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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

OP posts:
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21
cozietoesie · 19/02/2017 22:37

And especially for Nevertheless

Destinysdaughter · 19/02/2017 22:38

Anyone going to any of the demonstrations tomorrow?

OhYouBadBadKitten · 19/02/2017 22:38

I hope they involve the ambassador.

cozietoesie · 19/02/2017 22:39

Oops. Kellyanne.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 19/02/2017 22:40

I am going to the anti state visit rally at Parliament square.

woman12345 · 19/02/2017 22:43

It's going to be busy! This is on too for the 3 million EU citizens.
www.the3million.org.uk/masslobby

amispartacus · 19/02/2017 22:45

Bernie Sanders ‏*@BernieSanders* 1m1 minute ago
More
It appears Mr. Trump, who attacks media that makes critical remarks about him as “fake news,” doesn't understand what democracy is about.

Nor what fake news is.

OP posts:
woman12345 · 19/02/2017 22:51

A bit off piste here, but, what happened to blue colour comedy in the US? Remember, Roseanne, Cheers, Taxi, then with Frasier it started to split off.

Comedy became segregated over here too. Digital apartheid has fuelled it in the real world.

TheClaws · 19/02/2017 23:01

So his story about Sweden wasn't a fake story? But a "...reference to what is happening...concerning immgrants and Sweden".

Hmm.

amispartacus · 19/02/2017 23:05

So his story about Sweden wasn't a fake story

It was dog whistling. Hinting. To his supporters. Based on part of a Fox news report.

I would love for Trump to explain what he actually meant. In more than 140 characters. And then have someone challenge him on the data / evidence.

OP posts:
Neverthelessshepersisted · 19/02/2017 23:09

video.foxnews.com/v/5327830979001/?#sp=show-clips

This is presumably what he watched.

Neverthelessshepersisted · 19/02/2017 23:11

The Fox News anchor is terrifying. I actually get what Trump is trying to say now.

AcrossthePond55 · 19/02/2017 23:19

You know something? I don't think I've heard of Trump being referred to as "Leader of the Free World". You often heard Obama, Bill Clinton, and even Dubya being called that by major network newscasters, politicians, and even foreign dignitaries. I don't think I've even heard Fox call Trump that.

Personally, I hate the title. I don't think any one nation's head of state should be called a 'Leader of the Free World'. I think it's demeaning to other nations.

cozietoesie · 19/02/2017 23:22

Xi Jinping is waiting in the wings. Wink

amispartacus · 19/02/2017 23:24

Watching that video

Smirking at the start
Use of the word 'migrant'

Then the 'evidence' - the Fox news guy is very biased as is the filmmaker - who comes out with his views despite what the Swedes are telling him

But it is just what Trump and his like want to hear..

Meanwhile

www.vox.com/world/2017/2/19/14662244/trump-sweden-terrorist-attack-fake

These claims have even made it into more mainstream outlets like National Review and Fox News. Friday night, Fox’s Tucker Carlson interviewed Ami Horowitz, a journalist who said that “from the onset of the refugee crisis, there was a surge in [Swedish] gun violence and rape.” Slate’s Daniel Politi theorizes Trump watched the segment, and hence decided to say something about Sweden in his subsequent speech.

That’s hard to say for sure. But the odds are, given the consistency of the narrative about Sweden in the right-wing mediasphere, that Trump heard one of these claims about a Swedish refugee rape epidemic somewhere — and appropriated them to justify his travel ban.

The problem, though, is that this “rape epidemic” is as fake as the Bowling Green Massacre.

Canadian reporter Doug Saunders rigorously investigated the narrative, and concluded that it “falls apart as soon as you speak to anyone knowledgeable in Sweden.” Official Swedish statistics do indeed show a high rate of rape, but that’s because Swedish law has an extremely expansive definition of what qualifies as rape under the law. Sweden has a higher official rape rate, in short, because its police are better able to investigate and prosecute sexual violence.

“What we’re hearing is a very, very extreme exaggeration based on a few isolated events, and the claim that it’s related to immigration is more or less not true at all,” Jerzy Sarnecki, a criminologist at Stockholm University, told Saunders.

These panics about immigration, instead, reflect a long history of sexual panics in the West about non-white immigrants. Scholars Selda Dagistanli and Kiran Grewal argue that warnings about an immigrant rape epidemic draw more on preexisting Western prejudices about the violent sexuality of Muslim men than they represent a reaction to actual facts. The so-called “rape epidemic” is just something anti-immigrant campaigners have latched on to to justify their preexisting desire to shut the door on Muslim migration.

So while Trump’s “last night in Sweden” slip up is pretty funny, it’s likely drawing on a pretty troubling narrative.

And as for no go zones?

Fox has form for this:

www.theguardian.com/media/2015/jan/12/fox-news-expert-ridiculed-over-birmingham-is-totally-muslim-city-claims

It is incredible that POTUS would watch Fox news and then use their report in a speech.

It is a good thing he didn't talk about Birmingham.

OP posts:
PlectrumElectrum · 19/02/2017 23:44

That clip that trump appears to have watched gives such a glaring illustration of how easily sucked in he is, how utterly lacking in critical thinking & how shallow his intellect must be, to see that report and regurgitate it as some factual reflection of Sweden - which even the reporter acknowledges isn't a belief held by anyone he spoke to.

Every day something new to boggle my brain. Confused

originalbiglymavis · 19/02/2017 23:50

I was wondering about Sweden when I heard it too (listening to radio in bed, too lazy to turn over to turn it off). I thought 'hello, it's not been on mumsnet, so it's probably not real'.

He wants to get on here.

And I had dreams where I was arguing with everyone.

Lweji · 19/02/2017 23:52

But it was still something that didn't happen the previous night in Sweden. It was a report about the supposed effects of migration into the country.
He didn't mention a report about what migrants do.

"You look at what's happening last night in Sweden,"

It highlights the importance of being very clear and using the right words.

StatisticallyChallenged · 20/02/2017 00:03

Unfortunately I think it suits him to be unclear and as vague as possible, because then he or his minions can say "oh, no, we meant this actually"

Specificity is the enemy of alternative facts

PausingFlatly · 20/02/2017 00:26

Specificity is the enemy of alternative facts

^^ This.

cozietoesie · 20/02/2017 00:49

I meant to say, Across - don't close off your mind to the thought for ever. Maybe it's too much to ask right now but politics needs passion as well. I think you have that. Smile

TheClaws · 20/02/2017 00:49

ami I don't know about you, but I'd like any serving POTUS to have comprehension skills above an eight year old's. Other useful skills:

  • able to read moderately complex to highly complex documents
  • long attention span
  • patience
  • diplomacy
  • public speaking (without revolting and/or confusing audience)
  • apply confidentiality appropriately
  • understand "appropriate"
  • treat world leaders with tact and due consideration
  • wisdom.

I can wish can't I? Wink

cozietoesie · 20/02/2017 00:55

I 'understand' that in the later years (of his second term) RR was given to spending much of his time sitting in the Residence and watching movies. He delegated well though - and he had halfway reasonable people to delegate to.

saffronwblue · 20/02/2017 01:39

He thought it happened last night because he saw it on tv last night. He has no differentiation between TV land and the real world. He will probably send someone to round up the Simpsons soon.
I worry that he may not understand the difference between Iran and Iraq.

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