Flags..

[Elephant9]

Just a chat to understand what’s going on with the influx of England and UJ flags all over the streets?

thoughts?
where did it stem from?
is it making you uncomfortable? (It is, me, but not entirely sure why)

Define patriotism

It’s not ignorance, we all live in our own bubbles. You know as well as I do that the working class bubble can be small.

I wasn’t looking for that information in my early 20s, and it wasn’t being made available to me.

Many of the flag people are the same concerned citizens as last year’s riots, in a movement endorsed by the same public figures. It’s an insult to anyone’s intelligence to suggest otherwise.

WTF?? Hope someone got that on film.

I hope so too. I would have done, but frankly I was too scared.

Patriotism is love of country, a sense of belonging and pride that can live alongside honest criticism and the wish to make it better.

Nationalism (the flag thing) is different: it elevates the nation above others, often in exclusionary ways, demanding loyalty and rejecting criticism. One is rooted in affection and responsibility, the other in superiority and division.

But the flags are emboldening the racists. People are thinking it’s acceptable to tell people to “go back to where they came from”

And then you get incidents like what’s happened this week in Halifax where an nhs nurse of Filipino descent has been beaten in a park by a white couple who were screaming at her to get back on her fucking rubber dinghy. All captured on mobile phone.

a friend of mine confronted two blokes in town yesterday who were ranting at non white people to go back to where they came from. Again she filmed it all.

the amount of racist abuse and attacks in the last few weeks has rocketed

Should we discuss all the incidents with hotel residents that have been caught on film? Or are people still trying to pretend they don't happen? There is a hell of a lot of racism present on this thread but only towards white British people.

I have no problem with flags everywhere, but do wish they use a stencil. Some of the painting looks really crap.

Feel free to discuss any incident you want. Go on, please do. But I’d be interested first of all to hear what you think about the nurse getting beaten up and told to fuck off back on her dinghy.

Or are you saying two wrongs deserve a right? Are you saying a Filipino nurse deserves to get beaten up because of what some unrelated hotel resident may or may not have done?

I'd be interested to hear why you think that is more important than teenage girls being sexually assaulted then it being covered up by the authorities. I'm in no way condoning those attacks you have mentioned in any way but why should this be publicised and the assailants vilified when incidents against British women and children are swept under the carpet daily. Why also do you seem to use the phrase may of may not have done when referring to hotel residents incidents. Do you not believe they happen or do you just want to ignore them till it's on your doorstep and happening to someone you know? I personally know of a young girl who was assaulted whilst waiting for a bus home from school after staying behind for exam revision session. She was surrounded by a group of males in a public place and touched inappropriately and forced to touch them whilst being threatened with a knife. When her parents reported it to the police they were simply told it will be dealt with. No crime reference number was issued, no follow ups done.

Why? Bet the knuckle dragger who did this enjoys a good Chinese takeaway..

I have seen several cases of immigrant men being charged and convicted of sexual offences. Are those the ones people are talking about? Lot is there evidence of others?

I haven’t said I think it’s more important than teenage girls being sexually assaulted and covered up by the authorities. I don’t. I think all attacks should be investigated and the perpetrators dealt with. I believe the perpetrators of the Rotherham assaults weren’t asylum seekers??? They were of Pakistan heritage

in 2010 there was a grooming gang in Cornwall, all white men (and one woman). 30 kids abused. Didn’t get as much media or public attention.

It’s hard to say for sure what the ethnic background of the majority of perpetrators overall, nationwide are.

bbc article said
A previous piece of research from 2015 found that of 1,231 perpetrators of "group and gang-based child sexual exploitation", 42% were white, 14% were defined as Asian or Asian British and 17% black.”

it does seem that a lot of people assume it’s always men of certain ethnic groups when that isn’t the case.

the Bolton grooming gang, all look white to me. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c89g293zj2ko

it’s nearly all men though. I’d say that men are the issue. Not Filipino nurses or the owners of Chinese take aways.

Why also do you seem to use the phrase may of may not have done when referring to hotel residents incidents

purely because you haven’t been specific about what incidents you’re talking about. So I don’t know what has or hasn’t been done. Maybe it’s true, maybe it’s social media fear mongering. 🤷‍♀️. You need to be specific.

the police should have followed up and dealt with the incident of the person you know. Bizarre that there was no crime ref number, no investigation. Have the parents complained? Gone to the press?

Our local council has been posting on their social media abut how great it is to see so many flags and how they are now offering help with buying flag poles for community groups. I get the logic that enabling people to display them properly may reduce the numbers being put all over and in unsafe places and waffling about how great they look will also appease a rather vocal group of people. However, I really think it's concerning that this suggests support for operation raise the colours which is not acceptable for a council in an inclusive, modern Britain. They will be hearing from me about it.

I’m amazed any local council have the money to buy flag poles when they seem to be struggling to fund essential services like bin collections, respite care and support mandated by EHPC reports. I’d be questioning them on that if I was local. Surely they have better things to spend tax payers money on?

Why do I need to be specific? Are you expecting me to dox myself and reveal my location along details of victims names? What is your agenda there? Maybe you should just take people's word as you expect us to take your word that these are all hard working intelligent men who plan on boosting the economy. No further action was taken as the parents were strongly advised by the police to 'keep quiet' to prevent repercussions. Now if that isn't covering things up I don't know what is.

OK so you've done your research to show cases of white British people committing crimes, in particular sexual assault. The big difference here is they are prosecuted for it. I've never said white men don't commit crimes at any point, but do we really want to allowing more people to enter the country who will do that and in most cases never even be charged with anything. You are entitled to your opinion and it's clear you will never agree with anything else. I just pray that you or someone you know never becomes a victim at the hands of one of the hotel residents.

Grooming gangs have existed in the UK for decades. Young children have always been preyed upon by paedophile gangs, while the authorities have turned a blind eye.

I grew up in care in the 1980s. You wouldn’t believe how many of my peers I saw being groomed. They’d get a new (much older, white) boyfriend who’d ply them with gifts and alcohol. Before you knew it they were being pimped out and addicted to heroin.

The police knew. Social services knew. Nobody did a thing to help them. There were no protests. But suddenly, when the perpetrators are Asian, people at last give a shit.

Believe me, child exploitation is NOT new and it is NOT a race issue.

Bbc on YouTube. A bit of NI fleg humour

Where is the evidence it is about superiority? Genuine question. I'm not sure what you mean by demanding loyalty either. I'm sure there are extreme outliers, as there are in every movement and it is not fair to use these extremes to malign the majority. However, the flag people - for want of a better term, are expressing a love for their country, in what way is this irresponsible

Don’t be silly. I don’t want you to reveal your location. I assumed you were talking about stuff which has been reported in the media…which you’d be able to discuss without “doxxing yourself”. Guess it’s all just social media unsubstantiated gossip then….i can’t comment about made up stuff, or stuff you refuse to tell me what you’re actually talking about.

so there we are. Notice you still haven’t commented on the Filipino nurse incident 👍

I haven’t said anything about them all being hard working men planning on boosting the economy. You’ve totally made that up.

have to say I don’t think much of the parents you “know” if they’ve agreed to drop pushing for prosecution of someone who has sexually assaulted their daughter to prevent repercussions. Surely they’d be creating hell, even anonymously creating hell via a journalist.

Believe me there are plenty of white men who aren’t prosecuted for sexual assaults and rapes. Even more who aren’t found guilty even when the evidence seems overwhelming. Ched Evans springs to mind. We should be protesting about this wider issue rather than focusing on the race of the perpetrators of different crimes.

Where did she say that asylum seekers were all hard working intelligent men who plan on boosting the economy?

A PP has recently posted an image of a Chinese takeaway, with racial abuse painted onto it, and an instruction to go home.

Expressing love for their country. Pull the other.

@SanityLeftTheChatdo you have evidence that immigrants aren’t prosecuted for sexual assaults?

'Foreign looking people?'

The irony is breathtaking !!!

You couldn't make it up! 😆

I bet no-one got this 'incident' on film.'