It shouldn’t be said that “only women have a cervix”.

[Paddingtonsmarmaladesandwiches]

Watching Keir Stammer on Marr this morning scrambling to answer whether or not it is transphobic to say “only women have a cervix” was the final nail in the coffin for me this morning with Labour. In the aftermath of The Lancet calling women, “bodies with vaginas”, I think I’ve finally figured out that the current belief system is that transwomen are women, but women who were observed female at birth are “bodies with vaginas”. Clearly Labour aren’t in need of the votes of bodies with vaginas, brains and a spine.

I daren't spoil papers any more. I daren't waste my voice.

If I just refuse to vote then others will and the anti-women politicians will go in on those votes. Sadly, I've been forced to the point now where I will at the time have to choose the least harmful to women option remaining (and yes, it's exactly like trying to work out which poisoned chalice has the least poison in it) and vote for them.

I will not be voting at all for what I want. I will just be voting to try and avoid the most harmful option for women getting into power. At the very least this grants women some more time.

@TortillaBonita

Well, good luck Kier with only the Trans vote to get you in.

Not even all the trans votes, many don't believe TWAW so he's cutting out 50% of the population for a few.

@Violinist64

Presumably the traditional Ladies and Gentlemen is now going to be changed to People With Vaginas and Gentlemen. If we carry this to its logical conclusion, public toilets will be labelled People With Vaginas and Gents. It’s ridiculous and misogynistic. I am a woman or lady not a Person With a Vagina.

Ladies and gentlemen as a phrase is already done for www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/lner-train-conductors-ladies-and-gentleman-complaint-non-binary-passenger-b935093.html

I suppose it's a case of writing 'only women have a cervix' on the ballot paper .

The Tories are the only ones who have this right , but ....

Where I am it's a straight fight between Lib Dems and Tories, with an excellent Lib Dem candidate. But sadly Ed Davey is a complete and utter numpty so I won't be voting for them.

Honestly KS isnt going to last out 2021 if he keeps it up. Terrible.

public toilets will be labelled People With Vaginas and Gents.
Absolutely not - how transphobic! Bodies with bollox and people with penises can be women too. How dare anyone try to separate spaces by biology. If being called "cervix havers" meant we could keep spaces for "cervix havers" it might just about be tolerable but no got to let the "lady dicks" in too.

@doublemonkey

Absolutely do not vote for Labour under the current circumstances! If they don't know what a woman is how on earth do you expect them to run the country?

The existence of women is not a trans issue.

Agree.

Brexit was bad in terms of magical thinking, but this is another level.

Gina Miller is launching an anti brexit political party. Anyone know her views on gender?!!

I wonder how many (intrinsically misogynistic) men walked into the office this morning and piped up "morning all bodies with vaginas" thinking they were hilariously funny when obviously they were actually tragic

This is a fucking stupid state of affairs and surely somebody within Labour must have said, "er Boss, do you think its a good idea to alienate 51% of the population with this, you know we're kind of already struggling for votes"?!

But 51% of women aren't alienated.

More and more women-especially younger women- are describing themselves as Trans Allies.

I would like to kick each and every one of them up the arse.

We need to start new hashtags

#OnlyMenHaveAPenis
#OnlyMenHaveAProstrate

The TRAs will need to start shouting that Trans Women have a penis too.

I'm donning my hard hat for this next comment but I think you're in a position of privilege if who shares the changing rooms at the local swimming pool is your most pressing concern rather than how to afford to pay for your children's shoes and food

I actually think its the other way around. I think the gender ideologists advocating for the removal of sex segregation are in the privileged position of never imagining themselves in prison or a refuge. Those are the places that financially poor women go. They don't give a shit about the most disadvantaged women in our society, as they aren't one of those women. Labour should be the party advocating for those women and I will never forgive them for selling these women so comprehensively down the river.

I completely agree, Labour have completely lost the plot and clearly do not give a shit about the most disadvantaged women in our society. They all seem to be lost to some bullshit student union politics.

"Same here. Agreeing with Sajid Javid. Has it really come to this??"

but apparently he under on line attacks for his words - how awful - hope he is getting some support .

These far left extremists are mainly extremely privileged white males. They have no clue about being a natal woman and zero interest in finding out. They just want to dictate their idea of correct thinking with #nodebate. We argue against it we are immediately accused of bigotry and transphobia. No middle ground whatsoever.

I have 3 daughters and as the previous poster noted, young women seem to be OK with the TWAW bollox. They want to appear kind and inclusive etc. It dismayed me that they were unwilling to engage on specifics e.g. prisons/sport/Stonewall law etc. It has taken a lot of (frequently heated) discussions with them to get them to acknowledge that women risk huge disadvantage from gender self ID. I showed them hard evidence of predatory males who had exploited the issue to offend or indulge some kink/fetish to the detriment of women and girls. The Wi Spa episode is a case in point.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4338925-Good-news-on-the-WI-Spa-incident

The issue of violence against women and girls seemed to strike a chord and we have been able to have more reasoned talks which have opened their eyes. It hasn't been easy to reach this point. The trouble is that TRAs have engineered a climate of 'no discussion / no debate'. We have to keep these issues open. We have to make our voices heard. It is important to make our young women as well as the policy makers aware. Keep it up.

I think young girls just are much more malleable to everything. I was as well. The things that feminists were ranting about twenty years ago just didn’t bother me. I liked the male gaze, I wasn’t bothered by flirting in the workplace and didn’t have career ambitions that would have seen me angry at lower pay etc. But then I got older and then I got angry.

So give them time 🤣

I have 3 daughters and as the previous poster noted, young women seem to be OK with the TWAW bollox. They want to appear kind and inclusive etc

I think this shows that feminism needs not just to focus on material goals, such as equal pay, establishing refuges, but in challenging social attitudes about how women should behave towards others, with this huge focus on being kind and giving and self-sacrificing.
These really are very old and misogynistic ideas about what a women should be. There is a lot of emphasis on kindness now and it makes me uncomfortable as it is so easily used as a stick to keep women in 'their place with'.

I think as a society we should be teaching girls and women that it is better to be boundaried than kind.

@FreeBritnee

I think young girls just are much more malleable to everything. I was as well. The things that feminists were ranting about twenty years ago just didn’t bother me. I liked the male gaze, I wasn’t bothered by flirting in the workplace and didn’t have career ambitions that would have seen me angry at lower pay etc. But then I got older and then I got angry.

So give them time 🤣

Sadly I agree, but much of it was also because I'd been programmed to acquiesce because I was female.

@FreeBritnee

I think young girls just are much more malleable to everything. I was as well. The things that feminists were ranting about twenty years ago just didn’t bother me. I liked the male gaze, I wasn’t bothered by flirting in the workplace and didn’t have career ambitions that would have seen me angry at lower pay etc. But then I got older and then I got angry.

So give them time 🤣

Totally agree. I didn’t want to upset anyone or ruffle any feathers when I was younger. ‘Smile sweetly and do not disagree’

Now…. Not so much.

I think as a society we should be teaching girls and women that it is better to be boundaried than kind.

So, so true

It's not a mistake that the older we get, the more aware we get.

Me aged 20: I can do anything. Who needs feminism?

Me age 30: I have a child. Oh, it's impacting my career. Structural sexism exists.

Me age 40: Fuck the patriarchy!

I dread to think what will happen when I start menopause.

I'm starting to wonder whether Keir (and Labour as a whole) genuinely want to get elected.

As for the Lancet. Are they now refering to 'bodies with a penis'? Bit transphobic if they're not.

These far left extremists are mainly extremely privileged white males.

Erm. Angela Rayner...

I think as a society we should be teaching girls and women that it is better to be boundaried than kind

Beautifully articulated