To ask if you agree with forced sterilisation?

[NeedACleverNN]

An acquaintance I know has been court ordered to be sterilised. No choice.

I don't know the exact details but I do know several children have already been removed on welfare issues.

Whilst I feel sorry for her because she loves children, I do think the judge made the right choice. She has a few mental health problems and struggles to take care of herself let alone dependent children.

Do you think judges should be able to do this or not?

I have surprised myself by being quite conflicted by this.

The concept as a whole contravenes so wholly everything I believe in about female body autonomy.

Yet I imagine there are cases where it would be the best and safest thing.

I wouldn't like to be the judge having to make that decision

No, never.

It's a tough one isn't it.

I don't agree peope have the right to force anyone to do anything with their bodies that they don't want.

however when people are basically being forced to get pregnant ( with severe enough LDS/MH issues etc that they just don't understand what's actually going on) by partners taking advantage of their vulnerable states, or their lives and/or mental health are at severe risk then that poses such a dilemma.

I couldn't make that call.

I don't envy the judges who have to...

The concept as a whole contravenes so wholly everything I believe in about female body autonomy.

^ This.

I didn't think was legal!
Which country are you in?
I too am conflicted about this.

As a last resort, yes, for males and females.

Children don't ask to be born into abusive mayhem. Preventing that is, in my opinion, more important that female/male body autonomy.

Any chance they are going to sterilize all the men who had sex with her? Does she have capacity to consent? If not, are those men in prison?

Its a tough one!!

My friend is a foster carer of a little boy who has 7 siblings all in the care system and 1 who has been adopted the mother was made to be sterilised which I can see why as she doesn't and won't ever get those kids back due to neglect!

And it's ok saying she might change which would be great but she should concentrate on getting those kids rather than having more!

This post won't go down well!

The concept as a whole contravenes so wholly everything I believe in about female body autonomy

but what happens when they don't truly have it anyway?

either from abusive or manipulative partners

or from geographical or religious prevention of access to birth control..

And yy to the men being in prison.

they have to he found first I guess.

More detail would be interesting as few doctors in the uk would be willing to do the operation and a court would be very very reluctant to try even for a patient who had been sectioned or was a ward of court. Are you sure they haven't been presented with a choice that makes sterilisation the least worst option? I'm not saying that is not itself coercive but forced sterilisation would be a massive news story were it to happen on the terms you imply.

No, never. I cannot reconcile any possible ways that it could protect somebody with the complete loss of autonomy and control that it entails. Horrific.

Does she have understanding of what is happening? Of preganancy and how to prevent it? How vulnerable is she? Does she want more children?

I didn't realise this was legal tbh.

I am in the uk and I don't know anything about her bf. I only know this action because I know her mum.

It's a difficult one and yeah I would hate to be the judge in that case

In the uk really never heard of this it must have been a severe case im all for body autonomy but a child does not ask to be born abused and neglected if a woman is not caring for several children then i do think she should stop having babies in needs to be a case by case decision obviously

What would the alternative be? Repeatedly getting pregnant and having the babies removed? Never having sexual intercourse?

Thank god I'm not a judge.

This is not my acquaintance but it has happened before

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-31128969

there was a case not so long ago wasn't there?

of a woman giving birth to previous babies in a dirty home. they sterilised her I think when she had her 6th or 7th chikd by c section and discovered her uterus was paper thin and another pregnancy would kill her.

If I remember correctly she was mentally not all there, she didnt have full understanding.

I guess the reason they choose the mum rather than the man.is because it's her life that's at immediate risk and should she move on to another man, one who hasn't been sterilised then she's dead...

x post

It's such a hard one, couldn't they force women in this situation to have a coil or monthly injection and then an application can be made in future to have it removed or stopped? At least that gives an opportunity for recovery and rehabilitation to allow a family in the future.

Yes, those are the sort of extreme circumstances where it could be justified. Presumably if the case you are talking about were as extreme you would know.

They have to show up for the injections

might not be possible witg an unwilling partner.

could can be removed or fail. there's the chance of a diy remove at home too.

Some people cant be rehabilitated to be better parents you can throw all the classes and support at them and nothing changes

I was thinking of a court supervised arrangement where they have to attend for the monthly injection or a checkup or be called back to court. Sterilisation is just so extreme and final