23 and 18?

I don't see any problem, especially as the woman is doing a degree apprenticeship rather than a straight degree. The fact that she is working and earning makes her more equal than if she was at university.

They're newly dating. Both sound happy with the age gap, so your DD's calling it creepy are being ott.

My first serious boyfriend was 25 when I was 18, pre-university. Your daughters should stop commenting.

I dated a 23yo when I was 19, and absolutely did not, and do not on later reflection, feel that there was a big power/experience/maturity difference. I was a second year student, he was a newly qualified primary teacher, with loans to pay off and expensive rent, so the income difference didn't seem crazy either.

He did later ditch me for someone his own age though!

Back in my generation (30 years ago) it wouldn't have been anything remarkable at all. In fact we were actively not interested in boys from our own cohort / school year and always looked at least one, but preferably two or three years older, and maybe more once we'd left school.

At just 18 I was dating a 21 year old, as was my best friend with the full knowledge and consent of our parents, and at 20 I was in a comfortable relationship with a man of 26 which was a relatively big gap but no one was worried about it.

Fast forward 30 years and that has changed; my children are very squeamish about any gap more than 12 months. It's odd.

The sisters are probably thinking about themselves at that age - if they were still in full time education, moved to uni and then didn’t see themselves as adults /grown ups until 21/22 when they got first proper job, they might be struggling to see her as different. But this young woman is in a professional job, she may well be at the stage the sisters (and possibly brother) hit at 21/22.

I do think life stage rather than straightforward age matters more for age gaps.

This maturity excuse for inappropriate age gaps is bollocks, working doesnt mean you are emotionally mature, doing a job for a wage can never be the equivalent of a 5 years life experience! Her brain hasnt even matured yet. He has experienced the world for 5 years more than her. In everything else, like driving or doing a job or hobby, experience counts for something and is recognised as an advantage but when it comes to accessing young women, a bloke having a longer life experience gets dismissed and her lack of experience in life is exaggerated under the guise of maturity and even if she is slightly more mature than 18 year olds she would be better off with an equally maturre 18 year old who is also getting treated like he is older and feels equally alienated to other 18 year olds.

Its always the excuse the girl is mature, nobody wants to say that perhaps the guy is emotionally stunted and immature for his age, thats why he gets on with much younger women. I just think your son is on a creepy path.

I was 17 and still at school when I met DH who was 21. A four year gap used to be considered quite normal.

23 is still very young, and many men take a lot longer to mature than women. If she's immature or vulnerable in some other way then it might be cause for concern, but is think it's fine. Back when I was at uni, I dated a couple of men in their 20s where it works have been 4-6 year gap; post-grad and work colleagues (I worked through uni). Nothing serious, didn't work for me, but really not an issue. Over 25 would start getting a bit odd, over 30 wildly inappropriate. I guess the younger generation have slightly tighter rules on this, but his sisters should give him the benefit of the doubt.

It's fine, it seems competely normal to me. My oldest DD first serious boyfriend was about that age when they got together & she was 18. They went out together for over 4 years (although she broke his heart in the end). In no way was she exploited, used or vulnerable, she is fine and now very happy in a new relationship. I don't recall anyone thinking it was creepy or odd, Mumsnet seems so odd about this stuff

Why does society only bring up that men mature at a slower rate than women when they are justifying men dating younger women.

it’s never used in any other girls of life - for example to explain why women should get promoted earlier (because they don’t!).

surely these more mature young women should earn more, be given greater responsibility, be allowed to drive and bite earlier? The only ‘privilege’ they get for their greater maturity is some older bloke dating them!!!!

The only problem here is your nasty Daughters.

Your son sounds more mature than your daughters - who come across as more like 8 & 10 than 18 & 20

Not a big deal.
Personalities play a big role at that kind of age gap.
Your dd's are being hyper sensitive to sexually inappropriate behaviour and I'd be more pissed off they think so badly of their brother unless he's got form for being an arse to women.
Maturity at the young adult level can vary widely. It's not automatically a power imbalance which could be creepy.
They need to think about what they're actually implying about their brother (assuming he's a decent guy).

When I was 18 I had two relationships with a noticeable age gap.
One was creepy, the guy was a creep.
The other was not we had a good connection and the relationship was based on respect right to the end.

If you’re going to say anything, don’t be surprised if you get told it’s none of your business. Because he’d be right. Your opinion aside, you don’t get a vote on the matter.

What exactly would you say to your son, and what will be your response when he tells you to mind your own business?

I think it's absolutely fine. Girls mature earlier than boys so I expect they're around the same level of maturity.

Looking at it the other way round I would have no issue with my 18yo DD dating a 23yo …. So long as he was a good guy (but that would apply to any age gap)

MoonRiverBlue My DH is 5 years older than me, does that make him a creep ? She is an adult.

Now I’m a bit more awake I wanted to add something. I work with 18 year old apprentices and they are definitely not regarded the same as other colleagues, they are trainees and v young and even the people in their early mid twenties regard them as the “babies” of the office. Not that they’d say that but it’s true. We have 23/24 year old staff and also older apprentices and tbh it’s hard to picture them thinking it’s ok to/wanting to date the 18 year olds. If one of them did I can imagine other people at work judging them or being concerned. When I was early twenties I remember one colleague aged 24 who would date/have sex with 18 year old trainee, we all thought he was grim.

So it might be colleagues as well as his sisters who are keeping a watchful eye on your son. He’s new to the job too so he wants to make sure he’s being responsible and looking decent to his colleagues.

sorry, but I think it’s absolute nonsense that a 23-year-old nearly 24-year-old graduate might not have much more life experience than a newly minted 18-year-old. All university students have more freedom than a 17 year old!

I really don't see a problem with this. I was 17, almost 18, and my husband was 22 when we first met. We got our first flat three months later, and are still together 48 years later.

It's your daughers OP, that generation is massively puritanical and for some reason seem to see themselves as children till they're about 30.
A few decades ago 16 was a working adult.

It's not just MN that's obsessed with age gaps. My DH is 7 years younger than me. We met at work,he thought I was a lot younger. His brother said the man should be x years older than the woman. We've been together 35 , years, married 25. At 38, I went out with a 25 year old, 21 and 18 year olds at work asked me out.

It really isn’t creepy. It’s not like he’s hanging around sixth forms actively seeking them out. He met her at work, they clicked, it’s fine.

My Ds is 20 and goes out with a just 18 yr old, my other kids called him a paedo - they are very strange these days in regards to age gaps.