ERA EMMA ALICE testing thread 7

[VenusStarr]

Hi all. We're on our 7th thread! Really hoping for some more positive news in the coming months.

@VenusStarr did Coventry put you on sitagliptin like @Lori2022 was recommended, I remember you got put on something for a few months.

Thank you @Gardenlady543 yes, @Lori2022 I have used sitagliptin. Unfortunately I didn't have a great experience. It was this time last year and I was on it for 3 months. But when we went to start an ivf transfer cycle, I had suspected scar tissue so had to have a hysteroscopy but my lining didn't look good. The hysteroscopy was clear so we tried again and I had 2 cancelled FET cycles plus no luck on a natural cycle. I never got above 6mm and lost triple layer. I'd previously done a textbook medicated FET with 6mg of progynova and got to 8mm by day 12, but had a MMC.

I eventually got good triple layer lining on low dose stims but bfn. I'm not sure if it was the sitagliptin so I don't want my experience to put you off xx

@Gardenlady543

Hi. I really need some advice. I have just had my swab result from Invivo and I’m feeling anxious. It said no gardnerella, but I have high levels of atopobium vaginae of 12.4. I don’t seem to be able to hold onto lactobacillus crispatus. The only one I have is lactobacillus Jensenni. I’m so scared as transfer is Tuesday but don’t feel confident.

@Gardenlady543 Can atopobium vaginae turn into bacterial vaginosis?

@2021ivfagain I don't know much about it, it's an anaerobic bacteria and is one of the bacteria seen in BV so yes it can cause it.

Is the level significant enough to be considered an active BV infection? What has you clinic said do you need antibiotics, could you ask them whether you should have antibiotics prophylactically at this point?

I know they said stop probiotics pre transfer and just use canesbalance after. I think if it was me I would stop testing for pH and use a daily vaginal probiotic, since whatever you do you don't seem to keep the lactobacillus when you stop adding it in, but you would need to ensure your clinic are ok with this as I can't tell you to do the opposite of the people responsible for your care and I'm not sure where you can go to for any different medical advice out side of your clinic, at the point where your transfer is imminent.

@Gardenlady543 I’m trying to get the result back from my nutritionist but she wanted to include the summary. I just need the report as crgh said they will review it. It’s 12.4. Last year at one point it was 4 and that was high so apparently this is really high but that’s the only issue.

My husband does not want to put it off another month as we’re running out of money but I feel really bad about this transfer.

I can’t get messages to my consultant very easily as his Secretary is on annual leave! But I can’t get advice because I’m waiting for the report from invivo. My nutritionist has it but I can only email her. It’s so frustrating.

What does it mean to take antibiotics prophylactically?

I’ve had no support about what to do with microbiome. They are not worried. They gave me a basic swab yesterday at the clinic but last time I had a bad infection their basic swab did not pick it up!

I feel as though with high levels of atopobium vaginae I have a very poor chance. Sorry for the moan. I just don’t know what to do.

@2021ivfagain some FET cycles have antibiotics in them as a preventative measure, usually doxycycline. You could see your gp and get some antibiotics if this test shows you need them.

@Gardenlady543 The problem is Doxycycline does me no favours. It was after taking 2 or 3 lots of doxycycline when things started to get bad. It also caused chronic ibs. I think I need a 2 week supply of metronidazole plus boric acid tablets imminently. Or what you said before about intravenous of it but then would I be able to take probiotics vaginally still? A consultant is reviewing my results.

I’m feeling like I should cancel my transfer. If they can’t give me antibiotics or if they just prescribe 4 doxycycline tablets to take on the day and no probiotics to take soon after, that will be a problem. My consultant has not heard of Flora Femme even though it was on my list when I had biopsy results!

@Gardenlady543 I’ll cross fingers the scan Monday shows the menopur has done the job.

I'm sorry there is all this complication @2021ivfagain and worry about the transfer. I wish I could help. Sending supportive vibes.

That is so gutting @Loz2467 I’m sorry

I’ve spent most of today in tears, my bestest friend broke news she is pregnant, my head hurts and my eyes sting now, so exhausted by this. Officially now the only childless one in the group. I want to just feel happy, and feel it’s stolen that from me too. Plus she obviously had to delay telling me and was worried about it especially post the failed transfer last month. So I’ve not even been one of the first to know as I would have been if all this not going on. Really hurts. Infertility is shit. It just keeps taking things away from me.

I'm so sorry @Enfys23 that's really rough, this really is the hardest part. Seems like we're the only ones that don't get to live the life everyone else does.

@2021ivfagain you'll have to see if they are willing to prescribe metronidazole, my worry is that if you cancel you could end up in the exact same situation next time. When will you hear back?

I almost set my house on fire by the way, I have to do moxibustion every day and thought I put the big new stick out I used this evening and I didn't, DH just found the bathroom full of the smoke from a whole stick, which luckily I'd left in a glass container. He's currently parading up and down monitoring open windows and doors.

@Enfys23 I’m sorry you’ve been in tears. I know what it’s like. I do have a son, but it took a long time and now at my age I’m losing hope for a second.

@Gardenlady543 Sorry you’ve had stress with the moxibustion. They said they would let me know tomorrow. Problem is if atopobium vaginae was slightly high I wouldn’t worry as much but it’s really high. I just want to bring it down. I feel as though it being 12.4 I’m setting myself up for failure. My microbiome is never going to be perfect.

My nutritionist is going to give me a protocol tomorrow. She thinks I need garlic tablets as well. Also I’m getting lots of odd discharge since I stopped vaginal probiotics and my consultant only wants me to use canesflor post transfer and not often. I think if I cancel I will give it one more go, but use boric acid with antibiotics and a probiotic. I will also use Flora femme more. She also said about doubling up on oral probiotics. Do you take two a day? I think my problem as well is lack of lactic acid. My body struggles to make it.

@2021ivfagain yeah I take loads of oral probiotic and then add in probiotic food as well. See what they say tomorrow.

@Gardenlady543
Crgh called and they have reviewed the result but won’t prescribe me antibiotics because the result is from Invivo. They are waiting for their swab test which is less sensitive and didn’t pick up anything. I need to make the decision today before 4pm whether to proceed. He also does not want me taking probiotics post transfer and changed his mind for the 4th time about taking vaginal probiotics up until transfer day.

What can I do? I don’t trust their swab tests as last year when I had gardnerella and atopobium vaginae their basic swab test did not pick them up. I’m experiencing bad discharge every day but there is no smell and I have no candida. My ph is obviously raised.

@2021ivfagain what did your nutritionist advise, I can't tell you to go against your specialist, so I think you need to talk to them and reach an agreed decision on the plan.

@2021ivfagain I've just seen someone talking about this working for them

www.dafrapharma.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/3FIFLUOE-2021-web.pdf

@Gardenlady543 My Nutritionist advised antibiotics with oral and vagina probiotics as well as garlic tablets. However, my consultant will not prescribe with the Invivo result.

Embryologist sent the consent forms late as others have expired so I won’t be able to transfer now anyway.

Home Diagnostics are a recognised place where a doctor would recommend antibiotics which I could forward on to my IVF clinic but I did not have gardnerella when I last checked. They do not test for atopobium vaginae. They do a bv test but atopobium vaginae is not bv.

My swab from CRGH will not be back until tomorrow at which point it’s too late for transfer anyway.

How do you prepare for the cycle? Do you take metronidazole before each cycle?

@Gardenlady543 Does atopobium vaginae turn into bv if not treated? The nutritionist did recommend clindamycin this time but I do have lactobacillus Jensenni in my vagina. That’s the only one.

@Gardenlady543 Thank you so much. This looks good. Do you recommend taking it for 2 weeks or just one? Is it easy to purchase online? It looks like it’s more effective than antibiotics.

@Gardenlady543 Sorry for all the messages. Do I need a prescription for it? Or where can I order it in U.K.? Thanks

@2021ivfagain i used fluomizin and it treated gardnerella. I got it online from Health Express no prescription needed x

@2021ivfagain I haven't heard of it before but saw it recommended and when I searched the first thing that came up is the website that @Lori2022 used. Looks like you would need to fill in a form that a doctor checks where you can put about bv symptoms and they'll send it out. It's worth a try I think. I have been doing antibiotics in the cycle off before the Ivf transfer cycle, but only because of the procedures I've been having.

@Gardenlady543 I’m also going to try to go online to Superdrug and see about getting metronidazole 400mg -7 days. Is this the typical course?

@2021ivfagain sorry it's been so stressful and your clinic haven't been helpful.

@2021ivfagain yes 400mg I usually do three times a day for 7 days. Can you pick up from the store? Otherwise I'd go with one where you can order a longer course as I think quite often they do twice a day courses.