To disagree with my mannager about if diarrhea is reason to WfH

[HonestPenguin]

How bad would diarrhoea need to be for you to work from home?

I have had bowel surgery, and from time to time I get what I would consider to be severe diarrhoea. As an example, over the last 24 hours I have been to the toilet 14 times. It’s all very watery, and I feel some nausea and just vaguely unwell.

When talking to my manager, I explained that from time to time I may need to work from home more than expected, as a result of the bowel surgery and the severe diarrhoea I sometimes experience. Her response was to say that we all get stomach bugs and that I need to meet the expectation.

Perfectly reasonable to WFH under the circumstances without taking sick leave. You're not saying you can't work, just that you need to be at home, which is fair, I think. I certainly wouldn't begrudge a colleague being given that flex.

This country would be in even more of a mess if people who are perfectly capable of working with adjustments are forced out of work becasue of stupid management.

I think two things are being conflated here: physical attendance and sickness absence. They are not the same. Whilst an employer might well track both, for a person who needs adjustments the former can end up in the latter if not dealt with properly. That affects business. So it’s always in an employer’s business interests for them to accommodate disability issues well - it just makes good business sense. Maybe that’s what your letter says - I am ready and willing to work but cannot get through a 75 minute packed train journey at the moment without shitting myself - so either you let me work from home or I will have to ring in sick. I am not too sick to work but I am unable to get to the office. You choose.

we can draft that in a clever way so it doesn’t sound threatening.

Sounds like she’s projecting and that’s a culture we don’t want to uphold. Can you discern if it’s coming from higher than her, OP - as in, what’s the landscape like in your workplace - or is it just her? Either way, you’re in the right IMO.

Aside from all of the aspects relating to your health that others have mentioned, your manager sounds terrible.

They are also not thinking of the bigger picture with regard to other employees, toilet facilities, hygiene and the office cleaner.

@Longtimelurker1980your plan sounds sensible.

I am due to WfH tomorrow so need to stop stressing about it.

i think i should be contacting GP or gastro team tomorrow aas this is the second episode in less than a month and I am not feeling well supported medically.

my HRBP did flag this to my mannager in a regular meetimg which promp the we all get stomach bugs comment.

wondered aboiut something like this.

I am experiencing a flaire of my prexisting bowel condition. I have contacted my GP for support to mannage this and ewill make up working time if i need any appointments as per the policy.

i will keep you updated on if i am well enough to come in to the office or if need tpo use my adjustment to wfh. As all meetings are hybrid thois week i do not expect any impact on delivery.

I would just call in sick those days and start a reasonable adjustment request with HR.

In my office (huge building), there is only one toilet anywhere near where my team sits and chances are, someone would already be using it.

I think the pressure is coming from a dirrector. I donthonestly think theyare hugely wrong as there does appear to be a group of people, my mannager being one who have taken it upon themselves to not meet the requirements or call 11.30 to 2 an in office day

Diarrhoea comes with the official NHS advice to stay home from school or work until 48 hours after your last episode.

https://www.nhs.uk/symptoms/diarrhoea-and-vomiting/

As you are unable to ascertain whether you have a bug or whether you are having another post-surgery bout, I would err on the side of caution and stay home. Besides, your productivity in the office would be, pardon the pun, in the toilet. At least at home you can wear easy pants and nip to the porcelain throne whenever you need to.

I do get your manager’s frustration, I run a team and when someone is unable to come in due to diarrhoea, it’s annoying. Especially if it happens a lot. But I’d rather they stayed home and worked there than brought it into the office and my entire team went down with it 😂

This reminds me of when the DWP told a benefits claimant who was incontinent that they could get a job because they could keep a bucket under their desk. Just outrageous!

They can't just decide reasonable adjustments no longer apply 🙈

I agree with those saying if you’re sick you should be off sick, not wfh.

It depends how bad it is.

Or does she mean, come in on other days instead so you’re still meeting the requirement, but being flexible. There do seem to be a lot of people who if they have to work an additional day from home on eg Weds, they won’t think to make their usual wfh day on Thursday an office day.

Personally, I think 14 episodes of completely watery diarrhoea in 24 hours is more than enough to make working from home reasonable, especially when it’s a recurring issue following bowel surgery. If I were in that situation, I’d struggle to get through a normal working day without constant toilet access, never mind having to travel into work. The fact that it’s caused by an ongoing medical issue rather than an occasional stomach bug makes the “we all get stomach bugs” response feel rather dismissive.

Exactly this. The ignorance on this thread is astounding regarding chronic illness.

@HonestPenguin if you are in UK, ask your GP for a ‘fit to work’ note that says you are fit to work with adjustment. The adjustment will be ‘work from home’. The reason will be ‘need to go to toilet more frequently due to recovery from surgery’. Timeline - however long is reasonable in eyes of GP.

I had this for a different reason recently - sent straight to HR with a courtesy email to Manager.

This is poor management though. You should be monitoring her productivity if it’s a problem, and discussing it with her.

Your manager is a twat. I'm getting all paranoid about whether I should be calling out a staff member for constantly showing up late and not even keeping me informed of when he is WFH. I wouldn't dream of pulling someone up on medical reasons to WFH.

I think you need to forget the collaborative approach OP. Collaboration is a two way process. You tried that and your manager is clearly not playing ball.

Start documenting everything in writing and keep a printed copy. Example:

« Hi manager, recapping a conversation we had earlier today at around 10 am where I mentioned that I have had bowel surgery and an ongoing effect of that is bouts of diahorrea. I am typically well enough to work during these episodes, but for obvious reasons, working from home is much easier because I can properly manage my condition.

As you’re aware, I’ve had an OH assessment which recommends (quote directly from the OH assessment re flexibly working from home). I know this can be facilitated, even on a Wednesday, as other people join the team meeting remotely. I’ve attached a copy of the OH report for your convenience.

Please can you confirm the position by responding to this email. Do let me know whether involving HR at this stage would assist. »

If there is no response or an inadequate response then speak to your HR team.

if anything happens you have a good case for disability discrimination IF you keep putting everything in writing. Document, document, document.

Could you offer to go in on days you feel well regardless of whether they were planned from home, to sort of “bank” some wfh days? This means the team won’t miss out on your presence overall?

Sounds like a plan. I’d shove a ‘reasonable’ in front of ‘adjustment’ and copy HRBP (if that is your HR contact) into all emails regarding condition from now on.

Don’t write this OP. The person suggesting it is not legally trained and I absolutely agree that a first step now is an attempt at a collaborative one. Save the big guns and big emails for later. Being pissy is tempting but in my experience rarely gets an employer on side, however right the employee may be.

This seems a very good course of action to follow.

You could ask your manager for a referral to Occupational health so they can get the right guidance to support you.
Have you discussed things with your GP and how it's affecting your work?

Look at what you’re eating. Write a food diary of everything you’re eating and work out what’s upsetting your innards. Is it gluten? Dairy? Vegetables/fruit/pulses etc? All of which upset my innards and cause Dioreah and bloating. Do a food diary for 6 weeks and you’ll work it out :) everything you eat or drink or put in your mouth as it doesn’t have to be a food. Cut out inflammatory food groups from your diet if you haven’t already - potatoes, peppers, tomatoes etc - it makes a big difference

Ask to speak to occupational health and get it in writing. You have a long term health condition which is protected by the disability act.

The alternative is to be signed off sick. How would she feel about that???