Been out. It's not pretty out there. My feminist views are challenged tonight.

[dummad]

Hello, just a quickie coz I'm a bit drunk.

I've been out tonight in a bar in town - a trendy bar. Getting to the point, I'm disappointed ladies. I'm disappointed in what I've seen. Why do young women stand around dressed up like a dog's dinners looking bored out of their minds out of choice? I'm trying very hard not to think it, but I'm on the slippery slope of thinking women don't help themselves be taken seriously when they portray themselves the way they do. I know it's about choice and whatnot, but why CHOOSE to look like little fuck toys if you don't have to? Sorry. I just find it difficult to fly the feminist flag after what I've seen tonight. It's like young women don't give a flying toss about being empowered. They all look the same - tarty, vacuous and vacant. ALL of them. Hundreds of them. There wasn't one young lady in the place tonight without a horrendously short skirt on and killer heals. One group got out of the taxi and had garters tattood around her upper thigh. The men in the queue outside hardly batted an eyelid but one was there making sort of animal gestures to them like he was in a zoo. Maybe that's the sort of reaction these girls wanted.

In the bar guys couldn't even be bothered to approach the women by the looks of it. For two hours we were in there and I didn't see any notable, interaction between the sexes. Of course you'll never get a guy complaining about the way the girls look - they just lap it all up from a distance - it's all just laid out for them and saves the entry fee into the local lap dancing club I guess. They don't give a shit. Sluttier the better in their view. Why the hell don't women today backlash against it? I'd understand if it were a few of them like that but it was all of them. I'm sure they're intelligent, well bought up girls as well. So can't blame it on ignorance/ upbringing or whatever. They are a fucking disgrace.

You know what - I want you to put me right. I want you to tell me I'm wrong and there is hope and that women are aspiring for empowerment and campaign that they are respected as equals. It's up to them isn't it? They are the next generation after all. Don't they honestly care about their place in society? Don't they want to improve things like misrepresentation in the media and violence against women and lower wages etc? Don't they want to be taken seriously? Is this what has happened when women are contented? Is this what we choose to be by default? If so, it's no wonder men look down on us.

A ratboy? You lucky caaw, all I've got is a muckscrubber. How's a muckscrubber going to earn enough to keep me in elegant clothes?

Redbindy, men, women, children, cats, dogs. Judge on and I shall cast you out of my life as a worthless nobody.

I see Redbindy, very interesting. Do tell us more ...

This thread is truly bizarre. In a funny way. All these people accusing women of being 'mean' and 'horrid', when they are making perfectly valid points about women dressing for themselves and doing what they want to do.

A guy at my work show his bum crack every single day in a pair of low slung jeans, but funnily enough I have never heard a single derogatory word spoken about him or people judging his character because of it. If I did, I would think the problem lay firmly with the judgemental one...and I would be right.

Justaholyfool - I am really worried.
Sask* are you really so naive to believe that other women do not look at the way you dress and form opinions based on that?

I haven't had any dinner.

DH wants to eat chocolate fondue for dinner. All those in favour, raise a sock-clad hand.

Bind are you really so naive to believe I care? The thing about judgy people, is that they're umm, arseholes, so why would anyone care what they think? Are you in the habit of listening to the opinions of nasty minded people?

redbindy are you really so naive to believe you are stating anything other than the obvious?

Was hoping for womanly curves, Mitchy. Do you think this may be the wrong strategy to snag myself a rich hubby (together with a wonderfully supportive MIL)? Maybe if I wear the pink stripy socks Dniece gave me for Christmas, my luck may change.

Redbindy, we realise people judge.

We just couldn't give a shite.

Booyhoo, OP stated the bleeding obvious, I was just joining in.

"OP stated the bleeding obvious, I was just joining in"

You joined in stating the bleeding obvious?

ah so you do realise. it's just, you seemed as if you were trying to be all cryptic and knowing.

Trendy bar = sample bias?

Just* if you realise people judge and don't give a shite, what is the point of this thread?
Saskia- your point is?

Bind Oh well, if you're fine with that, keep it up.

Er...what?

Maybe the men aren't even judging the women. Some of the women on this thread seem to think that all men are as judgy as they are. And even if men do judge....really, so what?? I don't get it? Who gives a shit.

red. do you know what your point is?

Well, I too was a teenager back in the 70s and I have just one thing to say to you young gels.

It has ALWAYS GORN ORN. Yes! Gels going out wearing v.v. little and flashing their flesh at the lads. For fun! .

I am a mature student, go out on the piss with my classmates sometimes, and have noticed that when out in a mixed group the girls usually wear jeans or leggings, boots and minimal makeup. When hunting in a pack it's a girl gang night they wear next to nothing, tons of slap, hair extensions and skyscraper heels ( NOT BLOODY 'HEALS' DAMMIT!) so high they have to totter down the street holding each other up whilst peeing themselves laughing. They seem to fall over quite a lot too. And they have a fantastic time together. It's not about pulling blokes.

Lapsed, you are taking me back to happy nights out on the piss with the rest of the women's footy team in my grad student days (chorus of "Why was she born so beautiful, ...?" - which, incidentally, appears to be sung in footy circles about members of either gender, personal pronouns suitably changed). I seem to remember all of us perched on a table in a bar attempting a mass karaoke to "Bohemian Rhapsody", largely conducted on one note. It is amazing the table survived. Usually these nights did take place in killer heels and skimpy dresses (I think we saw it as a refreshing change from studs, shinpads and baggy kit -footy kit is always baggy, because it is always purchased to accommodate the largest member of the team).

And what's wrong with one-night stands if that's what floats your boat? If only I was still young enough to have any change of getting one ... .

The op of this thread disturbs me. I thought feminism was about having freedom and choices, not judging other women for theirs.

I think its disgusting to say that a woman is dressed to pull and then slag her off for not being successful!

You're not a feminist op!

"footy kit is always baggy, because it is always purchased to accommodate the largest member of the team"

This ^ is true.