention of Suez is ominous, and forecourt petrol is now £1.71+ per litre as we move into the cooler months. Christmas 2026 is setting up to be memorable for sure.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/gift/f02d7b70c589e5ce

...
At the very least, it is geared towards heightening disruption, spreading the perception that they can disrupt Red Sea transits at will. Intelligence is increasingly pointing to this latest round of strikes being directed by Iran as part of its wider strategy. As before, though, it doesn’t make a huge amount of difference who is directing whom here, and certainly not if you are a ship trying to sail past.
Now add in Hormuz, the entrance to the Gulf. With that strait effectively shut since March, the workaround for Gulf oil has been the East-West pipeline to Yanbu and out through the Red Sea. Flows through the Bab el-Mandeb rose from between four and five million barrels per day (mbpd) last year to over seven between March and July. Now the East-West pipeline appears to have been struck again, adding to the Houthi embargo and the seizure of Perim. The estimate for August and September is under 5mbpd. The two chokepoints are no longer separate problems. Squeeze one and traffic shifts to the other, where it can be squeezed again.
That is the wider lesson about chokepoints. They are cheap to threaten and expensive to keep open, and the tariff arrives in the form of raised shipping prices: the long way round the Cape and extra weeks on every voyage. Ships loading from Yanbu that would have gone southbound through the Bab el-Mandeb have, since the latest Houthi embargo was declared on July 20, been turning right and heading through Suez. Not only is that a huge detour, it increases the risk in Suez itself, which should never be forgotten.
...
A couple of EU Aspides warships are still patrolling the Bab-el-Mandeb as they have been all along, reassuring crews and occasionally escorting the more valuable ships. Will Saudi Arabia send warships this time, reflecting the increase in tension between it and the Houthis? It also looks like there are a couple of US destroyers further up the Red Sea, most likely stationed there to intercept anything fired at Israel or Jordan rather than to police the strait, for now

...
As for us, HMS Diamond performed excellently in the Red Sea against the Houthis. Her sister ship HMS Dragon – now in the region – could do the same. With Hormuz in stalemate but still deemed too high a risk for crewed ships to enter, Dragon could usefully head to the Bab-el-Mandeb and work alongside the Aspides warships.
Much will depend on what she is currently doing – she has been working with the French carrier group rather than the Americans – and on whether she needs to protect RFA Lyme Bay, mothership for the UK’s nascent mine-hunting drone force. The last open reporting had Dragon in Mombasa on Aug 11-12, RFA Lyme Bay likewise, so my guess would be they are currently in the Gulf of Oman or the wider Indian Ocean. Dragon could be in the Red Sea in a few days. It’s good to have options – something navies can do much better when at sea and fully worked up.
The real indicator to watch is the same one as in July. If this is about to seriously escalate, one of the two US carriers will start steaming
west. Given the stalemate in Hormuz, resuming strikes on Houthi launch positions might well be seen in Washington as an achievable win as the midterms approach.
Perim, then, is a small island of minor tactical importance in a narrow chokepoint. What its capture represents though is a pattern: one of escalation and continued chokepoint challenges – a trend I’d suggest we are only in the early stages of. All the world’s navies need to adjust accordingly, not just rely on the US.

It's all interconnected. Trump launched his war on Iran, with his Israeli friends, with absolutely no thought for the consequences. If various consequences were clear to lay people, without experienced advisers, they certainly should have been obvious to Trump. In his arrogance, he thought it would be Venezuela 2.

I've thought that this would continue to escalate for some time, since Trump abandoned the MOU. I suspect that Trump probably does not want an escalation but now sees no way out. @Newbutoldfather-Iran see this as existential and will not blink first. It is not existential to the US and it clearly never was.

OnePeppyFatball · 13/09/2026 14:31

Same old, same old.

The US president said he doesn’t care if Gulf countries meet with Iran on Monday to discuss the future of the Strait of Hormuz.
Speaking to reporters at his golf resort in Doonbeg, Ireland, Trump said it was “up to them” if they wanted to hold talks with senior Iranian officials about the strait.
The US president reiterated his claim that Iran “wants to make a deal so badly,” adding, also again, that the war would end either before or immediately after the midterm elections on November 3.

TopPocketFind · 13/09/2026 14:52

He is also blaming the diesel shortage on Zelenskyy

Trump: “Zelenskyy has to do one thing. He has to stop knocking out diesel fuel in Russia.

“He is causing a shortage of diesel.

“This isn’t done by the Middle East. This is done by what’s happening between Russia and Ukraine.”

RedTagAlan · 13/09/2026 15:18

TopPocketFind · 13/09/2026 14:52

He is also blaming the diesel shortage on Zelenskyy

Trump: “Zelenskyy has to do one thing. He has to stop knocking out diesel fuel in Russia.

“He is causing a shortage of diesel.

“This isn’t done by the Middle East. This is done by what’s happening between Russia and Ukraine.”

I think I saw that mentioned on a Reform thread a few days back. That it was Ukraine causing the shortage. I suspect it likely came from a right-wing press article then ?

Breitbart is blocked where I am but searching "breitbart news ukraine war causing diesel shortage" I get this, from CNBC, date sept 4th.

Diesel hits record high as Ukraine, Iran wars knock out refineries (cnbc.com)

"The price of diesel fuel hit a record Friday as the wars in Ukraine and Iran knock out refineries, triggering a global supply crunch.".

Top hit is this. Sept 4th.

The overlooked Russia-Ukraine war grows its outsized impact as U.S. diesel prices hit record high | Fortune

"The war in Ukraine has caused periodic oil disruptions in the Black and Caspian seas and to pipelines and terminals, but the biggest growing impact is Ukraine’s rising success targeting Russia’s refining network with long-distance drone attacks. An estimated 40% of Russia’s oil-refining infrastructure is now offline, and Russia has cut off its diesel exports—resulting in about 3% of daily, global diesel supplies removed from markets.
Combined with even bigger refining outages in the Middle East, and with China voluntarily mothballing some facilities because of its reduced oil imports, the situation has driven up the average price of diesel fuel in the U.S., reaching an all-time high of $5.85 per gallon on Friday, according to GasBuddy. Likewise, the average U.S. gasoline price—$4.14 for a gallon of regular unleaded—is the highest ever entering Labor Day weekend, breaking the previous 2012 record."

So not right wing news as the originator it seems ?

Looks like there is something to it. But Trump is being super selective on causes. He is missing that massive elephant stood right in front of him. Iran.

Of course, what has to be mentioned is that Trump again does not understand oil. Not all oils are equal. Nor are refineries. The market matches oils with refineries to get the cheapest production cost.

Diesel hits record high as Ukraine and Iran wars knock out refineries, fueling inflation worries

Higher prices come as Ukraine pounds Russian refineries, forcing Moscow to ban diesel exports.

https://www.cnbc.com/2026/09/04/diesel-price-record-high-ukraine-iran-inflation.html

OP posts:
Newbutoldfather · 13/09/2026 15:27

@TopPocketFind ,

‘He is causing a shortage of diesel’.

Well, he has a point. Knocking out diesel does contribute to a diesel shortage.

However, Ukraine is fighting an existential war and that means defeating Russia in any way he can.

RedTagAlan · 13/09/2026 16:13

Newbutoldfather · 13/09/2026 15:27

@TopPocketFind ,

‘He is causing a shortage of diesel’.

Well, he has a point. Knocking out diesel does contribute to a diesel shortage.

However, Ukraine is fighting an existential war and that means defeating Russia in any way he can.

Yes. But what Trump does not seem to understand is it is a world priced commodity. There might not be a shortage, but less supply means higher prices.

Trump seems to think US oil into US refineries means he can control the cost. But he can't, because it is global.

OP posts:
trumpredcard · 14/09/2026 00:58

The GCC countries are trying to resolve the Hormuz crisis but the enormous fly in the ointment remains the US. Iran can understandably argue that the funds to rebuild infrastructure etc damaged by the US has to come from somewhere, but current sanctions mean their only alternative is to charge a fee for vessels using their deep water routes through Hormuz.

Talks offer limited relief
Iranian officials are expected to meet Gulf Arab representatives in Oman to present an agreement concerning shipping routes through the Strait.
Reports said the proposed arrangement could establish temporary lanes for commercial vessels.
However, Tehran has indicated that it will not fully reopen the waterway unless the US accepts several conditions, including demands linked to Iran’s control of the strait.
Washington rejects any arrangement that would recognize Iranian authority to impose fees on international shipping, according to reporting cited by regional media.
US Energy Secretary Chris Wright cautioned traders against assuming that the talks would quickly resolve the crisis.
He said alternative routes were currently carrying about 10 million barrels of crude and oil products a day, helping prevent an immediate global supply shock but leaving markets vulnerable to further attacks.
That uncertainty helps explain Monday’s price movement. Traders took profits after oil’s steep rally, while continuing to price in a significant geopolitical risk premium.
Gulf News

BelleHathor · 14/09/2026 01:29

trumpredcard · 14/09/2026 00:58

The GCC countries are trying to resolve the Hormuz crisis but the enormous fly in the ointment remains the US. Iran can understandably argue that the funds to rebuild infrastructure etc damaged by the US has to come from somewhere, but current sanctions mean their only alternative is to charge a fee for vessels using their deep water routes through Hormuz.

Talks offer limited relief
Iranian officials are expected to meet Gulf Arab representatives in Oman to present an agreement concerning shipping routes through the Strait.
Reports said the proposed arrangement could establish temporary lanes for commercial vessels.
However, Tehran has indicated that it will not fully reopen the waterway unless the US accepts several conditions, including demands linked to Iran’s control of the strait.
Washington rejects any arrangement that would recognize Iranian authority to impose fees on international shipping, according to reporting cited by regional media.
US Energy Secretary Chris Wright cautioned traders against assuming that the talks would quickly resolve the crisis.
He said alternative routes were currently carrying about 10 million barrels of crude and oil products a day, helping prevent an immediate global supply shock but leaving markets vulnerable to further attacks.
That uncertainty helps explain Monday’s price movement. Traders took profits after oil’s steep rally, while continuing to price in a significant geopolitical risk premium.
Gulf News

Afraid Oman have announced that the talks have been postponed:
"Sept 13 (Reuters) - A meeting in Oman between Gulf countries and Iran to discuss possible agreements on the Strait of Hormuz, which had been scheduled for Monday, has been postponed, Omani Foreign Minister Badr Albusaidi said on X on Sunday."

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/oman-meeting-between-gulf-states-iran-postponed-omani-foreign-minister-says-2026-09-13/

In other news, the price of Diesel has hit the highest cost ever (Yay Trump! He does love being the first):
https://www.nbcnews.com/business/energy/diesel-record-price-trump-inflation-rcna596843

"The nationwide average price of diesel hit $6 per gallon Friday for the first time, an ominous record for the fuel that powers much of the U.S. economy.
The price was $6.05 as of Friday morning, according to data from motor club AAA. The national average price of regular gas was $4.29, up 15 cents since last week."

There are also protests going on in Syria right now due to a 40% increase in energy prices:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/protests-erupt-in-syria-over-fuel-price-increases/

"Protests have broken out in different parts of Syria over increased fuel prices, with demonstrators blocking a main highway in Idlib province for several hours.

The government announced what it said were temporary price increases for gasoline, diesel and other petroleum products earlier today, citing rising global fuel prices as a result of the US-Iran war. The price of gasoline increased by about 30% and diesel by 40%.

Syrian Energy Minister Mohammed al-Bashir said yesterday that Syria is producing about 102,000 barrels of oil per day, while it needs about 325,000 barrels per day for domestic consumption and is relying on imports to make up the difference."

Diesel’s new high of $6 per gallon will make ‘just about everything’ more expensive

“We are endangering one of the strongest economic pillars that we have in this country,” said fourth-generation Iowa farmer Mark Mueller.

https://www.nbcnews.com/business/energy/diesel-record-price-trump-inflation-rcna596843

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 07:16

Reuters:
“The Houthi capture of Yemen's Red Sea coastline is reshaping the balance of power in the Gulf, strengthening Iran's hand and confronting Saudi Arabia and its neighbours with a difficult choice: absorb mounting costs or seek accommodation with Tehran.
By securing a position overlooking Bab el-Mandeb, one of the world's most important shipping arteries, the Iran-aligned group has opened a second pressure point, threatening the Saudi oil exports diverted from the Strait of Hormuz.
The calculation, according to regional officials and analysts, is straightforward: by threatening Red Sea shipping while Iran chokes off Hormuz, Tehran and the Houthis can raise oil prices and fuel inflation while narrowing the region's prospects of relying on Washington to resolve the crisis.
The strategy, they say, is designed to force a stark choice on Gulf states: put up with growing economic pain from the squeeze on their oil exports and Iranian strikes or engage with Iran to protect trade, energy flows and economic stability.
"The Houthi capture of strategic islands near Bab el-Mandeb is a game changer," said Middle East analyst Fawaz Gerges. "It changes the balance of power and gives them far greater geopolitical and geoeconomic leverage over Saudi Arabia, the Gulf, the United States and global trade."
“Riyadh rerouted much of its crude through Red Sea ports since the war effectively closed the Strait on the opposite side of the Arabian Peninsula, but on Friday it closed the pipeline that carried the oil after it came under attack.
Trump's reported refusal to agree to a Saudi request for the U.S. to strike the Houthis, combined with mounting economic costs, is reinforcing a view in some Gulf capitals that negotiations with Tehran are no longer a choice but a necessity for self-preservation, regional sources told Reuters.
A meeting in Oman on Monday between Gulf Arab foreign ministers and their Iranian counterpart, Abbas Araqchi, to discuss a possible arrangement on the Strait of Hormuz has been postponed due to disagreements over the terms of the talks, a Gulf source told Reuters.
The gathering was part of an Omani and Iranian push to secure a temporary framework for managing shipping through the waterway, a critical artery for global oil exports.”
“Omani Foreign Minister Badr Albusaidi said the regional meeting scheduled for Monday in Salalah had been postponed "in the interests of consensus."
"We remain committed to fostering dialogue that supports stability and lasting co-operation in our region," he wrote on X, without elaborating on the reasons for the delay.
Iranian President Masoud Pezeshkian said on Sunday he had held good talks with UAE Crown Prince Sheikh Khaled bin Mohamed bin Zayed Al Nahyan in New Delhi on the sidelines of the BRICS leaders' summit.
"We agreed to put the past aside and look forward to the future, and how we can build a future together," he said.”
“The dilemma for the Gulf states is that geography is immutable. Decades of confrontation have failed to alter a simple reality: Iran's position alongside the region's energy and trade arteries makes it an unavoidable player in any Gulf security equation.
Whatever Gulf leaders think of the Islamic Republic, it remains a reality they cannot bypass or simply wish away and the conflict triggered by U.S. and Israeli attacks on Iran has blown apart decades of diplomatic efforts to contain it.
Asked on Sunday if he was concerned about the Gulf states meeting with Iran, U.S. President Donald Trump said that was up to them.”
“Alex Vatanka of the Middle East Institute said the question for Gulf states may increasingly be less whether they trust Iran than how to protect their interests and survive hostilities Washington cannot quickly end.
That could push them towards parallel diplomacy with Tehran and, over time, a broader security strategy less dependent on the United States alone.
"The Gulf states are contemplating the basic reality that they might have to cut a deal with the Iranians on their own, regardless of whether they hurt American feelings or not, because America can't get them out of this quagmire," he said.
The flareup revives a struggle that long predates the U.S.-Iran conflict. The Houthis, drawn from Yemen's Zaydi Shi'ite minority, fought a series of wars with Saudi Arabia before seizing Sanaa in 2014, prompting a Saudi-led intervention the following year.”
“Despite years of air strikes and cross-border warfare, they survived, expanded their capabilities and emerged as one of Iran's most effective regional allies.
The Houthis are pursuing their own longstanding conflict with Riyadh while exploiting a position that gives them leverage far beyond Yemen's borders to create growing value for Tehran.
"The Houthis are not traditional proxies," said former U.S. negotiator Aaron David Miller. "They can weaponise geography and have a dramatic impact on the international economy and on the global oil economy."
One regional official said the Houthi advance was the latest step in a careful strategy by Tehran.
"For Iran, this is a chess game. They plan what comes next. They don't push all their buttons at the same time out of panic," the regional official said.”
"The Houthis are the only proxy Iranian ally with formidable operational capabilities left."
Washington's economic squeeze on Iran is having an impact, but the unintended consequence, according to a Gulf source, is that it is squeezing America's Gulf partners into reconsidering whether confrontation with Tehran is sustainable.

Excerpt From
“Houthis' Yemen advance leaves Gulf states with uncomfortable choice”
Samia Nakhoul
Reuters
https://apple.news/A9TOoxFnUQ_KVIXtRjNMeOA
This material may be protected by copyright.

Houthis' Yemen advance leaves Gulf states with uncomfortable choice — Reuters

The Houthi capture of Yemen's Red Sea coastline is reshaping the balance of power in the Gulf, strengthening Iran's hand and confronting Saudi Arabia and its neighbours with a difficult choice: absorb mounting costs ​or seek accommodation with Tehran.

https://apple.news/A9TOoxFnUQ_KVIXtRjNMeOA

Twiglets1 · 14/09/2026 07:31

The foreign minister of Oman, Badr Albusaidi, said on X yesterday that the meeting had been postponed “in the interests of consensus".

Iran and Oman agreed to postpone the talks “at the request of some regional countries,” said Mohammad Ali Bak, an official in Iran’s foreign ministry.

Newbutoldfather · 14/09/2026 07:33

That is really interesting.

I think the situation is far more open than that article implies, though. America could easily change their mind and, together with the Saudis, drive the Houthis back.

Also, if Iran pushes their hand too far, I am sure Israel would help the Gulf States out. It would be an uneasy alliance, but pre Gaza, there was a rapprochement between them, which is still just about holding up.

There are certainly shifting tectonic plates in the Middle East.

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 08:06

I doubt the Gulf states would look to Israel to help them out. Surely they hold them partly responsible for the mess that they now find themselves in. Along with the US.

Newbutoldfather · 14/09/2026 08:10

@OnePeppyFatball ,

But they are caught between a rock and a hard place. I am sure they hate the war but, equally, don’t want to cede effective control of all oil exports to Iran and her proxies.

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 08:16

Geography remains the same though. They are neighbours. Going to have to find some compromise with Iran if they like it or not.

Newbutoldfather · 14/09/2026 08:19

@OnePeppyFatball ,

But where’s the compromise? Bearing in mind it has to be acceptable to Israel and the U.S, at least to the point of not being attacked.

Ultimately, Iran also has to live with its neighbours and strangling Saudi Arabia is not very neighbourly.

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 08:25

Much depends on which version you choose to believe. How many times has Bibi claimed Iran was going to attack Israel? How many times did that happen? Who attacked who first? When Iran were already at the negotiating table. Twice.

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 08:26

And it’s not Iran attacking Saudi at the moment.

Twiglets1 · 14/09/2026 08:28

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 08:25

Much depends on which version you choose to believe. How many times has Bibi claimed Iran was going to attack Israel? How many times did that happen? Who attacked who first? When Iran were already at the negotiating table. Twice.

Iran has attacked Israel several times via its proxies.

Hamas attacked Israel first on 7/10/23. The 2 sides weren’t at war at the time although of course it triggered a war.

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 08:28

We are talking about Iran Twigs, not Hamas…..

Twiglets1 · 14/09/2026 09:57

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 08:28

We are talking about Iran Twigs, not Hamas…..

Don't you know that Hamas is a proxy of Iran?

Hamas would not have been able to plan or execute 7/10/23 without years of Iranian training, weapons, and funding to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars.

Twiglets1 · 14/09/2026 10:10

OnePeppyFatball · 14/09/2026 08:26

And it’s not Iran attacking Saudi at the moment.

But Iran also provides military, financial, and logistical support to the Houthis so once again they are culpable.

Twiglets1 · 14/09/2026 10:13

Houthis claim attack on another Saudi airbase
Yemen’s Houthis have claimed an attack on Saudi Arabia’s Khamis Mushait air base.

South Korea's foreign ministry on Monday condemned what it said was a Houthi attack on civilian and economic facilities in southern Saudi Arabia that injured multiple civilians, and urged the Iran-aligned group to immediately stop such attacks.
The ministry said in a statement that attacks on civilians, civilian facilities and actions that undermined free and safe navigation could not be justified under any circumstances, and expressed solidarity with Saudi Arabia.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/iran-us-war-live-trump-oil-hormuz-saudi-houthis-b3049597.html

Twiglets1 · 14/09/2026 10:17

Today's meeting cancelled at the request of Saudi Arabia, according to Esmail Baqaei.

Twiglets1 · 14/09/2026 10:17

End of thread.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is not accepting new messages.
Swipe left for the next trending thread