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Conflict in the Middle East
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8
Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:03

Twiglets1 · 31/08/2025 06:37

The Israel supporters seem very well read to me. It’s more some of the other side that appear to rely heavily on X & AI. They are the ones that should look at a wider range of sources, ideally ones not affected by algorithms.

I don’t think any of us doubt the severity of what is happening Gaza. The dispute is only about who we primarily blame for it - Hamas or the Israel government/IDF.

I have never posted any Ai,

@Twiglets1 was it not yourself that posted information from a fake far right funded fact checking website to mumsnet called “Influencer watch”

Please no derailing the thread it is very disrespectful of

OP posts:
Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:04

That should say Influence watch

OP posts:
Twiglets1 · 31/08/2025 09:05

mids2019 · 31/08/2025 08:56

It's a double whammy for Palestian women, to be both in a war zone and to be subject to a misogynist society. It just seems pregnancy deferral is not an option for some women and I think it is legitimate to look at a culture that seems to view women as purely child bearing vessels and pressured into pregnancy at a time which is far from optimal.

Agreed.

Twiglets1 · 31/08/2025 09:07

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:03

I have never posted any Ai,

@Twiglets1 was it not yourself that posted information from a fake far right funded fact checking website to mumsnet called “Influencer watch”

Please no derailing the thread it is very disrespectful of

It’s not all about you @Everexpanding

My comment was a general one not aimed at individuals.

And if people ask questions or respond to our posts in such a way that we feel we need to give a response, that’s hardly derailing.

PurpleSocks37 · 31/08/2025 09:09

mids2019 · 30/08/2025 13:37

Why would you choose to become pregnant in the last months in Gaza? Is it wrong saying that there is choice in childbirth and family size? I worry about a culture where women are becoming pregnant in a horrific war zone and what patriarchal pressures are being placed on them? Maybe Hamas are pleased because these poor women and children can add to their propaganda campaign?

I don't think they have enough resources to have contraception.

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:12

@Twiglets1 have you apologised even slightly for the misinformation you posted from a fake far right run website
i

OP posts:
mids2019 · 31/08/2025 09:12

It's not just about contraception, it's about a woman's ability to refuse a partner wanting sex when it is known that it would result in pregnancy in a war zone. There are means of intimacy that don't necessarily result in pregnancy.

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:13

@Twiglets1 who is we?? Have you a little team deliberately derailing this thread

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PollyBell · 31/08/2025 09:17

How long has thexwar been going? Why on earth get pregnant in the first place and I dont care what people label this if you are living in a war zone or other bad environment no matter where in the world, yes including uk, there is absolutely no way you care about children to get pregnant it about what adults want not what is best for children

Twiglets1 · 31/08/2025 09:18

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:12

@Twiglets1 have you apologised even slightly for the misinformation you posted from a fake far right run website
i

Now you are derailing your own thread by trying to pick an argument with someone which does remind me of another user also on the pro Pal side.

It’s not misinformation to quote from a source others find weak. If it was we would be accusing dozens of people of doing it, but we digress.

Twiglets1 · 31/08/2025 09:19

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:13

@Twiglets1 who is we?? Have you a little team deliberately derailing this thread

Yes I am the Taskmaster (not!)

SharonEllis · 31/08/2025 09:22

Mercurial123 · 31/08/2025 09:02

It's easy enough to work out yourself. I have zero interest in sending you a PM.

Ok. I can only assume that you were supporting my point as that is what your quote was doing. Thanks, it was interesting and I'll follow up the reference.

SharonEllis · 31/08/2025 09:27

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:03

I have never posted any Ai,

@Twiglets1 was it not yourself that posted information from a fake far right funded fact checking website to mumsnet called “Influencer watch”

Please no derailing the thread it is very disrespectful of

Oh stop telling people how to post on a thread. You have actively particpated in the so-called derailing by asking posters questions, which they of course answer, and posting inflammatory posts. First its hasbsra, now a co-ordinated strategy by someone who has barely posted on this thread. You could just engage in a conversation about the predicament of Palestinian women but you seem determined to turn it into an argument.

SmallChild · 31/08/2025 09:28

Why do none of the neighbouring Arab countries offer to help them?

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:29

Twiglets1 · 31/08/2025 09:19

Yes I am the Taskmaster (not!)

Well thanks to your little team this thread is still active and hopefully some people may read about the conditions of pregnant Palestinian women and actually want to help.
not blame the women for getting pregnant rather than Israel for dropping bombs on their homes, starving them and blocking medical supplies

OP posts:
Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:31

No I do not want an argument you have deliberately distracted from the point of this thread

OP posts:
Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 09:40

Sorry for repost

The point of this thread was to highlight the dire situation of pregnant Palestinian women
and to discuss any possible way mumsnetters as fellow women and mothers could help to alleviate their suffering.
I asked politely numerous times that it not be derailed so to get it back on track please see below a description of what Gazan women are experiencing
“Sometimes Israeli military action and displacement mean that women are giving birth in their tents or shelters with no medical help.
"If mothers are lucky enough to come to the hospitals to deliver their babies, women who give birth vaginally are typically being sent home three to four hours afterwards," says Sandra Adler Killen, an American registered emergency and paediatric nurse, who recently worked at the hospital in Gaza.
"Women who have had surgical C-sections [Caesareans] are discharged after 24 hours," she said.
"They're discharged to their homes quite often with babies who have conditions and various issues that in normal circumstances we would have stay at the hospital to get more support.
"Most babies, outside of Gaza, born under 32 weeks, under 1,400g (3.1lb), they would be in the NICU [neo-natal intensive care unit]. These babies are sent home. There's just no space for them
any suggestions for actions welcome. Any hasbara or racist talking points are not

OP posts:
SharonEllis · 31/08/2025 09:48

@Everexpanding why are you repeating your accusation that people are being racist and involved in spreading Israeli government propaganda?

GladioliGreen · 31/08/2025 10:42

PollyBell · 31/08/2025 09:17

How long has thexwar been going? Why on earth get pregnant in the first place and I dont care what people label this if you are living in a war zone or other bad environment no matter where in the world, yes including uk, there is absolutely no way you care about children to get pregnant it about what adults want not what is best for children

What should we be outraged by here, women being pregnant or pregnant women being purposefully starved? One is a war crime, the other is people seeking comfort in each other when they have no idea if they will make it to the next hour never mind the next day.

If I were living in the most dangerous place on earth you bet I would be keeping my children close, keeping my husband close(and yes that would involve intimacy) seeing my extended family as often as I could because what else is there?

The problem is not pregnant women, the problem is the government that has openly expressed their wish to ethnically cleanse these women and their babies and are actively starving them.

SharonEllis · 31/08/2025 10:57

GladioliGreen · 31/08/2025 10:42

What should we be outraged by here, women being pregnant or pregnant women being purposefully starved? One is a war crime, the other is people seeking comfort in each other when they have no idea if they will make it to the next hour never mind the next day.

If I were living in the most dangerous place on earth you bet I would be keeping my children close, keeping my husband close(and yes that would involve intimacy) seeing my extended family as often as I could because what else is there?

The problem is not pregnant women, the problem is the government that has openly expressed their wish to ethnically cleanse these women and their babies and are actively starving them.

I think the point is that there are lots of problems and most people are capable of being outraged by more than one thing at once. Everyone has acknowledged that its a terrible situation. Nobody is disputing that. Its appalling.

I don't think anyone has expressed outrage that women are pregnant. What is strange is the outrage expressed when people have explored why women in this situation are pregnant. How could anyone who ares about women and babies not be interested in exploring that? If you're not interested that is actually ok, but to accuse people of thinking it is worth exploring of being shameful, disgusting, racist? Really? On a parenting site?

And I will never apologise for thinking women shouldn't be coerced into sex. It is a well documented fact that it happens in all conflict. There is nothing wrong or racist in pointing out that it will have happened in this conflict and anyone who claims it must not be spoken of is doing Palestinian women a disservice.

GladioliGreen · 31/08/2025 11:08

SharonEllis · 31/08/2025 10:57

I think the point is that there are lots of problems and most people are capable of being outraged by more than one thing at once. Everyone has acknowledged that its a terrible situation. Nobody is disputing that. Its appalling.

I don't think anyone has expressed outrage that women are pregnant. What is strange is the outrage expressed when people have explored why women in this situation are pregnant. How could anyone who ares about women and babies not be interested in exploring that? If you're not interested that is actually ok, but to accuse people of thinking it is worth exploring of being shameful, disgusting, racist? Really? On a parenting site?

And I will never apologise for thinking women shouldn't be coerced into sex. It is a well documented fact that it happens in all conflict. There is nothing wrong or racist in pointing out that it will have happened in this conflict and anyone who claims it must not be spoken of is doing Palestinian women a disservice.

And something that could solve the problem of starving pregnant women as per the thread is Israel letting aid agencies do what they are trained to do and feed people without arbitrary restrictions. Why are people not calling for this fix that could be implemented tomorrow?

All of this talking in circles whilst a government is purposefully starving these vulnerable women. Call for harsh sanctions on the government starving these women and wishing for their cleansing, end this now then chat about whether or not you think women should be pregnant in a war zone rather than doing it whilst watching them suffer.

SharonEllis · 31/08/2025 11:15

GladioliGreen · 31/08/2025 11:08

And something that could solve the problem of starving pregnant women as per the thread is Israel letting aid agencies do what they are trained to do and feed people without arbitrary restrictions. Why are people not calling for this fix that could be implemented tomorrow?

All of this talking in circles whilst a government is purposefully starving these vulnerable women. Call for harsh sanctions on the government starving these women and wishing for their cleansing, end this now then chat about whether or not you think women should be pregnant in a war zone rather than doing it whilst watching them suffer.

I agree that letting in more aid is essential and that aid should be targetted at the most vulnerable. I've not seen anyone on this thread say otherwise.

As for your second paragraph, I'm afraid its not for you to determine what others should believe or do, and in what order. If someone doesn't want a discussion I'd suggest maybe a discussion board isnt the right place to post.

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 11:17

@SharonEllis yes if Gazan women have in some instances been raped that is truly appalling as I assured you earlier I think you will not find anyone sympathetic to rape on mumsnet, your insistence on concentrating on this hypothetical situation is deflecting from discussion of Gazan women’s current appalling situation and what can be done by fellow mothers to alleviate it. I write letters to politicians, donate but it really does not seem enough. I do not want pregnant women or any innocent civilians to be starved, mercilessly bombed while living in tents, or be denied pain relief or medical support because of Israel’s barbaric blockade

OP posts:
SharonEllis · 31/08/2025 11:23

Everexpanding · 31/08/2025 11:17

@SharonEllis yes if Gazan women have in some instances been raped that is truly appalling as I assured you earlier I think you will not find anyone sympathetic to rape on mumsnet, your insistence on concentrating on this hypothetical situation is deflecting from discussion of Gazan women’s current appalling situation and what can be done by fellow mothers to alleviate it. I write letters to politicians, donate but it really does not seem enough. I do not want pregnant women or any innocent civilians to be starved, mercilessly bombed while living in tents, or be denied pain relief or medical support because of Israel’s barbaric blockade

I wasn't concentrating on it. I was merely responding to the extraordinary pushback and the nasty personal attacks. If you now acknowledge that it will have happened will you know retract your comments calling me and others racist and spreading Israeli government propaganda?

Hamiltonfan · 31/08/2025 11:26

One problem is there are women like the one in this video who don't see their babies as humans but as martyrs to sacrifice for Hamas. How on earth do we rationalise this? x.com/EYakoby/status/1961830411178242444?t=AV0IvgKCJ_lKuZqeqr1W9Q&s=09

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