NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #51

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence was 29 July 2025. It resumed again over 1 to 2 September for closing submissions.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February 2025. Sandie Peggie returned to give more evidence on 29 July 2025.

Access to view the second part of the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:
drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #50 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 50: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5387893-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-50 7 August 2025 to 1 September 2025

This has got to be right up there as a contender for most shocking thing said in this tribunal.

Best beware JR, don't want to find yourself falling out of favour or by your own measure, you won't deserve any rights!

How fucking short sighted do you have to be?!

I'm so glad I wasn't actually listening, just reading TT and here. My blood pressure would have been through the roof if I had had to hear JR today

JR appears to be arguing that the PC of gender reassignment is of no value if it doesn't provide an access all areas pass.

Presumably that is inviting the tribunal to come to a decision that conflicts with the SC ruling?

Strategically making arguments on the basis of how they can be used in an appeal, or just filling the time with any old tosh?

Yes. So the options are she's done that in writing, she got NHS Fife to agree that upholding gender ideology was the priority, or she's on a frolic of her own.

So JR didn't address any of NHS Fife's procedural HR mishaps in her defence, it was all Upton-Upton-Upton, #bekind and Sandie's a meanie?

Perhaps NHS Fife have given up?

"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence" is going to go down well in the judgment isn't it? 😂

Haha she has come back and is going on and on about things irrelevant to pleading.

I thought they were going to back down. J is having to do another Not in Scotland but with added Not in the Civil Courts.

What is going on?

????

I have absolutely no fucking clue what JR is waffling about.

Is this all about the email from Fife last night that we don't have access to?

Glad it is not just me?

I love the idea of a KC going off on a frolic of her own 👏

So we have to be kind to the men but it doesn’t work the other way? Why does Upons feeling trump Sandie’s?

From TT

This is the second morning session of Sandie Peggie v NHS Fife and Dr Upton.

JR Want to make clear re report to Lottie Miles that C called medical dr a P**i (Edited by MNHQ)- Miles evidence that dr could not recollect. But again, absence of evidence not ev of ab. Email c R primary position that amendment not required.

C email received by us last Tuesday and no oral supplements until yesterday. Reason we mention is cos C has known c it for 8 months. Not in the pleading but doesn't need to be J Don't apply same rules here as in civil. J/JR discuss cases. JR Rules c pleadings in tribunal - I said McPhane {sp} cos that's a higher bar.

I want sit in a corner and rock gently.

Is she going on about her parajudicial, or jurisprudencial nonsense or whatever it was that she threatened to do yesterday?

From TT

C can't be surprised that's the way R putting their case - been obvious since Jan. General denial in pleadings re harassment and goes to victimisation and objectionable manifestation. Scottish tribunal pleadings follow a table setting side by side factual allegation and response.

Is this about the harassment element of the claim? I'm lost.

So all the stuff JR said yesterday she'd come back to later?

🦗🦗🦗🦗🦗

I previously thought Supreme Court made this case a slam dunk. And I still hope it does

But respondents are arguing that, in this case, the relevant regulations are some health & safety regs which talk about men and women. So they're saying that women, in this context, includes TW

I'm sick of the whole business to be honest. It's emperor's new clothes. Deep down, we all know perfectly well the difference between men and women. And so much public money has been wasted on this

I hope the tide is turning. And huge respect to those brave enough to stand up to this publicly

As an aside, I am so so pleased for Charlotte Elves, that she is beginning her career with such a showstopper of a case. I hope she is having the time of her life and feels that all her hard work so far has paid off spectacularly.

I feel like I'm having one of those dreams where everything is like wading through treacle and no matter how hard you try you can't wake up.

Did JR actually say this? Sorry finding it hard to follow as not got access.

Yup, she really did.

So, universally loved and gentle St Beth, who wouldn't hurt a fly. And big racist homophobe meany mean Sandie, who just couldn't shut her mouth and be KIND.

That's JRs whole argument??

I loved the fact that she seemed to be the only legally qualified person in the room who had some grasps of the technical issues in question.

Hopefully NC gets a rebuttal and we get to understand WTF JR is in about