NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #18

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to continue for 2 weeks. However, it is going to overrun and there will be an adjournment with the hearing resuming in July (current best estimate). The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

However, as a result of problems with the livestreaming, apparently caused by a very large number of observers, remote public access to the hearing was suspended on Tuesday 11 February. It was suggested that it might be reinstated at some point but don't count on it.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse
Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2
Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3
Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4
Thread 5: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269149-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-5
Thread 6: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5269635-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-6
Thread 7: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5270365-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-7
Thread 8: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271511-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-8
Thread 9: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271596-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-9
Thread 10: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5271723-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-10
Thread 11: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272046-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-11
Thread 12: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272276-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-12
Thread 13: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272398-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-13
Thread 14: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5272939-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-14
Thread 15: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273119-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-15
Thread 16: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273636-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-16
Thread 17: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5273827-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-17

a quick google suggests to me that if DU 'accidentally' loses his phone it's not going to help him much. A forensic examination will easily reveal enough key information e.g. call(s) to/from his phone and BMA, how often and how long they lasted.

It shows that we're missing stuff by not having public access. Tribunal Tweets do amazing work but there's only so much they can capture

Hopefully Edinburgh for maximum exposure

Thank you thank you thank you again to all the wimmins here sticking through this so none of us have to experience the nonsense alone!

The cat is probably thinking 'thank heavens, I thought that was garnish😰!'

Seriously - agree 100% with your thanks to ickky, nauticant and tt.

I have Radio 3 playing a Chopin concerto on in the background, and your digital dexterity is matched only by the pianist's

Thank you @ickky

NC - just to be clear we will be back in Dundee.

From Twitter and so true:

'Not sure how JR thinks this will help her case. "Our workplace is so toxic that this isn't the first vexatious complaint Peggie has had to deal with, but we dismissed that one cos it was by a woman" '

Thank you so much Nauticant and all the knowledgeable women who have helped me follow and understand this.

@Biffatcrafts Hospital DEI staff apparently said Upton could use womens facilities unrestricted, with no info to the female staff.

Thank you all so much @nauticant @ickky and TT. Amazing work and how you have kept up I don’t know!

They MUST be able to sort out public online viewing by April/July.

I'm sure one of us here could sort it for them!

We can all dream! And maybe it will help DU in his mission for personal reflection.

Thank you all. Let the light shine.

P.S.Wouldn't it be wholly ironic if DU and supporters were using TT to follow the case....

enough time for certain NHS staff to get new jobs / go off on sick?

A fellow lurker here. Literally working my day around following the case. Checked Linked In deep search cannot find Isla Bumba. The EDI corruption is why despite my significant qualifications and lived experienced is why I have never applied for those roles. I have actual professional/personal morals. I work in education with legal documents and do voice my concerns at the damage to young CEPs and SEND individuals. I work for an LA who publicly backed out last minute of Tribunal of a Social Worker who HR bullied. Currently having my own issues with the same HR although for disability discrimination. Would no doubt be a different attitude it I identified as a man even though I am a women discrimination issue.

@chariothorses Ah, thank you, I must have missed that bit. There has been so much to read!

TT seems to just refer to emails being read out and doesn’t transcribe the full contents. That comment though is fabulous and just adds weight to the theory that Time was spent trying to make the allegations justify the suspension.

Re posting

Doctor here - very clear that TWAM obviously. In first two years after finishing medical school doctors are in their F1 and F2 years, meaning foundation year 1 and 2. These years consist of six four month long placements and are generally in the same organisation.

I think that was from Sandie's Solicitor to NHS Fife. I may be wrong though.

Adding my thanks to nauticant and ickky for keeping these marathon threads going, along with sincere appreciation of tribunal tweets. Being able to see the detail of the exchanges, line by line shows what the GI side is about. Not patient safety. Not equality, respect and levelling the playing field. Not listening and definitely not being kind. Just do as I say witch.

It would be good if it was, but even if it isn't the application draws attention to his nefarious dealings with the BMA and makes the court more aware of his ongoing non disclosure.

Judge said at the end it will continue to be in Dundee

With the request to see Upton's phone, is this to look at the calls he made to the BMA that he can't remember, or will they also be able to look at all the notes he was keeping relating to other staff?