Will black lives ever matter?

[RockLock]

So another killing of a black man Ahmaud Arbery by 2 white men (Father and son) in US. They nearly got away with it calling it a citizen arrest and self defence. Father was a retired policeman.

They followed him, armed with guns and shot him.

Prosecutors tried to cover it up until the video emerged.
Ahmaud’s crime? He was going for a jog.

Will black lives ever matter?

Something bad happens to a woman - people on mumsnet: All men are violent and sexist! There is endemic sexism in the UK and the world!

Something bad happens to a black person - people on mumsnet: Well, come on now, not all white people. Everyone is equal. I’m certainly not racist, so...

Except that’s not exactly true - something bad happens to a woman and MN says ‘why do men allow this to happen?’. Something bad happens to a black person and MN asks ‘why are white people allowing this to happen?’

The problem here is people who think equality means ‘people being treated exactly the same’ rather than ‘fairness’.

Police brutality against black people in the U.K. www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/13/black-people-more-likely-to-have-force-used-against-them-by-police-data-shows

Saying “all lives matter” is like saying “men’s rights matter” - of course they do, this is obvious. However black lives have historically, and to this day, seemed to matter less to white people than white lives. That is proven statistically, and by the opinions here.

When your reaction to the lynching of a black man is, “but statistics show white people die too!” you are completely missing the point and reducing this horrific and racially-motivated death to an argument that essentially says this incident, and all the incidents like it, aren’t significant. It’s unbelievable.

Watching americans protesting about covid lockdown by waving guns about while wearing masks gloves, made me realise we really are different despite having a common language, so nothing surprises me any more.

Wisdom from @Lifeaback

The fact that people are even debating whether racism exists on a public forum like this makes me feel sick. I am white, I have never been subjected to racism in my life but unlike some people on this thread I’m very glad I don’t use my position of privilege as a reason to ignore racism and deny what a huge issue it is.

Opinions like this make me think that maybe, some people don’t think it’s OK for black and BAME people to be victimised.

Something bad happens to a woman - people on mumsnet: All men are violent and sexist! There is endemic sexism in the UK and the world!

Something bad happens to a black person - people on mumsnet: Well, come on now, not all white people. Everyone is equal. I’m certainly not racist, so...

Because people turn a blind eye to prejudice when it doesn't affect them. This forum is full of women, so sexism is keenly felt and acknowledged by most. But since the majority are white, most like to ignore racism or strongly play it down.

All lives matter. There are some disgusting people in the world but the extremely small minority dose not represent society as a whole. I think you are unreasonable for thinking it does

Completely agree - weed out the murderers, the racists, the abusers - don't mix them into a pot with innocent people so that they can hide away better.

YANBU, it's heartbreaking and i pray to god it changes.

And why is it so fucking obvious when put like that, @Monkeys? It's something that every one of us, especially anyone wondering about this:

He was fighting with one of the white men - yes, he has a gun pointed at him by a scared/angry man

He matched the description of a burgler - yes, he was black, male and moving

Who wouldn't try to avoid being shot? Do all black men look the same, any more than all Chinese men, or white men? Think about your own reaction to that.

There is a vast difference between not knowing / meeting many BAME individuals and believing that it is an easy mistake to make....

I may need to reword my posts, not sure they properly convey what mean.

Try looking at Brazil @Annamaria14.

If you believe what you see in the press, Gisele Bundchen is "the typical Brazilian". In reality, over 70% of the country is some form of mix, originating from slavery. You won't need me to tell you what proportion of Black Brazilians are trapped in favelas; class mobility there, especially if your skin is darker than a weak tea, is far worse than it is in the UK.

When I travelled to Brazil for the 2014 World Cup, I was completely shocked at how local black people were treated. I didn't expect to see anything like that at all.

I heard a man say once "thank god I am not a woman".

It made me sad and angry. That he knew how terrible the world was for women, but instead of helping them, he was thanking his luck that he was not a woman.

That is why I fight against racism.

As women, we have all been discriminated against and hurt.

It is a white man's world.

Think about all the times that we have been hurt and discriminated against as women?

Do we want to do that to some one else? We know what it feels like. How hard it is.

How can we expect men to stop treating us women like dirt, if we dont stop treating black/asian people like dirt.

The people in power are the ones that must make change

It's also the actions of the police after that sum it up. This took months to have anyone be charged and seems likely without the video nothing wouldve happened.

The man killed by the woman for being in his own flat. Police tried to dig stuff up on him despite it having no relevance to the case.

It shouldn't be that way! Crimes a crime..murder is murder..life is a life.

Everyone should be able to live their lives but police have to act to uphold the law and stats mean that this means they do stop more black people .

And shoot .ore unarmed black people.

Yes, but this particular person was murdered because the perpetrators thought that if a black man is running then he must be up to no good and should be confronted

I thought they actually lay in wait for him, the bastards. I think it must still be 1920 or something in Georgia, and probably other southern states. The combination of racism, esp institutional racism, and legal firearms makes it so hard to combat this stuff.

I wonder if they were wearing MAGA hats, too?

Really?

You have read the details, heard the despatch woman ask why they thought the black man was doing anything wrong, were told someone would be out to check anyway - twice she told the older man that!

Have heard they thought he might be a thief, because he was black and near a house under construction.

And chose to accost him with a gun, locked and loaded...

They saw him, armed themselves and chose to go out and find him, follow him and shoot him... The only thing that alarmed them was the colour of his skin!!!

Can you even begin to imagine what would happen to black people if they were protesting on capital steps in America while holding assault weapons ... like white people are doing to protest restrictions on movement/closures? They would be gunned down/arrested/vilified. Whereas for white america, white privilege in action right there.

Heck, black athletes can't even take a quiet knee at sporting events without scathing criticism, death threats, demands they be cut from their teams ... but white jackasses can parade around openly with assault weapons.

@lockeddownandcrazy Like British police who happily call me a Paki or raghead while unlawfully stopping and searching me?

Saying people should stop seeing racial prejudice is equally as stupid as saying people should stop seeing sex based prejudice.

"Trying to debate racism on Mumsnet is impossible. The prevailing attitude on MN is that racism doesn’t exist"

This forum is absolutely at its worst on this subject and the ridiculous points made here are repeated on every other MN thread about race issues. It seems to be acceptable to debate whether racism is even a thing and the experiences and opinions of non-white people are consistently ignored.

This every time. I don't know why it consistently suprises me and I can understand why many other POC on here refuse to engage in these threads.

RIP Ahmaud Arbery

They matter to most. Seemingly less so to some.
Prejudice is alive and well in every place, in every family. We must always be mindful of it, even within ourselves. It can be subtle, it can be brutal. Conscious, or subconscious. It can be black, white, male, female,

Have you seen the son in this case? He looks like something out of the hills have eyes.

My friend always said "the biggest defenders of the white race, are usually the worst examples of it"

... young or old.

It happens - could as easily have been a white person.

Do you honestly completely believe that?

That two men would see a white man jogging, decide he fits a "profile" and take guns to go and confront him? that's by their own admission, I doubt their thoughts were in any way civically minded. then shoot him, be free to go home and not be under investigation for moths?

Really?

YANBU

RIP Ahmaud. Your life will count.

Did you see that it took them two months to charge the father and son, aswell!