Ds might be suspended after fight please help

[SparrowHaze]

i am honestly panicking a bit and dont really know what im asking here maybe i just need to write it down because i cant make any sense of what has happened today

ds is 17, year 13 and ive just got him home from college after he was involved in a fight with another boy in the common room

college have said they are investigating and he cant go back to lessons until they have made a decision about what happens next, which i know is serious obviously and im not saying he shouldnt face consequences because you cant just hit someone but this is so unlike him and thats what is worrying me

he is not some violent kid, hes a normal 17 year old can be moody and argumentative and all the usual teenager stuff but he has never been someone who gets into fights, certainly not at college

the boy he was fighting is actually one of his friends which is making it even more strange, theyre all in the same group and have been for ages, a very loud group of boys really and if im honest ive wondered before whether ds wouldnt be better off with some different friends

theyre always winding each other up and making comments about girls and things being “banter” and trying to embarrass each other, its just what theyre like and ds normally gives as good as he gets so ive never really known whether i should be worrying about it or just accepting that teenage boys are idiots sometimes

ive heard some of the things they say when ive picked ds up or theyve been around and some of it really isnt very nice but they all laugh and call it banter and ds has never seemed particularly bothered by it and ds is the same so i dont think its bullying or anything like that

apparently there was an argument before the fight and the other boy said something to him but ds wont tell me what

ive asked him in the car, ive asked him since we got home and every time its just “nothing”i said well it cant have been nothing if you got into a fight over it and he just shrugged then literally nothing, just staring out the window

he looks exhausted and ive asked him if hes hurt and he said no but he is definitely not himself

and this has been going on for a little while really, hes been much quieter at home and more irritable but just says he’s fine

i just put it down to year 13 because obviously theyre under pressure and hes got exams and everything coming up

the thing is if this was just their normal stupid banter then why would he react like this he must have been pushed really far for him to actually snap because i honestly cannot imagine him just deciding to punch one of his friends for no reason

and i know that sounds like im making excuses for him and im not, im absolutely furious that hes got himself into this situation and he knows better but i also feel like there is something hes not telling me

college said there were witnesses and they are going to speak to people and work out exactly what happened, theyve said ds cant just come back in tomorrow and carry on as normal and they will contact us when theyve decided what theyre doing

when we got home ds just went upstairs. i asked him one more time what happened and he said “mum ive told you, nothing happened”

and now im sat downstairs wondering what on earth is going on because something clearly is and he is obviously not going to tell me

i’m also worrying about the consequences and if hes suspended. what happens then hes got his a levels this year

the boy must’ve said something to cause him to snap

Do you assault people who say things to you?
He needs to learn to walk away
Good self defence classes also teach walking away

OP does it matter what was said? Your DS should not be responding to words with his fists, should he? Regardless of the teasing, banter or outright nastiness. This is the sort of thing we teach toddlers. Unless the other guy hit him first, there's absolutely no justification for the fight, is there?

You say he's been a bit withdrawn for a while. It sounds like his friendship group is changing (not uncommon at that sort of age) and he isn't coping with that change well. Have you noticed, in amoungst all this "banter" that the group has a habit of focusing on one member and pushing them out? If so, that was probably something you's ideally have acted on a while ago, but obviously you can't turn back time. Relational aggression is often discussed on MN as a girl thing, but it's really not. It's just as common amoung boys. And doing some work with your DS around it so he can understand what his "friends" are doing, even if he won't tell you what is really going on, might be wise.

I would give him some space. Be available to talk. Wait for the college to make their decision. Possibly have a look around at options for him for if he is permanently excluded (another college doing the same boards? Home study?). And once that comes in, if he hasn't already opened up, sit him down for a big talk. He doesn't have to open up to you, but you do need to set some expectations and give him some tools.

I don't think OP is at all - she's simply pointing out this hitting is very out of character for her son, and something was said to trigge it - and that they ALL "banter" and say unkind things.

To get to 17 having never shown any signs of violence or getting into trouble and then one day punch one of your mates, IS out of character and concerning.

I can only think some "banter" really touched a nerve. Bantering is an unpleasant trait and risks this happening. Maybe the boy was saying something DS feels humiliated about or something personal? Could it be about a girlfriend, or could he be gay? Something about a family member?

Anyway I wouldn't worry too much about what was said, as pointed out it doesn't excuse hitting someone.

DS will need to go into college very contrite and apologetic. I suggests he writes a letter to the friend apologizing and to the college for his behaviour and you pass it on tomorrow morning.

go take him a drink, sit on his bed, then say. “I know today has been difficult and I just want you to know that I’m here. I know you and this isn’t something you would usually do, therefore I’m worried and want to know that you’re ok. This could be serious and in order to help you I need you to outline what’s happened. I don’t need all the details, and I won’t judge, but I need to know so I can help. Whatever it is I’m your mum and I love you and always will.

Then don’t say anything and wait for him to talk. Try not to react to what he says or ask questions, just let him talk.

My suspicion would be he’s likely as guilty as the other boy of saying something awful at the time. Otherwise he’d be telling people and not be hiding what was said.

At our school, fighting is instant expulsion, but I appreciate that college may be a bit different. We would let them back to sit the exams if another school could not be found with the right boards etc.

It sounds like something has happened to your ds @OP, which is a very sensitive matter (embarrassing, humiliating), and one of his friends has been gaslightling him about it. He snapped and punched him because of it.
He desperately doesnt want ANYONE to know what this thing is. The punching is pretty clear that's not the mystery and CCTV isnt going too show anything new there. The worrying part is a) His A'Levels 2) What is the secret that has made him 'very quiet' in the days leading up to the punching incident?

No but you don’t sssm to know what i mean.

The “banter” is the norm whether posters on here agree or not and DS has been friends with most of them for years, and nothing like this has ever happened. ds isn’t violent and he’s never been and he’s never been a known trouble maker. at 17 he wouldn’t suddenly decide to punch his friend for no reason and whether he was provoked or not it doesn’t change things and he needs to take responsibility for his actions but it does change things what led up to it and i think college know that otherwise they wouldn’t be investigating

It’s a lesson to be learned. We need to stop minimising and excusing bad behaviour. You keep saying how your son gives as good as he gets. Who are you to say that he isn’t the one starting this “banter” rather than just returning it.

And again, this is a conversation to be had with your son about behaviour that is excused as banter not being ok. If he doesn’t like the way he’s being spoken to by friends he should be calling them out not just acting the same way.

But he is violent,op. And there is no provocation which means violence is acceptable, and of course the college is investigating they can’t just say well he punched someone and it’s done, they have to follow due process.

most education establishments have a zero tolerance to violence.

I don't think 17 year olds fighting is normal.

whether he was provoked or not it doesn’t change things and he needs to take responsibility for his actions but it does change things what led up to it and i think college know that otherwise they wouldn’t be investigating
Well no, you were right the first time. He punched someone. What happened before this doesn’t change things.

I literally said in the post you quoted that provoking doesn’t make it ok.

Funny how you ignored the poster who quoted you clarifying what I meant but jumped on me repeating exactly what i had said when i hadn’t quoted you…

Boys will be boys hey 🙄🙄

The amount of people excusing male violence on this thread is insane.

In a given situation we can’t control how others react but we can always choose how we want to react back.

By saying this behaviour is quite normal is literally normalising violence and letting boys know that reacting this way and choosing violence is ok and guess where that leaks into…the way they treat women and their every day attitude to any given situation.

If they don’t like something they just sort it with violence because that’s what they’ve been able to get away with. If a woman makes them angry because she doesn’t want their attention, they react with violence because that’s how they’ve reacted in the past and we’re told it’s “normal”

Stop excusing boys bad behaviour that leads to men’s bad behaviour.

No, but she should have nipped it in the bud from the onset

Normal procedure after fisticuffs. The other boy should be in the same position. Best not to get into fights on college site. Im sure it will be fine.

Oh bless him. Maybe he just needs some space to process what’s gone one. I’d suggest taking him some food and telling him you’re about if he needs you and then leave him for this evening. It might be best for everyone that he can’t go in tomorrow.
He obviously needs to understand that violence isn’t a valid response, but he also needs to be looked after. Ignore the nasty comments here. He’s only young and it’s hard at any age to know what to do with anger.

It doesn’t change things but it is important context, not just “ds punched x” something obviously would’ve led up to it, i dont see him punching him for no reason. He’s never been violent in the past so at 17 in year 13 he wouldn’t suddenly decide to punch someone for no reason whatsoever especially when he knows it’s a very important time with a levels, uni applications etc

OP, it might be useful if you can suggest gently to your DS that he writes down what happened - just the facts, who was there, who said what, what happened. Apart from helping him to process events, it might be useful if he needs to provide a statement for the college,

A few people have already said to provide food, drink, reassurance of your love and support and a bit of space. I’d agree, and add that talking can sometimes be easier if you are sitting side by side in the car. Many problems were talked through this way in our household, starting with simple chats about things that were totally unrelated.

Best of luck with supporting him.

I would take his phone and check his messages. Ive always said if mine act out of character, I would be checking their phones.

You can judge a person by the company they keep and from what you've said your sons friends are very loud, unpleasant and inclined to wind each other up. Looks like this is now well out of hand and perhaps your son needs to revise his friendship group if he is allowed to continue his education.

Of course it matters what happened immediately before hand. While violence is not justified, if there was severe provocation over time, they're less likely to write him off than if it really was over nothing.
His reluctance to talk about it could be either fear or loyalty regarding getting the other boy in trouble, or embarrassment about losing his temper over something trivial.

If there were no teachers around OP, do you know what happened - was it a prolonged fight so they heard commotion, or a single punch that resulted in an injury, or did someone else tell an adult? (not criticising if they did, every kid deserves to feel safe at college!)

@SparrowHaze The college must investigate!! Please read up on behaviour and sanctions. The reason they investigate is to build up a picture of what happened. Plus the “why” does matter when it’s a previously squeaky clean child. Some dc have faced something dreadful at home and others can certainly act out of character if another child has mocked or bullied them. The school then has to decide the punishment. Only a head can permanently exclude but circumstances truly matter for this punishment and what he did to the other ds. Schools rarely call the police (and mostly police don’t attend) because it’s on school premises and the head makes the decisions. The DS should be asked for his version of events too as well as witnesses.

A wealthy suburban area in the U.S. Some days it’s feels like we live in the 1950s similar to that movie Pleasantville.