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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

National Trust AGM

1000 replies

PRAMtran · 04/09/2023 13:59

I’ve received an email from the National Trust inviting me and all other members to vote in their AGM. Does anyone know if there are any things a woman’s rights advocate should vote for or against. Eg TWAW by stealth.

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27
PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 09:02

Ok I d been in the restore trust website it’s seems very sensible

National Trust AGM
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ArabeIIaScott · 09/09/2023 09:03

'pay large sums of money to be hectored, lectured at, piously insulted and derided'

Still not feeling the urge to support the NT for some reason.

DatumTarum · 09/09/2023 09:03

ArabeIIaScott · 09/09/2023 09:03

'pay large sums of money to be hectored, lectured at, piously insulted and derided'

Still not feeling the urge to support the NT for some reason.

Who exactly do they insult?

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 09:04

Not surprised

About what? I'm not your secretary, and I'm not going to spoon feed you. If you can't read and understand posts, that's your issue.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 09:05

I do find the general accusatory attempts to smear and deride anyone with questions an interesting strategy for encouraging diversity and inclusion, though.

Not really for everyone, is it?

Quite.

DatumTarum · 09/09/2023 09:05

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 09:04

Not surprised

About what? I'm not your secretary, and I'm not going to spoon feed you. If you can't read and understand posts, that's your issue.

Can you answer the question?

ArabeIIaScott · 09/09/2023 09:05

People outwith a very rarified bubble.

How do you think the general public feel about academia and historical preservation right now?

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 09:05

A couple more images I forgot to post. I had a look at the board members, it’s diverse.

National Trust AGM
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DatumTarum · 09/09/2023 09:06

Been visiting NT properties for years, why haven't I been insulated?

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 09:06

Oops

National Trust AGM
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ArabeIIaScott · 09/09/2023 09:06

DatumTarum · 09/09/2023 09:06

Been visiting NT properties for years, why haven't I been insulated?

Rolling back of green policies innit.

PencilsInSpace · 09/09/2023 09:08

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 08:35

It shows how vacuous and ill thought out all the other stuff on this thread is. And It’s all there for a single purpose, to disrupt and queer. I had no idea about all this when I started this thread, it’s certainly been an education.

I found it useful reading up on queer theory from a radical feminist perspective. It probably isn't everyone's cup of tea but Sheila Jeffreys' "Unpacking Queer Politics" is good, it really helped me understand.

Yes, Unpacking Queer Politics is an excellent book. You can download it for free here:

http://radfem.org/

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 09:09

Can you answer the question?

Yes I can, but I'm not going to do all your work for you 🤷‍♀️ Hope that helps.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 09:09

Yes, Unpacking Queer Politics is an excellent book. You can download it for free here:

Brilliant, thanks Pencils. I might read it again, now 5 years later.

maltravers · 09/09/2023 09:10

PRAMtran · 09/09/2023 08:15

What is wrong with a nice day out looking at attractive objects. I don’t want gender neutral facilities and and a queer theory history.

That is wrongthink Pram! Honestly, how much more reeducation do you need?

BurnToastAgain · 09/09/2023 09:14

ArabeIIaScott · 09/09/2023 09:06

Rolling back of green policies innit.

I’ve got a couple of rolls of loft insulation that I can spare if that’s any use to you Datum? Mind you the fish I’m chucking at you are a very fatty species so that might help to keep you warm. You’re welcome 😇

Barbadossunset · 09/09/2023 09:21

I've asked several times why people object to discussions about slavery or queer history.

Datum are you going to answer the question about which plants have been brought to UK from sugar plantations?
Maybe you meant those mahogany forests which are such a feature of the English countryside.

LoobiJee · 09/09/2023 09:22

Ereshkigalangcleg · 09/09/2023 09:09

Can you answer the question?

Yes I can, but I'm not going to do all your work for you 🤷‍♀️ Hope that helps.

I’m still haven’t had a response to the questions I asked that poster on page 2 and page 3 of the thread about specific claims made by them that they (“we”) had “defeated Restore Trust before”.

I’d like to know who the “we” is, and what contribution that poster made to the defeat of Restore Trust.

I don’t expect we’ll ever find out.

Sausagenbacon · 09/09/2023 09:30

I think that the poster at the beginning of the thread who said 'we have defeated' perhaps thought that they could include mn posters in their 'we' of, obviously, right thinking individuals and has been rather taken aback by the general tone of the response.
'We' is such a slippery word.
What it actually came across as was 'we (the people who know better than anyone else)'

EdithStourton · 09/09/2023 09:34

GodessOfThunder · 09/09/2023 08:21

You do realise you have a gender neutral toilet in your own home.

Someone is not up to speed with this board. We've had that one SO MANY TIMES.

I know the men who use the bog in my house. Out at the pub, not so much.

EdithStourton · 09/09/2023 09:40

DatumTarum · 09/09/2023 08:53

I've asked several times why people object to discussions about slavery or queer history.

No answers other than sarcasm.

Not so. You have been told that people don't like one agenda being pushed so hard and issues being shoehorned in.

I'm boggled by the patronising attitude take by you and others towards those who disagree. That is 100% not the way to persuade people to listen to argument: why would anyone listen to someone who talks down to them?

AuntMunca · 09/09/2023 09:43

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/09/08/national-trust-concealing-from-members-controversy/

Article in today's Telegraph (behind a paywall unfortunately).

LoobiJee · 09/09/2023 09:43

Sausagenbacon · 09/09/2023 09:30

I think that the poster at the beginning of the thread who said 'we have defeated' perhaps thought that they could include mn posters in their 'we' of, obviously, right thinking individuals and has been rather taken aback by the general tone of the response.
'We' is such a slippery word.
What it actually came across as was 'we (the people who know better than anyone else)'

I thought there were two possible explanations:

  • they were someone high up in the NT who shouldn’t have been involved in meddling in member democracy / would be breaching their social media policy by posting stuff on here;
  • they were claiming credit for something they hadn’t actually been involved in.

Later in the thread another poster asked them if they work in a profession where sharp elbows are required, after they’d claimed credit for other posters’ ideas for an exhibition.

Your theory hadn’t occurred to me but yes that could explain it.

MyLadyDisdainlsYetLiving · 09/09/2023 09:54

DatumTarum · 09/09/2023 08:53

I've asked several times why people object to discussions about slavery or queer history.

No answers other than sarcasm.

Perhaps you could address why you said slavery was relevant to everything in all NT houses, and gave tapestries as an example “who picked the cotton”.

several posters have pointed out that slavery is not a factor in the tapestries as they were woven from wool and silk and some made in continental Europe. This is a prime example of shoehorning slavery into the provenance of objects, like the shoehorning of queering of the Mary Rose nit combs.

RebelliousCow · 09/09/2023 10:00

TheHoover · 08/09/2023 23:33

@RebelliousCow some astronomical sweeping judgements and character assassinations there! Woweee. Plus a huge glaring amount of hypocrisy.

i am not sure where you draw your own line between what is acceptable
DEI and what is CSJT but you are obviously aware that I am countering the suggestion made by you that initiatives are bad and progress should be organic.

There is a body of data being gathered that is isolating a combined morbidity increase predictor based upon certain communities staying away from hospitals due to a fear of ‘white person’s medicine’. It is startling. But, like other complex issues like childhood morbidity it requires a huge amount of engagement to get to the heart of what is causing this and try to make our services and communities and general society feel more welcoming. Not sure whether this is ok or CSJT nonsense?

I'm not looking at the isue in terms of what is "progressive". Progressive has very specific echoes and associations in the days of Critical Social Justice theories. -which I reject. I reject them not becaue I'm reactionary or necessarily conservative ( which assumes what is being attempted or pushed is good/progressive/inevitable/right side of history etc), but becaue they are intentionally provocative and with a specific and determined political intent with which I take issue.

(You stated on another thread ( Chat) that this board ( FWR) is not where you go if you are " truly a liberal").

And yes, as others have said people join the NT primarily for pleasure and enjoyment, as well as to be more aware of how people lived, thought, conducted themselves in times gone by. When my children were young I also joined the NT so that we could visit the many wonderful parks and gardens and areas of ONB in the areas in which we lived.

Learning of the small and intimate details of historical background and context of buildings, contents, and peoples tends to come in a natural and organic way. What recent 'initiatives' are doing is forced feeding according to the strictures of equity and reparation - which is why you are getting such push back and resistance.

When something is done in a more relaxed and natural manner people are more readily receptive. You don't get push back if you are not pushing in the first place. People don't like being lectured to and having their visists wilfully distorted with moral imperatives which arre inherently tied to contested political positions.

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