Scotsnet does not represent Scotland

[kamalasshaman]

At a time when polls are showing unprecedented support for independence and even John Curtice agrees the polls are clear, why is Scotsnet such a bastion of unionist opinions? Is it just due to the demographic of Mumsnet? Why has this site become such a right wing enclave?

Wbeezer on my opinion that is for historical reasons. Mainly the poll tax that turned Scottish voters from the tories.

I think the Tory voting problem has been caused by Labour being in such a mess for a few years - remember, it's only 10/11 years since a labour government lost power having been voted in 13 years earlier in an absolute landslide.

Believe me, I feel pretty disenfranchised living under SNP rule - a party I have never voted for.

@starryeyesuprise if you think the uk is so divided , do you think a ref now is the answer to less divide?
I think the media make more of the division than there actually is , living in london for years and now south west it is a minority who have issues . The vast majority just get on with life.

@starryeyesuprise if you think the uk is so divided , do you think a ref now is the answer to less divide?
I think the media make more of the division than there actually is , living in london for years and now south west it is a minority who have issues . The vast majority just get on with life.

A while ago the very small number of Muslim people in our small town spoke out on the local Facebook page. Local people were suggesting that our town isn't racist. The local Muslims, who have lived here for decades and run small businesses, explained that they had put up with discrimination all their lives.

@reprehensibleme yes labour have lost a lot of voters.
I think local ge may show a bit of different picture but all the parties seem to of lost voters , I know so many who would rather tick a box , saying none of the above.
Labour were just not a credible opposition last time.
My area was a massive lib dem area no one else really got a look in but now strong conservative as local candidates not the same and labour barely feature as we are nit an area it seems to target.

@StarryEyeSurprise you aren't taking your own advice today. I think we should take a leaf from @noblegiraffe Klaxon alert! Here they come with the astroturf. Don't engage !!

What on earth do you mean astroturfing? , I'm an individual reacting as an individual to an open discussion on a public forum, do you actually believe we're coordinating posting to squash your views. Or ciukd it ve tgat quite a lot if people actualky refine their views by arguing and discussing them. Yes, i get a bit annoyed sometimes reading these threads and only join in when I'm in the mood for robust debate but i always learn something or am reminded of a point I had forgotten about when i do join. My views on independence are by no means set in stone and it is not something I'm dead set against, but I refuse to treat this like a sectarian divide because it isn't.

Lol. Abort!! Abort!! The thread isn't going the OP's way!

Interesting many PP citing Estonia gaining independence from USSR as a reason for Scotland to gain independence. I confess my exposure to Estonia is limited to the superb film, The Fencer and I hear they have excellent and free internet. I would argue that the U.K. is not similar to the USSR so it’s simplistic to draw parallels to Estonia and Scotland in that respect. Didn’t Corbyn want free internet for everyone? I thought it was a great idea. What was wrong with Jeremy corbyn with all the left leaning mumnetters? I voted for him.

I think Europe may look very different in the future. Angela Merkel is stepping down and her successor of the Christian democratic unionists Armin Laschet has been sympathetic to Syrian dictator Bassar al-Assad. With a huge gas pipeline being built between Russia and Germany, whoever becomes chancellor of Germany they surely has to keep on the right side of putin.

I fell down the rabbit hole that is political compass yesterday and was surprised just how right wing many of the administrations in power in Europe have been. Leo varadkhar veered Fine Gael towards the right however I believe Sinn Fein won the Irish election. Macron in France and merkel in Germany were surprisingly right wing too. All the parties in the EU are classed as right wing authoritarian.

Would our roll out of vaccinations been even slower waiting if we’d still been in Europe? Who knows but I’m glad we weren’t aren’t in the EU in that respect.

So if someone dares to disagree they are astroturfing....... no wonder the SNP and Yes campaign appeared to be a bit Stepford. This is my bloody country too, thanks, and just because I don’t believe in your vision of the sunny uplands doesn’t mean my opinion’s any less valid.

@reprehensibleme

So if someone dares to disagree they are astroturfing....... no wonder the SNP and Yes campaign appeared to be a bit Stepford. This is my bloody country too, thanks, and just because I don’t believe in your vision of the sunny uplands doesn’t mean my opinion’s any less valid.

Here here

And the EU has some pretty dubious governments in places with views we would not endorse. I didn't vote for the leader of Hungary or for Macron or Merkel.

Yet some people would rather align with Poland (abortion anyone) than with a very old union blended across borders, within families and amongst friends.

It is so odd. And ideological rather than practical.

You know I still don't understand why no action has ever been taken against Johnson, Gove and the others re their £350 million for the NHS Brexit lie strategy.

I know Trump was impeached twice. Once was for lying was it not? Are UK Government PMs just immune from any action for using lies to persuade others during referendums?

Actually I've just answered my own question- the strategy of £360m for the NHS, Turkey and other project fear tactics were fronted by Johnson before he was PM.

Oh dear no politician wants to open up the can of worms of lying to the electorate as the spotlight might focus on them. Perhaps because either NS and Peter Murrell was lying too or is it all just a misunderstanding?
Craig Murray’s trial is on at the moment concerning him blogging about the Alex Salmond case. Apparently you can listen to it by telephone.

@Jodri

Oh dear no politician wants to open up the can of worms of lying to the electorate as the spotlight might focus on them. Perhaps because either NS and Peter Murrell was lying too or is it all just a misunderstanding? Craig Murray’s trial is on at the moment concerning him blogging about the Alex Salmond case. Apparently you can listen to it by telephone.

What lie did the FM tell the electorate?

Turms out that the Vote Leave campaign were found guilty of breaking Electoral Law and Leave. EU were referred to the National Crime Agency in 2018.
Robert Mercer (huge donor to Vote Leave and pals with Johnson) was also Donald Trump's biggest donor. Interesting.

I wonder what new lies they'll come up with for the Scottish referendum and if Cummings will play as big a part as he did in Brexit.

Why would Cummings be involved?

It will be interesting to see if/when Scotland becomes independent what happens to all the promises we have been made about an independent Scotland. I’m sure they’ll all come to pass. (Sarcasm, in case anyone’s in doubt.)

imagine making misleading statements to try and win a referendum....

www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/oct/23/alex-salmond-eu-legal-advice-scotland

Well Cummings ran the vote leave campaign, Farage was a public figure and then Johnson and Gove joined. Cummings has obviously never been elected but obviously was working very closely with Johnson and I didn't really buy the whole 'walking out of Downing St with a box of belongings' photoshoot. I believe he's still in tow with and has leverage with Johnson.

@StarryEyeSurprise absolutely, his advisors are linked closely to Us for Them , Covid recovery group, ERG, Vote Leave and the Scottish Conservatives.
The thing with astroturfing is, not everyone is a paid shill of these groups, loads of well meaning individuals fall for their " grass roots " front. There don't need to be many " ordinary mum" voices raised in outrage before people join in, especially on the web. Spaces increasingly become echo chambers as balanced voices are excluded.
Some of the markers for this right wing activism

Anti masking
Covid denial / lockdown questioning and refusal
Anti vax
Reference to immigrants/ migrants
Excluding other voices through hounding and " bulldogging"
Herd immunity and GBD
Threat to family from gay and trans groups
Threat from political correctness/ woke / left wing gone mad

If you don't believe me there is a lot here although anyone who believes in the above will not like it

bylinetimes.com/

I do wonder how much of mumsnet and Scotsnet has been infiltrated.

Scotsnet and Mumsnet definitely 100% infiltrated by political persauders...its so obvious...what they do is join a thread and grind it down till folk get fed up and stop posting on it....it becomes very tedious and squashes any discussion.

I've never heard of astroturfing. I thought it's what people play football on!

Infiltrated hilarious