AIBU to think parents should lose benefits /homes for persistently antisocial children?

[Soddingcat]

This has been suggested, im not sure if it will happen , but i think this is a great idea, if the parents think they will lose their council house and benefits , they may attempt to to control their feral offspring .

My friend is in a local harriers group that starts at a local sports centre in the rough part of town, they are now having to stop their favourite route because of gangs of young teens who intimidate them , run along side them and are abusive, one delightful boy said “ lift your legs higher you c**t ,

How have we come to this ?
Do you think it will make any difference ?

I would remove child benefit from them too , maybe this will force them to parent if they risk losing money or their home

Obviously not all the parents are bad, but virtually all the awful kids round here riding motor bikes with hoods, abusing people are from the council estates near by

Im absolutely sick of it, and sick of decent people being targeted by them

What rules /sanctions would wise mumsnetters suggest ?

Double their council tax.
Take away their driving licence.

There's two for a start.

So what do you propose for the affluent/non council families of antisocial children? You can't just take away their homes can you? What if they earn too much to receive child benefit?

What about if there is one 'antisocial' child, but all the other children are perfectly well behaved? Why do they deserve to become homeless and have their entire lives ruined?

What if the child is 'antisocial' because they've quietly suffered years of abuse? How is punishing them by making them homeless and completely impoverished fair?

Where do these families go? Are you content for them to live on the streets? Including babies? Do you care that the children would likely fall victim to sex trafficking, abuse etc? Do you not think this will encourage them to commit crimes so they can survive?

This is probably the dopiest thing I'll hear today.

And when they can't afford to feed their kids because they need to find another £150??

If it's a persistent offender, then certainly it is a good idea. Though I knew one child who was an absolute menace, caused trouble everywhere and with everyone, led a gang of other kids and was always punching and hitting other children. There were so many complaints to his mother and the local authority that the family were actually transferred, given another house in another area, and the problems started there too...but I know also that there was terrible violence in that home and the father served a prison sentence for GBH against the mother, and despite everything I felt very sorry for that child. There is something very wrong with families where children act like this outside the home and I'm not sure that a benefit sanction would resolve it really.

That's not my problem and until we get over this arse about face thinking that these anti social arseholes and those responsible for them must not be punished, the more we can look forward to society being ruled by them.

By your way of thinking, they mustn't be punished because...you know...it might punish them!

That's the fucking point!

Punishment is meant to hurt and hurt enough that they will think on for the future.

How do you know they’re all in council houses?

They start selling things. They get a job, two extra jobs. Who cares? I don't.

Do what they must and I hope it fucking hurts.

I agree.
Many here won’t remember or even know (as reports mysteriously dropped out the news), but James Cleverley’s privately educated son(s?) were detained by police following some horrifically thuggish behaviours.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/19910453/top-tory-sons-arrested-assault-teen-fractured-skull/

Are we including them in these plans OP?

It was an article in the mail today. Some think tank have suggested it. Would probably would have been helpful if OP had linked it in her first post.

https://www.dailymail.com/news/article-16096677/Dock-benefits-parents-anti-social-youngsters-Middlesbrough.html

Parents need support- there is none it very little. Making children homeless will make the behaviour worse not better.

I kind of agree with you to an extent, in principle. There is a whole lot of pandering for many different groups/kinds of behaviour.

Sure Start, community policing, zero tolerance of ASB. Properly fund addiction & mental health services. Properly fund Social Services.

If your kids are antisocial they will get picked up and taken to a centre somewhere where they will have to stay until you come to pick them up. Dont take money away, take time. Inconvenience parents. This will hurt wealthy parents just as much as poor. Repeat offenders will get Social Services involvement.

If you are antisocial you will get picked up and taken somewhere to sober up or to be processed. If the decision is no further action then you have to get yourself home.

Where appropriate use community service orders. The minibus will be picking you up at 6am on the following Saturday (or other leisure day) to take you to the next town where you will spend a few hours cleaning up vomit, graffiti, and other detritus of other people's ASB. You will wear a tabbard while doing this, so that people probably wont know you but they will know why you are there.

The purpose is to inconvenience offenders. And yes to shame.

Having to pick little Jimmy up from the holding centre is inconvenient and embarassing. And spending several hours at the holding centre is boring as hell for little Jimmy plus he will have his parents to face.

That’s the kind of opinion I’d have had when younger, but now I’m older I can see that it would be totally counter productive. The kids would be even worse anti socially and have more chance of become disfranshised and criminals.

OP why do you think there is a link between antisocial behaviour and council tenants?

Having a low income/education accounts for a lot of behaviour issues - so your idea to reduce the money even further is ridiculous and cruel and would ultimately only cause worse antisocial behaviour.

You need to ask yourself why these kids are hanging around the streets - why are they not at home, doing a club, experiencing new things and places etc

These are the most disadvantaged kids in the country and their parents were also disadvantaged and the cycle continues.

There are also a large number of ND families because it meant them not getting a good education, therefore not getting a good job and remaining in poverty.

It would be better for money to be put into the community and have things like youth clubs, sports clubs etc so these kids actually have something positive to do and can do better than their parents.

The drug dealers in our street own their ex council house. I think the grotty parents bought it in the 90's.

So you think starving people will make them behave??

I can guarantee that you would feel safer living amongst doctors and lawyers than homeless people, even though they can all be as dangerous as each other - but we know that desperate people often have to resort to criminal activity to survive.

"I favour Borstals run along the lines of the one in Scum and I don't care if they go from there to prison without having learned a thing and spend their lives there."

That is really shocking and awful thing to say. Fucking hell.

Will they?

Where does it come from this hunger, this desire to see other people hurt and in pain? Other people like to inflict pain and you like to do the same back? Nice.

Moving on…Poverty and trauma are devastating. Why are some people allowed to engage in criminal activity because they have the money to not pay for their misdeeds? A fairer more equal society would help much more than this Daily Mail Reform reflex STOP THE BENEFITS bullshit. So tiring. I’m pretty sure the quiet majority are so sick of this nonsense.

There should be zero tolerance on crime. And an intelligence test on being able to parent

And maybe if parents picked better people to sleep with and use contraception more the endless cycle of incompetent parents may slow down

Where do people get role models on how to parent from the most?

The worst behaved group of kids I have seen recently was at a party in the park for kids at the local ‘posh’ school (I heard the mums talking about school uniform shopping). They were 11-completely dreadful language and behaviour. I doubt any of those families claimed CB and all lived in huge owned houses. What’s their consequence?

Oh wow. So sort of like eugenics?

I tell you what.

It will make them behave a whole lot better than arranging a game of ping pong in a community centre for them!

Anyway, what hyperbole...starve my arse. Will they not be able to afford a loaf of bread a day.

You are guilty of soft slope head thinking which is why we are ruled by anti social behaviour in many areas.

Punishment is meant to punish and when it doesn't, then it's not punishment is it?

Quite simply, it comes from seeing decent law abiding people cowering on estates full of these little shits.

It comes from seeing teachers having nervous breakdowns because of these little shits.

It comes from seeing corner shops having to close because of these little shits.

It comes from nice kids being unable to use parks because of these little shits.

And a whole lot more.

Brilliant idea!

Is crime much better in countries with the death penalty or harsher punishments? What about in countries that publicly flog thieves or people who have sex outside of marriage? Does it stop those things happening?