When, oh when, will the tide turn?

[IchbineinBerlinner]

I've been waiting and waiting for people to wake up to trans ideology. I've had complaints against my work. I've been blacklisted by organisations I used to work with. This is all coming to a head for me professionally speaking and I am so tired of waiting for people to understand what is going on. I have a tendency to be over-positive, so I'd like to hear Mumsnet's views: am I mad to think that this madness will stop soon?

I like James Marriott but he’s got a little way to go on this journey. He is very smart but can’t quite let go of ‘be kind’ and ‘lefties are good people’ both of which lead to ‘TWAW because leftie blokes, who insist on my being kind, say so’

I’m more on the ‘lying and colluding in lies is not the same as being kind’ end of the spectrum. Dirtbag lefties sound like old school socialists of the sort you would have found in traditional working class communities across the country.

Dirtbag lefties sound like old school socialists of the sort you would have found in traditional working class communities across the country

Yes, the hard line militants have never been of the soft, kind contemporary version. It was always class war and personal recrimination.

i'm getting heartily fed up of the infiltration of American frames of reference and terminology into British culture. The irony of that is, of course, that the Hard, British Left has always hated the US and cultural hegemony.........and to think that much of the identity politics that Jeremy Corbyn now embraces & espouses is a direct American import.

hated the U.S and its cultural hegemony

curious article. I have never heard of the phenomenon or phrase dirtbag left before. Sounds like mostly a lot of men gleefully hurling abuse at other women and men in an immature manner. They don't come across in a good light.

If it had been dirtbag right, I guessed no-one would be surprised. The general assumption that those on the left are someway more morally sound than those on the right is part of the problem.

Dirtbag lefties sound like old school socialists of the sort you would have found in traditional working class communities across the country

for an example of this...you need look no further than the way that council business is conducted in Liverpool....under the leadership of old school Joe Anderson...and back in the dark days of Derek Hatton. It is almost a case of throwing rotten apples at each other across the chamber....with insults and name calling and personal vendetta.

Yes this is what Militant was like. Macho arseholes. James is too young to remember that or remember the tenor of socialism during the miners strike. It makes me realise how ancient I am - it’s very familiar to me and ancient history to him and others his age.

I’m more on the ‘lying and colluding in lies is not the same as being kind’ end of the spectrum.

Me too. "Reel Politik" that he admiringly refers to had members suspended from Twitter for getting into a nasty spat with gender critical women a few years ago and writing something like "Hang all T**Fs" on their bio.

Have they grown up? I doubt it.

Just placemarking in caseemerjeannecomes back later to continue the discussion

They will be back once they have consulted with the rest of the group and have had a response formulated.

I like James Marriott but he’s got a little way to go on this journey. He is very smart but can’t quite let go of ‘be kind’ and ‘lefties are good people’ both of which lead to ‘TWAW because leftie blokes, who insist on my being kind, say so’

Where did this idea ever come from, anyway? I've never found that conservatives are actually less likely to be kind to people. Some are jerks of course but the proportion doesn't seem to be particularly different.

Going back to the 'dirtbag left' article, Marriott states 'In an interview with the right-wing online magazine Spiked...'. I don't consider Spiked Right Wing.

First I've heard of Chapo Trap House - wonder if they're the successors to The Young Turks, who already seem to be trapped in the downward spiral. TYT very much see themselves as progressives - from what I glean from the article, Chapo Trap House seem to be moving away from Progressivism / US-style liberalism and more towards old-school left wing class politics.

(Still, at least it should mean an end to 'point of privilege' interruptions).

One way in which I think a tide has mostly turned (if that's possible) is within feminism, with regards to platforming "helpful" transexuals.

Some of us have been arguing for a long time that platforming (and by doing so, centring) so called "gender critical transexuals" in feminism, excludes trans widows and other women from the very movement that was set up to support them. I think there is a growing acceptance amongst feminists that this is the case.

It's been a while since the major feminist organisations (I'm thinking Filia and WPUK) allowed this.

I certainly see this as progress!

I read Spiked for a while assuming it was more or less leftist. I was shocked when I first started to see it described as right wing. But it seems a common POV.

Spiked is libertarian. The editor, Brendan O'Neill, describes himself as a 'Marxist Libertarian'. He previously worked on Spiked's predecessor: 'Living Marxism'.

I have no idea where this idea comes from that Spiked is right wing. Possibly from people who think that libertarian = right wing.

I've seen people try to draw a distinction between 'liberal' and 'progressive' - Spiked would be liberal / libertarian but not progrossive / woke.

It does seem to fit those liberals / on the left who are kicking back against authoritarian woke culture.

Again, it's an attempt to import American framing of politics into the UK. Libertarian and right are much more synonymous in the American political zeitgeist. Which also means that anyone coming from that perspective will be confused when they've been primed to expect an Ayn Rand adherent and get Brendan O'Neill instead.

Yes, good point kittens.

I'd have thought "Marxist Libertarian" is an oxymoron.

TheProdigalKittensReturn

Thanks, that's very well put.

TinselAngel

I think he does it on purpose in an attempt to avoid being pigeonholed.