Teacher - monitoring son

[Fedup83]

DS 4 has behavioural issues at school.

We've supported the school over and above what I feel could be expected and as requested took DS to the GP to talk about his behaviour.

The GP read the letter produced by the school (much of it we thought ludicrous) and dismissed it saying he could see no medical reasons for his behaviour other than him being bright and perhaps bored.

Dutifully we pushed for a referral (even though neither GP or DH in fact saw fit).

We've taken it all the way to the consultant and after a very stressful time over six months worrying about it after a second session have been totally discharged. No interventions. No medical issues. This despite a rather intense and quite upsetting 'report' being written by the teacher.

Now we feel the teacher (who insisted on having her say about DS to the consultant in said report) can't let things lie and deal with any behaviour in class.

Behaviour includes pushing and shoving and snatching: and "some" of the incidents are through antagonisation. His behaviour at home can be challenging at times - but has markedly improved over the last six months. Which four year old boy isn't a challenge at times?

She keeps a 'note' of his behaviour in lessons - is this even allowed?

Now we've supported and supported I now feel like the poor kid (who has no medical issue) is being unnecessarily monitored.

I'm absolutely sick now. Advice welcomed.

Has there been any word/intervention from tg deputy/head teacher?

You say the incidents involve shoving, pushing and snatching. Is this the only type of unacceptable behaviour reported? Is it daily/weekly?

You have my sympathy because I know exactly how you feel. I also have a son (9) who has had behavioural incidents at school since he started in Reception. He can have lengthy periods of being well-behaved, but generally at the start and end of each year his behaviour will deteriorate. He was finally diagnosed with High Functioning Autism when he was almost 9. This has made a world of difference for my son because now he is no longer just perceived as a 'naughty boy' by school and they try to help and understand his needs and not just punish him. We are currently in the process of applying for an EHCP which will mean he has more support in class. It took many years to reach this diagnosis, when he was assessed at age 5 he was discharged like your son with no medical issues. At that stage I was pleased because I wasn't ready to accept that my little boy was 'different'.

I continued to work with the school regarding his behaviour by making sure I reinforced discipline at home, but as he grew I knew that he was finding it hard to cope in school, especially during those transitional periods. I do not know your son so I am not suggesting that he has any additional needs at all, I'm just sharing my experience.

The best piece of advice I would give you is to keep a good relationship with the school and his class teacher. Keeping reassuring them that you are doing all you can to support them with his behaviour, share what works at home and keep the communication lines open. The teacher has no reason to lie to you, if he is pushing etc in school then they have a duty of care to deal with that (other parents complain) and you must support them with this. It is perfectly normal for a teacher to keep a record of any behavioural incidents, my child's school do, but like I said you have my sympathy as it is horrible for parents to read this. Best wishes x

She keeps a 'note' of his behaviour in lessons - is this even allowed

Yes, of course it is!

I'm meant to add that my G.P, and D.H also saw no need to refer/diagnose him because his differences are only really a problem in school. Obviously he has issues at home but we can deal with those quite easily, school is a completely different environment and my son's behaviour is VERY different there, especially when he has a new teacher and during unstructured times (like break, lunch and Golden Time). Many children (not just those with learning difficulties) find it hard to behave in school, especially when they are as young as 4. Good Luck x

OF COURSE THE TEACHER CAN MONITOR AND LOG HIS BEHAVIOUR!
What a silly question.

How old is he? Pushing and shoving and snatching at aged 4 is very different to aged 10...

I think you need to take a step back and think about the fact your son is one of possibly 30 other children that this person has to teach. And if he is disrupting classes, and disobeying, the teacher is within their rights to ask for more support.

How can you dismiss the report as ludicrous?

Ah, so he is four.

See, some of his behaviours seem very normal for a four year old. There has to be something that one of you isn't saying...

As above poster says, I was also going to say that it is quite normal for teachers to keep note of pupil's behaviour. This is important so that she/he can feedback to the parent of said child plus explain to any parents of the other children what happened when they got pushed/shoved.

If these are ongoing, albeit small incidents, then the teacher has a duty to bring these to the attention of phase leader/deputy or headteacher as there is a duty of care to all children and any repetitive unacceptable behaviour needs to be addressed.

I think most people would agree that repeated unacceptable behaviour needs to noted down and at the very least fedback to the parents. I would want to know if my child had been pushing/shoving other children (beyond a one off/accident obviously).

These type of people do irritate me. Some kids are good, some are naughty it doesn't ALWAYS mean they have SN or crap parents. I would have a long chat with the teacher and try to be really nice as much as you don't want to and thank her for taking such an interest in trying to tackle your son's behaviour issues. Tell her the type of things you face at home and what works for you guys. Maybe once she sees that you are trying to work with her, she'll co-operate more

As this has been dragging on for at least 6 months, I assume that concerns were initially raised by his nursery/pre-school and that the behaviour issues have now continued since he moved into Reception this September? Or has he only just turned 4 in the last couple of months and is not due to start school until next September.
I'm just trying to understand if concerns about his behaviour have been raised in 2 different settings with 2 different teachers, or if he is much younger than I first realised when reading your OP.

Yes initially raised by nursery teacher who then said behaviour is in line with the other boys his age.

Thank you for your advice but what else can we now do?! We've done everything in our power.

I don't want him monitored further over and above other children - who the teacher today admitted could be as boisterous. I won't use the word she used.

The consultant was the lead for autism and she was adamant he's not autistic.

He is a challenging child. Yes.

I am in no denial of potential SN - we've been open and honest with the professionals about every aspect of his behaviour and have minimised none of it.

Re. The note taking - I would like to see any notes kept on my child.

It is not unreasonable to see the notes on your child. Maybe you should ask for a home-school cimnunication book and then you could see the comments each pm after school.

With regards to the incidents that occur, what would you like the teacher/school to do? They cannot ignore this behaviour or let it go without consequence even if that is simply time in the 'time out' area or 'thinking chair' (whatever the school system.

Could you also ask for a behaviour chart that focuses on getting a smiley face for each school session. This encourages Snd focuses on positive behaviour rather than negative. It might be a good incentuve for your son.

communication book

Sorry for bad spelling. It's my fat fingers!

We have a communication book - every child has one.

But no comments are entered. We just get hauled in every few weeks with vague 'there's pushing and shoving every day' - but then when I dig I find out some is in retaliation.

What can we do at home when we manage to control his behaviour?

If you are sure he has no SN and is just being boisterous/ naughty at school what have you already done about it?

Have you come down on him like gods own tonne of bricks, taken away all of his privileges and made him earn them back contingent on good reports from the teacher? Have you rewarded him with a trip to the toy shop for a weeks worth of 'good days' etc? These 'behaviourist' intervention strategies should work well with an NT child with no underlying issues.

My DS had a few issues at the start of Reception (August born so very young) and even the Teacher said some of them were a reaction to goading. I was equally hard on him for these incidents because I wanted him to be clear it was NEVER acceptable to push etc regardless of what had been done to him.

As a parent I would never give up and think 'well, I've done everything I can do'. My recommendation is that you book a meeting with the teacher and maybe phase leader and make a behaviour plan to follow at home and school and communicate frequently about how this is going.

I agree with SisterV. Tbh, OP, you sound like you've just given up and just expect him to continue pushing/shoving/snatching.

Give up?

We've taken him again GPs advice to see a top paediatric consultant.

I think that comment is massively unfair.

We have had meeting after meeting after meeting with the school. We've been told that they are glad we have engaged and been so supportive as many parents haven't.

We have relayed back to the school what works for us.

There has come a point now where I personally feel for a four year old boy with no medical problems or special needs he's had enough poking, prodding and monitoring. Yes he's challenging but I feel we have that sussed at home (me having left work to concentrate fully on the two DCs).

Surely the school must engage some of their own methods?

Either ask that the comments be recorded in this book or that he has a behaviour book that is separate. Or they can just photocopy the notes you've said they keep each day and attach them to his book.

Other than reinforcing the school rules at home and discussing the incidents and talking through why it was unacceptable/not the right response, it's difficult to do much else at home but you still need to be onboard with the school and show that you are continuing to want to work in partnership with them. They must feel there is a problem as it is not in anyone's interest to fabricate incidents that have not happened.

The teacher needs to note down the incidents and yes, share these notes with you, but there also has to be some sort of behaviour management system put into place (above what is already provided in class as this is obviously not working as a deterrent/effective consequence for your son at the moment. That's not to say it won't ever, it may just be for now while he is still young. So something like the behaviour chart might be a good start.

Would that be something you think might help.

So he hasn't got any SN and is just a pain in the arse? That's great, that means you should be able to improve his behaviour. Have you read any behaviour management books like 1 2 3 Magic?

Agree with SisterV

Parenting a child isn't just taking them to the GP.

I meant to add, managing a child's behaviour at home in a 1-1 situation can be quite different to a child behaving in a class of 30 children and probably 2 adults. A child can be micro managed at home, things can be nipped in the bud the very second they occur, this is just not the case in school.

Children have to begin to learn to manage their own behaviour and take responsibility for their own actions. Yes, this is a long road of learning that can be difficult but consequences when rules are not followed are how children learn.

Thank you.

My point is there is none of this at home. We count to three, by the end of three he's usually stopped whatever it is that's not acceptable.

If he doesn't stop he gets a time out. Three time outs he get a cross and more crosses that ticks then he doesn't get whatever we are working toward that week. Ticks obv for good behaviour.

He is hugely motivated by it and will clean up sister's messes for a tick etc.

I feel I share and it's ignored and we get the vagueness.

We obviously do punish for bad behaviour at school.

I do feel though up until now I've done him a disservice - never taking his 'side' of events into consideration and just blindly punishing for pushing shoving etc.

I don't want the relationship with the school to turn sour but I feel it's heading that way.

i know I'm coming across as sharp and I'm getting advice - I just feel particularly upset by it all today.

We were asked to take him. What a cruel comment.

I think you can listen, not punish and empathise whilst still making it clear that certain things are absolute no-nos. this can be far more difficult if your child has additional needs of course but it isn't uncommon for children to behave well at home and not at school (or the other way around.)

Take him where?