Allison Bailey v Stonewall - Employment Tribunal hearing Thread 16

[ickky]

The Tribunal started on 25th April at 10am. If you would like to view online you need to send a request for access as early as possible.

Send an email to

[email protected]

The subject heading of the email request should read

“MEDIA OR PUBLIC ACCESS REQUEST – Case number 2202172/2020 - Ms A Bailey – 25th April 2022.

Then ask for the pin for the online access.

You will be contacted with instructions on how to observe the hearing.

When joining the live tribunal please choose a non inflammatory/offensive name, everyone can see it in the chat - This is a court room, please behave accordingly.

The court chat function is there for official court purposes, not for observers, please don't use it unless you have a technical issue.

On the first page underneath where you put your screen name, select the video and mic that are not crossed out (top option), this is the courts vid and mic.
On the next page select NONE on the drop down windows for vid and mic, these are your own video and mic.

You must be muted so as to not disturb the hearing.

There is also live tweeting from

twitter.com/tribunaltweets

Abbreviations:
AB: Allison Bailey, claimant
BC: Ben Cooper QC, barrister for AB
SW = Stonewall Equality Limited (respondent 1)
IO = Ijeoma Omambala QC, senior counsel - barrister for SW
RW = Robin White junior counsel to SW - assisting IO
GC = Garden Court Chambers Limited (respondent 2) (GCC would be a better abbreviation)
AH = Andrew Hochhauser QC, senior counsel - barrister for GC
JR = Jane Russell junior counsel to GC - assisting AH
RM= Rajiv Menon QC & SH = Stephanie Harrison QC (jointly respondent 3 along with all members of GC except AB)
EJ = Employment Judge Goodman hearing the case
Panel = any one of the three panel members (EJ and two lay members)

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4529887-Allison-Bailey-v-Stonewall-Employment-Tribunal-hearing?

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4542466-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-2

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4545725-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4546945-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-4

Thread 5 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4548160-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-5

Thread 6 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4550451-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-6

Thread 7 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4551757-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-7

Thread 8 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4552521-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-8

Thread 9 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553181-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-9

Thread 10 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4553754-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-10

Thread 11 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555145-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-11

Thread 12 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4555687-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-12

Thread 13 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556235-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-13

Thread 14 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556407-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-14

Thread 15 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4556803-allison-bailey-v-stonewall-employment-tribunal-hearing-thread-15

Allison Bailey - claimant (4-9, 11-13 May)

Witnesses for the claimant:

Dr Nicola Williams - Fair Play for Women (29 April)
Dr Judith Green - A Woman's Place (29 April)
Kate Barker - LGB Alliance (3 May)
Lisa-Marie Taylor - FiLiA (4 May)

Witnesses for the respondents:

Stephen Lue - barrister for GCC (3-4 May)
Zainab Al-Farabi - ex Stonewall (10 May)
Kirrin Medcalf - head of trans inclusion Stonewall (10 May)
Leslie Thomas - barrister at GCC (13 May)
Sanjay Sood Smith - Stonewall (16 May)
Shaan Knan - LGBT consortium - on STAG (16 May)
Rajiv Menon - joint head of chambers (16-17 May)
Maya Sikand - barrister at GCC (17-18 May)
Mia Hakl-Law - HR senior for GCC (18 May)
Judy Khan - barrister at GCC (19-20 May)
Charlie Tennent - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Luke Harvey - clerk at GCC (20 May)
Louise Hooper - Barrister at GCC (20 May)
David Renton - barrister at GCC (20 May, 25 May)
Marc Willers - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Stephen Clark - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Liz Davies - Barrister at GCC (23 May)
Cathryn McGahey - Bar Council Ethics Committee's VC (24 May)
Tom Wainwright - Barrister at GCC (24 May)
Colin Cook - Head clerk at GCC (24 May)
David de Menezes - GCC, Head of Marketing (25 May)
Kathryn Cronin - barrister at GCC (25 May)
Michelle Brewer - barrister at GCC at time, now left and a judge (26 May)
Stephanie Harrison - joint head of chambers (26 May)

To Come

Closing arguments for AB, GCC, and SW (20 June)

Chrysanthemum5:
Overall I think the most annoying witness was MB - she took patronising to a whole new level

She was pretty awful, quite arrogant. I also really disliked David Renton on his first outing, he came across terribly. And then there was David de Menezes, sending everyone to sleep.

Poor Allison, just going through that long list of barristers, so many people (many of them senior barristers) hostile towards her.

Me too!! I was meaning to suggest the Charlie Brown blah blah blah voice either for DDM, or for the endless Twitter technicalities/explanations 😂😂😂

You weren't the only one.

I'm guessing that the favourite Mariah Carey song discussed during the swimming sessions was this one: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anytime_You_Need_a_Friend

I had him down as Marvin the Paranoid Android.

Or Eeyore

Thank you vipers for all of this. Unbelievable.
As someone said upthread - I thought we'd dealt with so much of this shit 30 years ago. Only to find that the very people who should have the backs of women are now actively campaigning for the removal of lesbian's rights to same sex relationships and men's rights to invade every safe space with unwilling women.
And they've said it all out loud in court.
Thank you Allison Bailey - you're a legend and I'm so sorry you ended up with these depressing individuals as your colleagues.

Oops, not sure what happened to my link : en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anytime_You_Need_a_Friend

WTF? Wikipedia links work everywhere else. What's up, Mumsnet?

A rewind 5 minute function when my ears catch something that I can't quite believe I'm hearing...

Which I think is going to be one of the big takeaways from this, whatever happens. I'm not sure if Allison has proven her case against Stonewall, but this is going to do further damage to their accreditation scheme or whatever they call it either way.

Thinking about what Allison went through there makes me feel incredibly sad and I just want to give her a big hug.

Totally shocking. GCSE History requires the student to be able to critically assess their sources - this lot are bloody barristers!!!

Putting aside the issues of the tribunal video platform, how much do we all need to pay for an official transcript of proceedings? What has to be done to get permission for such a transcript if we can't have this live-streamed or recorded? Like most of us, I'm indebted to Tribunal Tweets and others for the records that we have. For the longer term, I wonder about transcripts.

What action is necessary to make sure that bundles are more readily available in the future?

This has been yet another interesting case study of Open Justice. We're learning as we go. I

Just catching up on what I missed on the last thread and I believe that RMW was lead counsel for one of the pre-hearings (when they tried to get the case thrown out).

I assume that Stonewall's tactic is to lie low to distance themselves as much as possible from GCC. EJG is pretty good at seeing straight through tactics though.

Is it outrageous to think that Allison was taken on so that GCC could have a pet black lesbian in their midst. How nice it would be for them to have someone from that demographic who agreed with the wokeness and they could refer to, to add credence to their Stonewall law.

unfortunately Allison has a mind of her own, strong moral compass, and the courage to stand up for women and lesbians and bi and gay people.

Thanks to ickky and everyone on this thread, some of your comments have had me in stitches.
Thursday - is the official start to the weekend🍷

I wonder whether IO was there to keep the witnesses on brand.

Agreed - I hadn't been aware of the idea of Open Justice before and it's been fascinating. I've learned loads and it's been really interesting to have the input from posters whose area this is to provide context.

I bet the AH, BC and EJ go for a pint tonight and a debrief. IO might go too, but she'll maybe just sit quietly and say nothing.

Perhaps she'll just send a cardboard cutout of herself

www.thelegists.co.uk/employment-tribunal-mulls-over-recorded-hearings-and-transcripts

See here re recordings. For some reason the employment tribunal, even when using software for video/audio hearings that would mean it would be possible, does not record hearings.

Therefore at present the only way to have a transcript is to pay for live transcription, and to get permission in advance. This would be possible but expensive (and would presumably need one side or the other to arrange it, rather than an interested 3rd party).

There is not, as far as I know, recording equipment in the 'in person' hearings for the First Tier Tribunals, so even if the Employment Tribunal decides to switch on the recording option, it would be for virtual hearings and not in person ones.

If they do decide to switch it on, then it would be possible to pay afterwards for a court approved transcriber to make a transcription, which would be cheaper than a live transcriber.

I missed the last 1.5 hours, just caught up reading threads. Thank you all for your company. This was my first Open Justice experience too, I'm also inspired to be more active. I'll be checking this forum regularly, and have already signed up for updates from Sex Matters.

Any other suggestions? I can't find any local Women's Rights groups - any tips on where to look?

Also will we be able to access the summing up on 20 June with the same link? Does anyone know what time it will be?

The poster who was talking about orange and dark chocolate biscuits - please reveal where you bought them! You've put me right in the mood for them.

I did ask the other day why quotes from the proceedings aren't allowed (sadly, just as the thread closed). Paraphrased summaries are, by definition, less accurate and whilst I can understand that the court service isn't prepared to fund a transcript, given that TT is prepared to provide one for free what is the problem?

Well done ickky for keeping the threads on track, fantastic job.