AIBU to wonder why we care so much about overcrowding of prisons?

[Ellie126]

Just that really. It’s prison. For people that have committed horrific crimes. Why are we giving it a second thought? Granted, I know some crimes are less ‘severe’ than others but they should still serve the sentence they were given. I can’t believe this is even a political issue right now!

if overcrowding is really issue, should capital punishment be given to the most SERIOUS offenders? For example for the two men that abused and assaulted that poor adopted boy. If they’re taking up space… that would solve the issue? They have no place in society and we certainly shouldn’t be worried if they feel cramped!!

So he videod it with an illegal phone and it was in a news article? I still don't believe most people would prefer being incarcerated to being outside. Have a look at Scandinavian prisons - more humane and they have a lower rate of recidivism.

I agree op. When the prisons are full. Make a list of the 1,000 worst offenders, take them out into the yard and shoot them, thus freeing up space.

Because your innocent child could be incarcerated? Because we care about human rights? Because your child could end up working there?

Why would I want to know that?

Yes this is a much better solution than their release! I wonder why this hasn’t been done… I guess ££ but surely this is better then releasing ex cons

Reintroduce hanging and apply it retrospectively for those it would have applied to, it’d free up some space

Totally agree with this. Well said.

Prisons are ultimately about the loss of liberty.
People in them should not just be tortured or left to suffer from things like overcrowding, or things like the heatwaves (that was a recent thread).
Any one of us could end up in one for something like not paying a fine, or fighting back when you are in a DV relationship.

It's like people are competing to have the harshest opinions. Like it makes them feel all tough.

Hang em all, shoot a thousand at a time, lock em up 23 hours a day?

It's amusingly stupid

I assume you are willing to do the shooting yourself?

It’s all being said for the attention and wow factor

Have you read the evidence against them? I don't think it's my argument that is stupid.

Yes this is a good point. I'll try and bear it in mind because it's so depressing to read these horrible opinions

I’m not sure how Burnham is going to resolve it, having paused early release. Can the prisons be more crowded? Maybe so

Ex MoJ here. Worked with multiple ministers who tested all the ideas on this thread and more. They are sensible suggestions but there are reasons they can't be done or can't be done fast enough before you run out of space and have to do early release.

On overcrowding specifically, as others have said, there are laws in place which prevent it and overturning those laws would be incredibly difficult politically and take forever. Long before that the prisons would get too full and you'd either have to do early release or the entire system stops and the Police can't arrest anyone as the court/police station cells and resulting prison cells are full. You'd have riots on the streets when wrong 'uns realise there will be no consequences for committing crimes.

The other issue is union handling. The prison unions insist that there are three prison officers available to subdue every prisoner in a cell of something kicks off at night. Ie in a standard two person cell in the male estate you need six officers who can leg it over if someone boots off. Even some relatively large prisons may only have about 15 staff on at night covering multiple wings (as everyone is locked up in their cells, plus getting night shift staff especially in remote locations is a nightmare). You shove half a dozen prisoners in a room and you literally don't have the staff. The unions won't allow their people in as they (rightly in many cases) consider it unsafe.

Another constraining factor is the prison buildings themselves. Many of them are Victorian and were designed for people far shorter and smaller than today. Two in a cell is a squeeze and some cells originally designed for Victorian women only fit one. There literally isn't the width or the height for bigger/more bunks.

Happy to answer any more questions in the morning!

This. One of them being a relative of mine.

Posts like this always seem to go straight to murder, sexual assault etc

So many of the prison population aren't serving life sentences, if you treat them like animals and they will come out as animals. And more than that it will make them highly unpleasant places to work in.

I also know one person who went to prison and credits prison with turning his life around after a rough upbringing he lives a pretty calm life now.

Victims ad victims families would get first refusal

Avoiding answering I see.

Not sure you can say we all have the same opinion - I don't particularly care about this topic, other than if it makes life harder for the people who have to work there. Maybe don't commit a crime if you don't want to go to an overcrowded prison?

Not everyone in prison is guilty, not everyone in prison has committed serious crimes against a person.

They are not in prison to be tortured either. I'm all for rehabilitation, exercise, decent food, education, a degree of comfort (fans, air con, adequate heating)

There are miscarriages of justice and equally some people should never walk the streets again. It really scares me how some people here would be happy to let every prisoner rot and i would never support the death penalty.

It's easy to sit on your cosy sofa and say take them out and shoot them, ffs.

I am sure the people wrongly imprisoned for the Post Office scandal took your advice onboard.

If you look at countries that have much lower reoffending rates you will find that they don't treat criminals like animals and they do invest in education and rehabilitation. if you want to stop people going straight back to crime you need to invest in trying to ensure they have alternatives. You also need to sort out mental health and alcohol/drug dependency. Keeping people poorly educated, addicted and dehumanising them is a pretty guaranteed way to make sure they keep doing what they have always done, which is presumably why our reoffending rates continue to be as high as they are.

No, that's not the point of prisons, its to remove their freedom as a punishment. They should still have a basic standard of living and care, with only their freedom curtailed.

"Over crowding" is not just about prisoners being cramped together. I'm surprised your level of critical thinking skills are so low. We can't just stick them all in a room and shut the door. Think about the people who have to work in that prison, their safety risks. Yes, have a good think about if one of those prison officers was your husband, father, brother, sister, whatever. You'd want them to be safe going to work right?