On and On and On It Goes - Trump thread #148

[Spandauer]

It's been 9 horrible months and I find myself looking back on those "eating the cats and dogs" days with nostalgia.

Previous thread:
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5392716-grotesque-greedy-gullible-graceless-gaslighting-gormless-god-forsaken-grifter-trump-thread-147

@PerkingFaintly we are as one on your last post. I'm annoyed over pushing the "he wanted to debate" and as soon as I saw the "prove me wrong" slogan I wanted to reply, "no, you prove that you're right".

I have watched some of the TikTok debates and CK's super power was that he allowed the other person to speak and didn't get angry in his responses. This approach made him come across as calm, peaceful, and open to hearing the opinion of others when in fact he was pushing his own agenda.

I felt hopeless watching the interview of the young Black man (14 when he met Kirk at a Turning Point rally), who said he was determined to continue Kirk's legacy. Did he not listen to the things that Kirk actually said about Black people?

Agreed about the 'debate' crap. I've watched a few things on youtube and I didn't see someone letting the other person speak, I saw him shouting them down. Interesting that he appeared to in other contexts, maybe it depended on the audience. Put me in mind of one of my exes. Chilling.

Why is there no outrage about the lack of 'thoughts and prayers' about the poor school children murdered on the same day? Crickets 😥

The BBC reported yesterday that his roommate was also his partner. Anyway, I sense some resistance to mention trans on here so I won't poke the bear.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ckgzevzwxwro
Hartlepool being put to use. I'm guessing this will help us in removing Russia's clutches slightly. Good to see govt is going to be making the most of the incoming spectacle.

@lifesabitchandthenyoudie there's quite a difference between his behaviour in 'debates' in the US and at Cambridge. Possibly because in the US some of his questioners appeared to be people who wanted to make their own point but were unprepared for counter arguments. His quick speed of speech is also a way of putting pressure on the other person.

Put me in mind of one of my exes. Chilling.

YES!

I think as women most of us probably get that clenched feeling when a man says "But I only want to talk!"

We know from sad experience that no, that probably isn't all they want. Their ulterior aim may vary, but it's almost always there.

@FirstCuppa Don't you wonder why there is this fixation with the trans angle? Trans was never mentioned in Melissa Hortman's killing

Just for clarification: US roommate = UK flatmate. There is an exception, yes—many first year university students who live in on-campus housing share more closely, ie, more than one student in a bedroom. There are also many fraternity and sorority houses who have this setup, and some fraternities with an individual/few people study/desk/wardrobe bedroom + group sleeping barracks setup.

I’m confused about the timeline—he’s a 22 year old man who left university after only one semester. So is this trans flatmate someone he shared close quarters with 4 years ago, for one semester, in university housing? (There are no accounts of the suspect living in a fraternity house.) Or is he a current flatmate in a house share type situation?

Trop petit, trop tard.

Agree!
'I only want to talk' = 'I only want to sweet talk you until you trust me and then I can more easily exploit you'

Channel 4 to mark Trump’s UK visit with ‘longest uninterrupted reel of untruths’

Broadcaster to dedicate Wednesday night schedule to unpicking US president’s false or misleading statements

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/sep/15/channel-4-donald-trump-uk-state-visit-reel-of-untruths

No - I think it is because there have been multiple shootings with them as the perpetrator. I was hoping for a discussion as to why the rise in them doing it was happening; perhaps to do with the guy the shooter in this instance was keen on. I don't see it as a left "problem" because on the whole they are raised by the far right and that is the reason they feel so much shame and hatred that they kill, even if they "self identify" with the left, their background and environment has instilled self-disgust thanks to the inflexible thinking of the right. It's only the ones raised in those families that have nothing to lose.

The killer of CK wasn't trans though and his motivations are as yet unknown.

I assume they are a tiny minority of the US population, as they are here, which means it's a significant factor. In this case his partner is trans and the victim was talking about trans on a large screen to an audience with speakers (he would have heard) so I do think it is relevant. I don't know why everyone on here is so keen to ignore it and not discuss why suddenly there is a spate where they are involved in political executions. I wasn't going to poke the bear again as there's obviously an undercurrent but I was asked a question. In my mind I simply don't see it as a left issue - the ones raised by far right who aren't allowed to be gay are the ones trained in guns and becoming a threat to everyone in society, for whatever motivation. I think it's them howling to the moon, personally.

https://www.politifact.com/article/2025/sep/09/trans-people-mass-shootings-gun-violence/

In this case his partner is trans

It's still an assumption, the killer is not talking so far.

BBC, Telegraph and Guardian all saying that s/he has confirmed s/he is the killer's partner.

Actual Trans people might be a tiny minority. But if you define as "Trans adjacent" anyone who knows someone who might have been trans. And define "might have been trans" as was photographed with a cute filter or in a onesie (which seems to be driving the theories about the roommate) then you have a much larger number of people that covers Especially when the person in question is a college aged, very immersed in meme culture white male. Also, there isn't actually any evidence the roommate was trans. Internet edgelords also post that sort of stuff. I think you would need a degree in weird internet subcultures to unlock this at this stage.

Also do we know he was raised in an extreme right wing family? Trump supporting isn't the same as extreme right wing- that's half the US. I think there's a need to make this mean something - right wingers want it to prove the left is inherently violent. People on the left want it to be about right wing extremism/oppressive families. He might be such a weird guy that it's impossible to actually get closure on what he is so people can keep arguing it forever.

An undercurrent of what exactly, not being willing to blame all of the US’ ills on a marginalised community?

Maybe it would make more sense to talk about why the vast majority of mass shootings in the US are perpetrated by white men. https://rockinst.org/gun-violence/mass-shooting-factsheet/

The Utah governor has also said that the authorities do not yet know if that is relevant to the investigation.

Obviously men commit the most violent crime, globally.
That is all part of why I was asking the question as to why men who transition in America seem to be getting angry enough to shoot, very publicly, people they don't like. The transmen (women who transition) are never an issue, because women aren't as violent.
To say it is a man issue then takes you back to the issue of the ideology and we upset anyone who believes they can become a woman.
So we have to say it is a transwoman issue.

Anyway, my initial question was more about if anyone who had heard of these far right chatshow host / non-politicians knew if they had been goading the trans community in some way or why the shooter preferred the futher right guy over Kirk, but we've gone back to a tightrope walk over ideology instead, so I'll hazard a guess no one here knows.

@FirstCuppa until Tyler Robinson talks about his motives, everything is hearsay and speculation.

Really needs an animated graphic, like this ...

Neil Diamond! Santana! The Eagles!

@FirstCuppa , this thread might interest you.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5410116-charlie-kirk-assassin-was-living-with-trans-roommate