It’s lovely to still have so many friends from school…

Hogwarts, obvs.

I weigh less than a duck.

I remain endlessly fascinated by the men who insist they are women, but then seem distressed to discover they don't actually like women that much.

And whose behaviour is always instantly identifiable as being of the same sex class as that bloke in that work meeting who always insists on asking your male subordinate questions only you can answer and then goes red in the face when you point this out.

Sorry, further to my pp, I should clarify it's this duck

I wear a lot of black and have been known to have a hairy chin.
Not sure if that makes me a witch or a transwoman though.

I am really annoyed with 15 year old me. I denied the true witch in me, fell for the social and medical pressure and got them frozen off.

I feel so let down by the people around me who told me I wasn't a witch, when it's obvious I was born a bloody witch, and that in order to be a proper girl I'd need to remove an essential part of who I am.

Now at 50 as I come into my full witching powers I find myself shunned from the supposedly more inclusive tervens due to my lack of witchy warts.

I've tried stick on one's but they tend to fall into the cauldron due to the heat and It just fucks up the spells. The guy next door has been trying to work out where his extra three legs have come from, and I was only trying to mute the sound of his tv.

Luckily you lot here accept my youthful attempts to deny the true witch I've always been and accept I am a true witch despite my youthful stupidity in removing a perfectly good part of my body.

Now I'd better get my cauldron going there's some dodgy double parker outside who needs to discover on his return that he parked his car in Albania.

I wanted to join in with the other posters hard agreeing with this.

And this

100%

Only adult human females can live as women.

Leafstamp · Today 14:48

OldCrone · Today 00:56

“It is also strange that someone who is living as though they are a woman is impervious to so many concerns of women and advocating against them.”

A male person cannot live as though he is a woman. Male people who say they are living as women tend to live as a male fantasy of what it is to be a woman. Their concerns are male concerns. They don't understand what it is like to be a woman, but it is odd that they have no interest in trying to understand. They seem to think they know better than actual women what being a woman is like, because of their superior male brains or something. Like mansplaining womanhood to women.

100%

Only adult human females can live as women.

I said that about living “as though they are a woman” and thought the “though” was enough to make it clear the state of living that way isn’t real.

Otherwise I agree with you both, but would like advice about what would be a better description - true but not unduly derogatory?

This thread has made me cackle. And I never had chin hair before I joined Mumsnet.

Not so much radicalised as bewitched!

The other point RMW fails to mention (or perhaps chooses to ignore) is that RMW could choose not to have vocal surgery in order to leave RMW’s voice as it is and avoid any potential impact on work.

Women don’t get the choice of whether they are treated as lesser because they are women. They may choose not to have children but they will still be discriminated against because, by virtue of being female, they might get pregnant.

One of the (many) fundamental issues with this forced teaming of women and people who identify as women is the option to opt in and out of womanhood, including others’ perceptions of what you will or won’t do.

Many trans women manage to change their voices without surgery but I think it does involve quite a lot of hard work.

Frankly the less people butcher themselves the better as far as I’m concerned.

I’d never criticise someone for avoiding surgery

🤣🤣🤣

How the fuck did I miss that magnificent duck pic earlier?

I like a cheeky duck pic me.

I feel I should just say at this point

WOMAN means Adult Human Female

Nothing more nothing less

But the worst of you here treat trans people just as you would complain about men treating women historically.

You know, the more I think about this the less I understand it.

What, exactly, is it that gender critical women doing to trans women that men historically did to women?

Are we denying you the right to own property?
Are we helping ourselves to your bodies?
Are we denying you access to the arenas of political, economic or social power?
Are we limiting your access to education?
Are we setting up a social system that makes you dependent on us so you have to suffer our domestic abuse?
Do we make a game of seducing you with lies then despise and defame you for believing us?

Honestly, I'd love to know.

@FlirtsWithRhinos

And conversely what are trans activists doing to women

Calling us witches
Calling for us to be decapitated and eaten
Verbally then physically intimidating a woman in parliament
Cheering rapists going into the female prison estate
jerking off in women's underwear in m and s taking photos then hanging the items back up for some woman to buy
Demanding women get out of politics

And that's just off the top of my head in this country.

The underwear thing granted is new, but historically men have stolen underwear for the same purpose from washing lines so....

The day we were expected to treat male rapists as women was the day this identity adventure men were having came unstuck.

No. That's the evidence. Rapists.

Yeah the past week has really caused the wheels to come off this juggernaut.

There is no longer any argument that can have any credence anymore.

Not one.

And as I'm really seeing why they held into it for so long

NO DEBATE

Agreed. The amount of sunlight this week has been amazing. I wonder if these men realise how they come across to normal people 🤔 do they watch themselves and realise?

I think that it's more than likely that they know exactly how they are perceived and that they get a kick out of it. They get a further kick out of forcing compliance, like flouncy Robin, here.

"You don't accept my edicts! I'm leaving!"

What a brat.

Very good questions, FWR.

It’s a shame that it doesn’t look like RMW will be back to answer them.

Perhaps we can see that as being educational in itself.

I believe the one truly terrible thing that women like us are doing to biologically male trans identifying people is saying no to them.

Apparently female people wanting to set boundaries for reasons of safety, dignity and privacy - and out of basic self respect for ourselves as full human beings - is on a par with male people denying those of us who are female the right to vote, own property, access an education, work in a profession, say no to marital rape, make our own life choices, be paid the same/have our work valued, be safe on the streets and in our own home, have reproductive choice - and so on, ad infinitum.

Who knew that female people saying no to male people was such a heinous, abhorrent thing to do.

(Every male person who ever benefited from male privilege and the patriarchy and was determined to uphold it, obvs)

Women, saying no to male people is a hate crime and LITERAL VIOLENCE!