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Adoption

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Original poster

What are grandparents rights for adoption??

94 replies

lijaco15 · 02/06/2007 21:56

Our 3 week old grandchild is being removed from my son's girlfriend into foster care. She has emotional problems and been through care herself. Does anybody know procedures and what rights we may have as grandparents???

OP posts:
Jennylee · 02/06/2007 21:57

I hope someone will post with experience of this . but you should get some legal advice first thing Monday.

edam · 02/06/2007 22:05

what jenny said - see a solicitor who knows about family law pdq.

Original poster
lijaco15 · 02/06/2007 22:06

I do plan to seek legal advice asap. Thanks for your reply . I am new to this website.

OP posts:
rantinghousewife · 02/06/2007 22:10

Right, just had a look at my CAB stuff, there is a section on care orders and people who may be party to court proceedings (assuming ss have initiated court proceedings). As follows;
In a court case, the people who are entitled to make a case to the court and have a lawyer to represent them are called parties to the proceedings. The following people are or can be parties in care proceedings:-
the local authority is always a party
the child is always a party. The child will be able to obtain publicly-funded legal services, without having to meet the criteria
anyone who has parental responsibility is always a party. They can obtain publicly-funded legal services, without having to meet the criteria
anyone else, including a relative, who has an interest in the child's upbringing can apply to be made a party to the proceedings. The relative would then be able to apply for publicly-funded legal services subject to meeting the financial eligibility criteria. S/he does not have to meet the other criteria.
Hope this helps, if not consider this a bump, so maybe someone more knowledgeable can help.

Original poster
lijaco15 · 02/06/2007 22:17

That helps a lot as I was told by the social worker that I could not be involved in proceedings. That I would have to do it seperately. The Interim care order was carried out at birth but mother and father did not stick to plan. The next court hearing is this month. I will have to apply to be involved then? I will be seeking legal advice this coming week.

OP posts:
rantinghousewife · 02/06/2007 22:20

Yes, might be best to see the solictor, I would also pop into your local CAB and see if you can get some up to date info re: your actual rights etc. They can print out info for you and give a clearer picture of how to deal with ss. Good luck.

KristinaM · 06/06/2007 08:56

Do not rely on social services to tell you your rights. they are often wrong. you woudl think that they shoudl be concerned about what is right for teh child, but in pratice their main concern is to make their own job easier. however nice/kind/sympathetic they seem.do not trust them. Work with them but DO NOT TRUST THEM.

if i were you i woudl get independent advice asap. put everything in writing. do you and your Dh want to care for the child,lijaco15? in the short term or the long term? Do you have the health/space/money to do this? Have you thought how this would affect your relationship with your son? If you dont want to care for the child, how do you want to be involved?

lizziemun · 06/06/2007 09:37

Someone on here has adopted her grandson last year.

I can't who it was but hopefully someone will let you know.

CarGirl · 06/06/2007 09:43

I also know someone who adopted their GC, the child had been removed from mother by SS (and yes she needed to be in this situation), part of the adoption critera was that the grandparents have had to agree to have no future contact with their daughter the GC mother.

Is your son interested in obtaining sole parental responisibility for his child?

Original poster
lijaco15 · 06/06/2007 21:39

This is a very long story. My son is now 17 years of age and basically got into the wrong crowd of people. He started smoking cannabis at 14 years of age, staying out and not coming home. Taking recreational type drugs, got into trouble with police. He was permanently excluded from school. We have tried everything to get him on track. We have had a difficult time as he has been brought up well and loved very much. We miss the way he used to be. We are also aware that his girl friend is violent to him. It is very long and complicated but he cannot be considered for this reason. We feel like we have been to hell and back. As parents we feel like we are also trying to prove that we are not like this. I have seen my grandson twice since he was born three weeks ago. We are being treated like we cannot be trusted. Social services justify this as we have the same rights as son's girlfriends mother bearing in mind she has had all 7 children removed due to neglect and abuse. The girlfriend is now at foster placement with baby as they want to give her every opportunity. I agree with this. The issue for me now is that I don't seem to have much right to see baby. Social services seem to tell lies also. I do not trust them.

OP posts:
mylittleimps · 06/06/2007 21:49

take legal advice very soon. be very very nice to SS but don't take what they say at face value

KristinaM · 06/06/2007 23:34

I am so sorry to hear your sad story. please dont think that anyone on mumsnet will judge you because of your son, there are lots of mums here who have been through very difficult times with their teenagers.they are "adults" and sadly they often dont make very good choices

you need to think about what you and your Dh want. do you want to aply to adopt your grandchild? becase if your son and his Gf are not able to parent the child, they will be looking for a permanent family for him. they will not keep him in foster care just so his grandparenst can visit him IYSWIM. If your grandson is adopted, there is very little chance that you woudl be abel to still have contact with him. Could you live with that, knowing that he is placed with a loving family?

If you did adopt the baby, how woudl it affect your relationship with your son?

chipkid · 06/06/2007 23:49

I am a family barrister.

You have a vital role to play in these proceedings if you are considering putting yourself forward as an alternative carer for the child in the event that the Local Auhtority and the Court rule out the mother as carer.

If you are considering putting yourself forward DO NOT DELAY. Tell the LA that you wished to be assessed as a carer for the child. get yourself a solicitor to consider whether you should apply to become a party at this stage. With a baby things have to move pretty fast.

In terms of contact, with a child this age, your contact is not going to be considered a priority at this stage. There is no relationship to maintain and the most important part of the process at this point will be an on-going assessment of the relationship between the child and mother.

However you should ask (or get your solicitor to ask) the LA about their plans for your contact.They may be willing to put something in place at this stage

HTH I can imagine the turmoil that you must be going through. I hope it has a positive outcome for you.

lisad123 · 07/06/2007 00:05

I work for SS. You need to call the social worker on monday and express your wish to care for the child. You then need to instruct a solictor of your wish to come "party to procedings".
You need to tell your solictor you want to care for this child asap, and get him to ask social work team for any reason why you cant care for the child while court is ongoing.

They might ask for assessment of you instead and child may stay in FC until completed. Please be prepared to be asked some very hard and personal questions.

You need to request contact if you are planning to apply to care for child, and may be asked how you will manage contact between baby and your son if baby lives with you.

I hope some of thats helpful. Good luck

Lisa

lisad123 · 07/06/2007 00:11

And thanks so much for the comments about social service Some of us do try and do whats best for the child. but understand this comment as I have met some terrible social workers

viticella · 07/06/2007 00:22

Don't think I can add anything to last two posters but thinking of you and your family lijaco.

I recently adopted two little boys, I sometimes wonder about their "other" grandparents and it must be hard for them. Realistically you may need to think in the longer term e.g. having letterbox contact so there is a positive relationship when child is grown up. But it is very early days.

KristinaM · 07/06/2007 08:56

thank you lisa for not getting about people not rating Sws. i'm sure it must feel a personal attack on you but its not. I knwo there are some good ones out there (I have worked with two or three over the years) but i'm afraid they are the exceptions rather than the rule.

My main concern in thsi situation is that SW are NOT solicitors and they often give out legal advice which is VERY misleading and which clients rely on and only find out they were wrong when its "too late". They sometimes present themselves as experts when they are not.

My other concern is that if a relative presents asking "what are our rights?", its easy to dismiss them, glibly stating in reports that they only seem concerned about themselves and not the welfare of the child.So the Gp need to knwo what to say and how to say it

another concern would be that son's gf ( baby's mother) will be judged in terms of her background and not her own abilities. i knwo that her own experince in care makes her "high risk" but she needs support and a chance to see if she CAN cope, while still keeping teh baby safe. but its worrying that teh baby is in care so young

woopsadaisy · 07/06/2007 09:15

My grandparents tried to adopt my half sister, as her mother and father were both unsuitable drug addicts, but the court told them they were too old (they were in there 60's)
in the end, she was put into foster care and then my father got custody of her, whislt she ended up pratically living with my nan and grandad anyway
my sisters mother died and then my dad did, and she was looked after by brother and finally went to foster care (this is over a period of about 10 years)

after my dad died, my sister had a nervous breakdown at school and told of some of the awful things that had happened to her and things she had to do

i beleive she would have been much better off and stabilised if my grandparents had of had custody (a fact social services later admitted)

so all i would say was get a bloody good soliciter and fight all the way, this way the child can grow up with its family, but in a stabile loving home with you

Original poster
lijaco15 · 07/06/2007 10:07

My son and girlfriend have now gone missing I have found out this morning. Police are out looking for them. I am very worried as I was informed by girlfriend's mother. We have become used to the fact that my son lives between friends etc and will not come home and live normally. So seeing him a few days at a time has become the usual. But his girlfriend been missing for three days and I have never been told. She needs to be with baby at foster carers. Very worried now about drugs. I have an appointment tomorrow with a solicitor.

OP posts:
woopsadaisy · 07/06/2007 10:13

Im really sorry

i hope everything is o.k

good luck

Jennylee · 07/06/2007 10:16

that is awful news, I hope they find her, i am glad you are seeing a solicitor, I hope that they are found soon and that you get custody , it must be so stressful not being able to help right away.

fairyjay · 07/06/2007 10:16

You must be going through hell. I can't offer any advice, just hope that you can find the strength to keep pushing for access.

KristinaM · 07/06/2007 10:32

I am so so sorry. this is bad news...the poor baby. you must be worried sick

do you and your Dh want to adopt the baby, assuming that his mother is not allowed to keep him?

I hope you have a good solicitor

fireflyfairy2 · 07/06/2007 10:38

Have they taken the baby with them Lijaco?

If not then that is maybe best for the baby.

I hope you get something sorted soon, you sound like you have the best interests of your grandchild at heart xoxo

KristinaM · 07/06/2007 11:06

you need to ask the solicitor....

if/when your son and gf return, will they still allow the Gf to stay in foster care with the baby? i suspect not, as they will be worried she will abscond with baby

are SS planning to move the baby to another placement? they may do so if they fear his mother will take him

will you still get access?

i am not a lawyer but i suspect this will have moved things onto a different level

you have not answered my question about whether or not you want to take on thsi baby. if you do you need to act fast.

i think that your son lives with you some of the time, is that right? that coudl complicate things i think

you really REALLY need good legal advice

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