Maya Forstater hearing starts Monday

[MForstater]

Hi all,

Thank you so much for all your support: emotional, intellectual, financial, spiritual(!) reading the Mumsnet feminism board is where this all started for me!

The case starts tomorrow.

It is all online. If you want to watch you need to email the tribunal for a log in to [email protected]

It kicks off at 10am - the first bit will be "admin" between the judges and the lawyers working out the timings, issues and any reporting restrictions .

Once that is all sorted the judge and the panel will go away to read (probably for the rest of Monday and all of Tuesday)

I will most likely give evidence Wednesday and Thursday.

@tribunaltweets will be tweeting the whole thing (assuming they get permission from the judge)

Links to papers will go up throughout the case at www.hiyamaya.net.

Any other questions I am happy to answer them (apart from the ones where I have to say "that is for the tribunal to hear"...)

I have made a spectators guide with FAQs etc here

Lots of love

Maya

Luke doesn't seem to know very much at all

Untrue, senior fellowship, on grant application success, OR the customary extension of visiting fellowship by one final year, OR outside contractor role were all the on the table in both chronological and desirability (to MF) order.

That was to disgusted, who's comment has gone as poof! as their argument..

Best thing really, the comment was libellous.

LE being asked to comment on the debate MF was involved with. LE just will not engage with this. MF was being offensive and that's about it.

LE: "At CGD we recognise someone's racial self-identity."
BC: [incredulous]

That's weird, he's gone from saying the RD comparison is offensive to saying that at GCD they allow self ID of race.

@nauticant

LE: "At CGD we recognise someone's racial self-identity." BC: [incredulous]

Is this in response to the Rachel Dolezal question?

I can’t tear myself away from the Twitter thread. My jaw is almost literally on the ground at this point.

I'm loving Ben

LE: "The only problem with Rachel Dolezal is that she didn't have a sincere self-identity."

According to LE, RD was only not OK because she didn't have a strongly held view. We are really through the looking glass now!

BC: So can you see that when criticism of Miss Dolezal is made, it's because even though 'race' is a construct based on superficial differences, it matters becuse of the disadvantages those structures result in?
LE: but Rachel Dolezal was an imposter, she told people not to blow her cover.

@nauticant

LE: "The only problem with Rachel Dolezal is that she didn't have a sincere self-identity."

That's a fair amount of speculation and mindreading from someone who has been very full of, "I don't know" until now.

How does LE know that RD's self-identity wasn't sincere at the time? afaict, RD is arguing that it was.

@nauticant

LE: "At CGD we recognise someone's racial self-identity." BC: [incredulous]

But also: LE: She mentions Rachel Dolezal. BC: that is because she has been invited to discuss that comparison. LE: but the comparison is offensive.

BC: re-state that Philip Bunce was awarded a "woman in business award"
LE: but comparing that to someone who was only pretending to be black is offensive.

Hahahaha

These people are fucking idiots.

To be fair EmbarrassingHadrosaurus, there is some basis for that claim by LE:

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3122881/Don-t-blow-cover-NAACP-leader-told-adopted-black-brother-not-let-actually-white-built-new-identity-civil-rights-activist.html

He would probably combust seeing the Daily Mail cited to support him.

His logic is all over the place. He can't accept that RD's belief was genuine because she had asked her family not to out her. Of course RD didn't want to be outed in the same way that many TW don't want to be outed. It's a perfect comparison.

Whining "it's offensive" seems to be the entirety of Luke's thought processes.

Came over here to see who else was enjoying Ben Cooper's work today. Pleased to be in company with so many

There's just no capacity for basic logic or common sense!

How can a sincere belief that you are something you in fact are not is absolutely to be accepted unquestioningly, but a sincere belief that you dont share in that belief is offensive to the point you should not be employed?

I have a sincere belief that reality and facts are objective and unchanging. Why is my sincere belief to be used to treat me like a criminal, while beliefs I honestly perceive as really rather out there are to be unquestioningly respect?

Luke's been sent off to do his homework in the break

All I can say is get yourself a PIN code for the following sessions and if you can make the time, have a watch/listen. It is remarkable to witness people coming out with this stuff.

@nauticant - how do you access the PIN - I saw upthread you had to ask to be given it - is there a process of application etc?

@OvaHere

BC: re-state that Philip Bunce was awarded a "woman in business award" LE: but comparing that to someone who was only pretending to be black is offensive.

Hahahaha

These people are fucking idiots.

How can they recognise racial self identity but then condemn it as offensive, I am confused?