Well played Lowri

[ladygindiva]

Just seen this on twitter, or "X" , and thought I'd share. I always liked Lowri Turner, even more so now.
twitter.com/ArchRose90/status/1696133230921994506?t=voB65a_oxAgi_uK9Obmggw&s=19

I think Mr Menno features that clip of Kumar screeching in one of his discussion videos.

Mic drop! I’ve never been a fan of Lowri but she was brilliant here - calm, measured and articulate as she shut Nish down and left him looking like a fish out of water. How frustrating that the presenter then let Nish off the hook, hastily changing the subject so he didn’t have to respond. A missed opportunity to get this man to explain exactly why he thinks it’s all a big fuss over nothing, when women are losing their single-sex spaces, their sports and achievements, even the language they use to define themselves.

At least this conversation brought some more sunlight, as Nish Kumar was trending on Twitter afterwards.

I think Mr Menno features that clip of Kumar screeching in one of his discussion videos.

You're right. Mr Menno has a really good video where he dissects Kumar's attack on Ricky Gervais:

o

Wow, Kumar really did screech like a banshee in that video. If his argument is “but there are only about 12 trans people” then that’s not going to cut it, I’m afraid. This isn’t about 12 trans people. It’s about men, and what this ideology does to the dignity, safety and privacy of women, our achievements in society and the language we use; the right for gay and lesbian people to be exclusively same-sex attracted without being cancelled, and the right for children to grow up gay or gender non-conforming without being pushed on an unnecessary pathway to transition.

Love Mr Menno, a true ally to women.

Gosh, Kumar becomes ever more dislikeable every time I see him. What's with the FUCKING SCREECHING?!

Just shouting and screaming hysterically does not a comedian make. Maybe an unhinged ranter on the TRA side at a LWS rally. But not as any kind of attempt at being a comedian or indeed being anyone who has the opportunity to express views to the great British public.

Loved Lowri's putdown. A calm, measured pithy FUCK YOU that we're self frothing over, um, nothing at all.

That was impressive and it was so obvious Kumar had no idea what he was talking about or why women are objecting.

Lowri was very calm, in a way that I find it hard to achieve on this topic. I’m pleased to see this.

This is how I came across the fabulous mr menno.

Nish Kumar is an egotistical knob. I think his self publicised cocaine use makes him worse.

He’s an immediate channel change for me. Smug twat.

What a bell end he is. Well done to Lowri, clear, firm and concise.

Bloody hell, that video has not aged well.

Yes and after him wondering why anyone cares, Lowri Turner calmly explaining because of women's rights, looks like the long suffering grown-up to his ranting toddler.

Plus, he really hates Ricky Gervais, doesn't he. That does not sound like professional rivalry. Nor does it sound like the normal TRA ally objections.

It sounds really personal.

Has the clip of him wondering why the hell anyone cares been deleted?

Oh I see it hasn't.

It's really quite the put down. (Paraphrasing)

'This is quite a serious issue about women's rights that needs to be defended. It's not an earworm or brain explosion or pathological. Its a serious issue.'

You can tell when someone has singularly failed to even marginally attempt to understand the arguments for women’s single sex spaces. You can tell that he just doesn’t understand because he hasn’t fucking TRIED to understand. I think people do really fall at the hurdle of ‘well I’m not going to listen to a racist explain why they think white people are superior’ and then think that a similarly repugnant, appalling bigotry is behind ANY argument in support of women’s rights when the transgender issue is being discussed. And of course this isn’t helped by the fact that there ARE appalling racists and bigots hating on Nish on his Twitter which then gives fuel to those who believe that anyone who takes the ‘women’s rights’ argument on the transgender issue also shares the same views as those appalling racists, sexist bigots. And round and round and round it goes.

But bless all the people who do take the time to form their own thoughts and listen to the arguments and weigh up the evidence. Critical thinking. It’s available for everyone to learn and practice… if they want to. But sometimes it requires a bit of effort and reading beyond the headlines and the mantras.

Good on Lowry Turner - in that particular moment, with those particular words - I support her.

He isn’t tried because he’s like a whole bunch of men who can not see anything from a woman’s point of view.

So the trans community (by which he means TW) “need our love and support” because it’s a narrative that centres males. He means men should be listened to. Notice how little men have to say when it’s gay men saying no to trans men.

Men like Nish Kumar don’t listen to women, don’t respect the views of women or understand how the world is for women. And they don’t want to try, either.

Years ago I use to read the website Cracked- they were framing the issue of trans women and toilets as “haha! These right wingers don’t want their wives seeing someone else’s penis! Reactionary losers!” There was no consideration that women might have their own feelings about seeing random cocks and no understanding that adult men have a different relationship to seeing dick (in locker rooms, toilets) than women (it is not normal or everyday for women).

There’s zero understanding that women have a right to their own feelings. Nish will never hear women. He couldn’t even understand why Lowri Turner would be talking about women’s rights. To him it’s all about men.

And I have zero interest in making jokes about trans people, but it pisses me off that it wasn’t so long ago the edgy set were making excuses for comedians to make rape jokes as “nothing is off limits” and now they’re “ah, well, no, this is different”.

There’s zero understanding that women have a right to their own feelings. Nish will never hear women. He couldn’t even understand why Lowri Turner would be talking about women’s rights. To him it’s all about men.

Yes.

It's one thing disagreeing with women, and overtly showing your misogyny. Out and proud, as it were.

It's quite another when you don't even understand what they're saying because your ears are incapable of hearing it.

Plus, he really hates Ricky Gervais, doesn't he. That does not sound like professional rivalry. Nor does it sound like the normal TRA ally objections.

A lot of progressive-ish comedians hate Gervais. I assume it's mostly because they're jealous of his success and see this issue as an opportunity to have a go. Luckily Gervais seems immune.

As to why Nish parrots these views on trans rights, I think it's probably because a large number of people on what you might call the left don't think for themselves at all. They lack the curiosity or the intellectual ability to think through an argument, collect and assess the evidence, listen to both sides of the debate. They just pick a side and adopt wholesale a set of beliefs that come as a package. Currently trans rights is the most fashionable of those beliefs, so people like Kumar adopt them unthinkingly - after all, there's absolutely no cost to him in being seen to hold those views. They represent, as has been pointed out many times on here, the absolutely shining example of a luxury belief.

It's quite another when you don't even understand what they're saying because your ears are incapable of hearing it.

As Helen Joyce said, our squeaky, high-pitched voices are out of men's hearing range. They need things said in masculine tones before they can be real issues.

Is Nish going to dine out on that bread roll forever?

It's depressingly true. That whole 'a man can't hear it unless it's said by another man', thing, is so prevalent.

Once you see it you can't unsee it.

A man of my acquaintance even cracked a joke about it, not realising that he does it himself, all the time.

I truly believe that even if I gave him the examples of when he's done it to me, he wouldn't recognise himself as doing it.

Because I'd be saying it! He still wouldn't hear what I'm saying!

I agree with all of this.

You know that stereotype about leftie men with beards.

Just that.

Turquoisemonkies:
Why can’t we just put our concerns across without being labelled as trans phobic.

FictionalCharacter:
What women think, say, need and want is so far out of their realm of consciousness, they’re quite taken aback when we speak up.

brain worm?

is there a joke in that? silly man. Thanks, Lowri.

There’s always the suggestion “Live and let live” bandied about as well, but like so much else, it only goes in one direction. When women say that to live comfortably, they need space away from men, it’s waved aside. The very obvious targetting of any and all women’s spaces is also incredibly aggressive. Live and let live can’t apply when one side can sometimes be acting abusively.

I saw Nish Kumar live a few years ago and he did the same "there's not that many of them, why can't we be nice?" comment in his routine.

At the time I wondered what would happen if one of his white acquaintances decided to identify as being of Indian descent on the grounds of liking brightly-coloured saris and enjoying a good curry. And maybe started complaining about the Indian community not being inclusive or accepting enough.

Would Nish be kind?

Would "there's only one person like this" stop it from being offensive and nonsensical?

@ApocalipstickNow
And I have zero interest in making jokes about trans people, but it pisses me off that it wasn’t so long ago the edgy set were making excuses for comedians to make rape jokes as “nothing is off limits” and now they’re “ah, well, no, this is different”.

Absolutely. And there’s plenty of examples of these same right-on comedians making “transphobic” jokes in the past, before TWAW etc became the fashionable stance.