What’s happening in Venezuela and what does it mean?

[theotherfossilsister]

I’m confused- has the US gone to war with them? What are the implications if so?

Or not captured the leader...

Tbh, not the most reliable news source. They tend to have an agenda on most things. If Trump thinks there’s a drug problem with importing drugs into America, then he needs to deal with at his side, ie clamp down with security to stop the drugs coming in, rather than take the war to Venezuela, where inevitably there will be innocent lives lost. It just doesn't make sense.

Maria Corina Machado spoke about this with the BBC a little (at 14.50 minutes) in December . . .

@Livelovebehappy unfortunately there are no reliable news sources anymore - even the Beeb has its own agenda

The only thing we can do is read as much as we can from as many sources as possible, then apply liberal doses of sense

Mexico, China and Columbia are where the drugs come from. But Trump says they come from 2 of the world’s largest oil reserves countries; Venezuela and Canada.

This is not a coincidence.

Become! Look at their history fgs.

Apparently delta force, which wouldn’t suggest they asked him nicely if he wouldn’t mind getting on the helicopter. Seriously, is Trump any better than Putin, any country that has anything he wants(Greenland) needs to be concerned

Drugs are the excuse, oil is the reason. Venezuela has the largest reserves of heavy crude oil in the world. Heavy crude is what the US used to produce and what their refinement infrastructure is set up to deal with. Currently the US is producing a lot of light crude with the new method of fracking. They don't have the capacity to refine all of it so they sell the crude abroad not the refined oil. So they are losing profits.

Putin and Trump have the same playbook.

This. The man's a maniac and SO many people voted for him - twice.

I’m actually less scared of Putin, that in itself scares me.

Oil. Oil. Oil.
That's what it's all about.
The problem is that Donald lost his second term to Creepy Old Joe but has had 5 years to work out exactly what he was going to do when he got back in (and learned from his mistakes)..... and he's now doing it all in spades. He will find reasons to 'help' democracy in various areas around the world that just happen to be oil/gas/mineral rich. One day someone or some country objecting to US interference will fight back or will retaliate with an attack on US soil. At that point Don will declare martial law, suspend the constitution allowing him to go for a third term and hey presto, the USA is back in civil war.

It would have been better if Trump had won his second term the first time round as he was flailing in his inexperience and because term 2 would have been the same as term 1. Right now a new president would have been busy picking up the pieces and setting things to rights if only Donald hadn't lost that 2 term 6 years ago.

Nothing new whatsoever. The whole ‘weapons of mass destruction’ charade in the ME was just an excuse for Cheney and his cronies to annex oil reserves, but they bullied/begged other countries to get involved (including Tony ‘I’m definitely not a war criminal’ Blair) just to give them a veil of propriety.

Trump gives less than zero fucks about propriety, but other than that it’s just good ol’ US oil business as usual. He’s testing boundaries every which way and I honestly think his ultimate goal is a bare-faced carve up of the planet and its resources between him, Putin and Xi Jinping.

Grabby Trump. As usual thinking they have a god given right over any other country to just steal their resources. Iran is also being threatened if they challenge protesters, despite Trump using the army to keep peace in American cities.

His intentions are blatant, but clear and consistent. You can 'risk manage' that kind of stuff. Its the unpredictability of Trump that's frightening. Genuinely deluded ... its all very 1936.

Not sure what will happen but listening to what Venezuela is like for those not in the controlling class.

Starvation, mass emigration and malnutrition.

And if we know anything about American intervention, it will remain so after. Just with less oil.

Countries don't get better when the US interferes.

I agree with you Trump should not have got involved, there was no need. Venezuela turned to Socialism in 1999 and today its GDP per capita (in real terms) is less than it was pre Socialism. Ironically the parents that encouraged socialism now see their children starve... as is always the way under socialism everyone gets poorer.

The people would soon enough overthrow their government albeit after much bloodshed which has been ongoing for years now, Trump perhaps has helped that process along and the Venezuelans should take the opportunity to better their lives. Worst case they get another socialist and get even poorer.

But yes Trump should have kept out, Venezuela needs to sort it's own issues; it's not up to America to keep policing the world (though people complain when they do stop policing the world for example contributing to NATO, the meat grinder in Ukraine etc. They complain when America withdraws from places and complain when they engage in places!).

@theotherfossilsister

An explainer from Vox

Oh you should be as scared of Putin as you are of Trump @Simonjt
Putin will get a lot of Eastern Europe back if everything goes according to the plan he and Donald have cooked up. There isn't a stronger enough leadership in Europe to withstand Russian aggression and they know it.
The possible scenario will be Ukraine will eventually be forced to cede territory, a presidential election will be forced and a Putin puppet will win. Putin will take Ukraine and then push with little resistance into the former soviet territories because Europe is weak because it acts as a whole unit as the EU - this could be Europe's downfall.
The UK really, really needs to build up military units and equipment very quickly.

There’s wealth there it’s all being held by a few at the top. Their socialism is very much not working for the people.

MAGA base might not want more intervention I’m not sure.

I think it is really about oil

I’m absolutely delighted to see the back of Maduro. He has violently oppressed his own people and is guilty of the most vile human rights abuses. Hopefully the quarter or so of the population who have fled because of him ca now safely return.

I don’t think anyone is under the impression Venezuela is doing really well, and that Maduro is a great a democratically elected leader.

That’s not really relevant though. Should we bomb every country with a corrupt leader. And let’s not pretend Trump is doing this in an attempt to help anyone.

Hmm depends on proximity, next door to Putin most would have good reason to fear him.

There seems reason to fear the leader of Venezuela too hence people leaving en masse or starving.