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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

The self-ID petition is live #2

921 replies

YesItsADebate · 17/03/2018 10:42

Here it is: petition.parliament.uk/petitions/214118

The signatories now stand at 5444.

The grey areas on the map are:

  • Airdrie and Shotts
  • Staffordshire Moorlands
  • Bassetlaw
  • Harlow
  • West Tyrone

The constituencies with the highest number of signatories are:

  • Calder Valley
  • Brighton Pavillion
  • Lewisham West and Penge
  • Lewisham, Deptford
  • Bristol West
  • Edinburgh North and Leith

It’s due to be reported in this week’s Mail on Sunday and Sunday Times.

Thankyou to everyone who has signed, shared, discussed and thought about this petition Flowers

OP posts:
Thread gallery
11
changingagain123 · 05/06/2018 13:23

The Government has responded to the petition.

Procrastinator1 · 05/06/2018 13:43

The Government's response looks hopeful. Devil in the detail of how the GR process might be changed?

Theinconstantgardener · 05/06/2018 14:12

The Government has responded to the petition

where can I find this please?

RatRolyPoly · 05/06/2018 14:14

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/214118

Click "Read the response in full".

RatRolyPoly · 05/06/2018 14:15

Could have written it myself.

Theinconstantgardener · 05/06/2018 14:15

thanks rat

RatRolyPoly · 05/06/2018 14:16

No probs :)

RatRolyPoly · 05/06/2018 14:24

...surprised there isn't a thread about the response actually.

BlackeyedSusan · 05/06/2018 17:32

11555

Kyanite · 05/06/2018 20:59

The TRAs are watching this thread, here is a Twitter thread on the Gov's response.

mobile.twitter.com/LGBTLD/status/1004025664968757248

and some more tweets...

twitter.com/LGBTLD?lang=en

Melamin · 05/06/2018 22:14

Well, the number keeps going up, so they must be doing something right Wink

11 614

BlackeyedSusan · 05/06/2018 23:14

11620

boatyardblues · 06/06/2018 00:02

11,628

boatyardblues · 06/06/2018 20:07

11,760.

Has the petition got a second wind? The pace seems to have picked up.

ErrolTheDragon · 06/06/2018 20:38

Maybe people are talking about the government response on their social media?

GibbertyFlibbert · 06/06/2018 21:31

In 3 months 11,000 women out of a total adult female population of about 25m women have signed. That's less than 0.05%, less as some men probably signed too. The petition is doing a fantastic job of proving that this is not a real issue.

R0wantrees · 06/06/2018 21:36

As the petition gained 10000 signatories, the government have responded:

"The Government has not yet decided whether or not to introduce a self-declaration model, and will not change the Equality Act 2010 provisions which support organisations to run single sex services.

Read the response in full
The Government has committed to consult on how best to reform the Gender Recognition Act (GRA) 2004. This Act sets out the process by which trans people can legally change their gender. We will publish this consultation in due course. All members of the public will be able to respond to the consultation. Once the consultation has closed and the Government has carefully considered the responses, only then will we decide how to reform the GRA.

Gender recognition is a devolved issue and the Scottish Government ran a separate consultation, which closed on 1 March 2018.

We have been clear since announcing our intention to consult on the GRA that we will ask about how we can make the process of applying for a Gender Recognition Certificate less bureaucratic and intrusive for trans people. That does not necessarily mean we are proposing self-declaration of gender. The Government will consider the results of the consultation carefully before making any decision on how to reform the GRA. We are clear that we have no intention of amending the Equality Act 2010, the legislation that allows for single sex spaces. Any GRA reform will not change the protected characteristics in the Equality Act nor the exceptions under the Equality Act that allow provision for single and separate sex spaces.

The Government does not intend to change the safeguarding processes that are currently used in refuges and healthcare services. Providers of women-only services can continue to provide services in a different way, or even not provide services to trans individuals, provided it is objectively justified on a case-by-case basis. The same can be said about toilets, changing rooms or single sex activities. Providers may exclude trans people from facilities of the sex they identify with, provided it is a proportionate means of meeting a legitimate aim.

We are committed to a respectful and evidence-based discussion, and, for this reason, we have engaged in many pre-consultation meetings with a range of stakeholders including women’s groups, charities and service providers. We will continue to do so during the consultation. The consultation offers an opportunity for women from all backgrounds to be heard.

As part of our evidence gathering, we are looking at the experiences of other countries who have different gender recognition models. There are countries, such as Ireland, Malta, and Belgium that have adopted a self-declaration model, making use of statutory declarations. We are also looking at countries that do not have a full self-declaration model, such as the Netherlands.

We want to emphasise that any reform of the GRA will not mean reform to the medical treatment that trans people receive, and the age at which they can receive this. Access to treatment on the NHS, including cross-sex hormones (which the NHS allows from 16) and surgery (which the NHS allows from 18), is not regulated by the GRA, but decided on by clinicians. Any GRA reform will not change this.

When the GRA was introduced, it was considered a world-leading piece of legislation. Whilst it has worked well in many ways, over the last decade it has been viewed as outdated. We have heard from many trans people that the current requirements feel overly intrusive and bureaucratic. It includes the need to provide a diagnosis of gender dysphoria and a second medical report of any treatment, proof of having lived for at least two years in their acquired gender, the approval of their spouse if married, as well as the fee to apply, and any associated costs with obtaining supporting evidence. Furthermore, trans people are already able to more easily change their name and gender in their passport and driving license. Streamlining the process of changing their legal gender on their birth certificate, so that they are recognised legally in their acquired gender, would help trans people to have all their identity documents match.

The process of gaining a Gender Recognition Certificate (GRC), as set out in the Gender Recognition Act, is a Government service that is not working well for the people it is designed for. Only 4,850 GRCs have been issued since the Act came into force. Our research shows that trans people find the process too bureaucratic and hard to use. We therefore propose improving this service, but want to ensure we only do so after a full consultation, to allow us to hear from trans people, and also from women’s groups, faith groups, LGBT groups, young people’s organisations, charities, refuges, and many more individuals and organisations, so that we can decide how best to make these reforms.

The Government is committed to improving the position of women and girls, and supports their rights, safety, privacy and dignity. We are also committed to improving the position of trans people and supporting their rights. We are confident that advancing the rights of trans people does not have to compromise women’s rights, and will work with all groups to ensure this".

Government Equalities Office

current thread discussing this statement:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3269463-Government-response-to-the-petition

ErrolTheDragon · 06/06/2018 22:38

Few people have a clue about 'self-declaration', and even fewer know the petition exists.

BlackeyedSusan · 06/06/2018 22:44

boatyardblues Wed 06-Jun-18 00:02:11

11,628

and today it is already at 11,773

BlackeyedSusan · 06/06/2018 23:58

11776

GibbertyFlibbert · 07/06/2018 00:08

"Few people have a clue about 'self-declaration',... "

And even less care. I'll make sure that fact reaches Jeremy Corbyn. It is really great to have proof that this is a non-issue

Picassospaintbrush · 07/06/2018 00:11

Like anyone cares about Corbyn!

Melamin · 07/06/2018 10:46

11 792 - hoping to catch it reaching the hundred Grin

ErrolTheDragon · 07/06/2018 13:46

11,800 it is.

Melamin · 07/06/2018 13:50

Yay Smile

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