ERA EMMA ALICE testing thread 7

[VenusStarr]

Hi all. We're on our 7th thread! Really hoping for some more positive news in the coming months.

@Gardenlady543 As vaginal Physioflor is no longer available, do you take oral Physioflor? My nutritionist recommended to increase oral probiotics. I already take Inessa Advanced Complex for ibs, Boulardii, prebiotic powder and Pro Bio for women with lactobacillus crispatus and lots of other strains which is very good. Does increasing oral probiotics affect nk cells in blood?

@2021ivfagain I don't know the impact on probiotics on nk cells. I haven't heard anything about that. I take bio me femme v, optibac for women and femdophilus.

I'm so sorry you've been having all this stress @2021ivfagain ❤️ I know you were undecided about transfer but it's awful that the clinic messed up like that. Xx

Hi Ladies, I hope you’re all doing ok/feeling better.
@Gardenlady543 I’m sorry you were having one of those days recently. This really is a rollercoaster of a journey and it’s so important for our mental health to make time for ourselves. It’s great you’ve got a few crafty things to try to focus on. I wrote down a list of things I would spend time doing during IVF, including Lego, mindful colouring but have not been very disciplined. Instead I find myself spending hours on end doing research and getting carried away and overthinking everything. I’m sorry if I’m missed this in the posts - are you preparing for an EC atm or for an FET? I saw you’re taking Letrozole followed by menopur, so assume it’s an FET?

@Enfys23 I recently had similar news and as much as I wanted to be happy for them, it felt like a slap in the face. I really hope our time will come very very soon.

@2021ivfagain I’m so sorry for what you’ve experienced the last few days. The uncertainty just before a planned transfer must be incredibly stressful mentally and physically. I hope you’re able to get some answers from CRGH and challenge them on the tests and find a plan that works for you to move forward with.

I’m not sure if I’ve outlined it here before. I had 15 eggs collected, 11 were mature, 10 fertilised, 5 embryos 5AA - 4BB. They first thawed a 5AA which didn’t fully expand, and then they thawed a 4AB which also didn’t fully expand. We were put on the spot as to which one of the two we wanted to transfer and given the option to transfer both. We said we only want one so they transferred the 4AB as it supposedly looked better. They called us the next day to say the 5AA never made it in the incubator, so I’m very certain the 4AB they transferred wasn’t viable. In the end, we feel like they transferred an embryo that never had a chance of surviving.

I managed to see my consultant privately and outlined my concern with my embryos. The consultant initially said perhaps there are chromosomal issues but then looked at our numbers again and said it’s very odd for embryos of this grading not to thaw properly. I’m really at a loss as to whether something went wrong on the day in the lab when they froze our embryos or whether there could be chromosomal issues. We could get PGT on the remaining 3 embryos but if the embryos don’t thaw.. alternatively, I prepare for an FET and if we turn up and the embryo hasn’t fully expanded we decline the transfer. It’s so painful to have a potentially unviable embryo put back in, take medication and injections for 11 days to get a BFN at the end of it.

I also asked if we would do mild stims for the next (and last on the NHS) transfer and they said my lining was thin during stims for EC and said my body needs a break and that they would plan my FET. I need to wait until the end of the month to find out the plan and who knows when I’ll be able to start! Really want to know sooner what the plan would be, but with the potential embryo issue, I don’t know if we should plan for another cycle privately.

Thanks @Spin101 I'm in a modified natural FET. Today will be the 4th day on menopur 75 units, unfortunately fyremadel shuts down my cycle so I'm not sure if anything is happening, I've been testing estradiol at home and it's still low which is a bad sign :( I'll be in for a scan tomorrow, I'm feeling fullness, so I really don't know what's going on as if the follicles are growing I'd expect estradiol to be going up.

I'm sorry about your experience, I wouldn't be thawing to biopsy, the risk is too high of the embryos surviving that but not getting through the thaw to transfer. There are a two stories out there of people who had all their embryos fail to thaw, here is one of the cases https://www.reddit.com/r/AskEmbryologists/comments/q3t80h/noneoffour88embryossurviveddthethawinggprocess/?utmsource=share&utmmmedium=iosapp&utmmname=iossmf

@Gardenlady543 I hope you have some good news with the next scan. It’s all so frustrating.

My husband started to feel unwell yesterday so I have been told to stop the steroids as I didn’t take them for long. I hope I get most of my money back as embryology forgot to send us a new consent form in time which meant that they could not be completed and I was told to make the decision before 4pm yesterday. My husband did not get home until then so we were out of time anyway, but with my husband’s virus and my vaginal infection it would have been risky.

I’m feeling really anxious about the money situation.

@Spin101 Are you at CRGH? At CRGH they tend to do assisted hatching for people 38 and over but you might be a lot younger. It’s an awful predicament. I’m feeling really anxious and my husband feels it might not meant to be with all the delays and setbacks. I really hope you succeed and I would avoid biopsy especially if under 40. When I was 38, I avoided PGS testing as I could not afford it and it worked.

@Gardenlady543 Was there any option of delaying the start of fyremadel? Is that the only injection that stops ovulation? Would a higher dosage of menopur help at all with increasing your estradiol levels? (sorry I’m thinking out loud). I really hope they’re able to give you more information at your scan tomorrow!!

Thank you for sharing the Reddit post. It is scary to think it could be a lab error! I don’t think I will test my remaining embryos.

@2021ivfagain I’m on the NHS atm and am 36 soon. I’m considering CRGH if we decide to go private.

I’m sorry, it really sucks having done all the prep for the FET and you not wanting to risk it makes perfect sense. I hope your husband feels better very soon!!

Has anyone used gynoflor probiotic and if so where can you get it? I read about one containing a low dose of estradiol to help improve natural glycogen to help with lactic acid.

I haven't heard of it @2021ivfagain if it has estradiol then you wouldn't be able to use it in cycles unless they are medicated. Did you order the fluomizin?

@Spin101 I guess for the future it would be an option but I took it last FET and when I did stims and it was ok, I guess I just need to see how things look tomorrow. I have 600 units of menopur and I've used 300 units so there is still some left if I need more.

This thread is moving so fast, I've definitely not caught all the updates. We need a weekly News In Brief lol.

I'm sorry you had a tough week @VenusStarr, is your dh feeling any better now?

Hope your ovaries are feeling better, how is the cycle going? @Gardenlady543

@Lori2022 what were your NK results? And anyone here for that matter that had the tests? I just got mine back and they’re all normal, as are my thyroid tests. A bit baffled by it all, they’re unlikely to let me try pred now. Have you guys managed to try pred with normal results?

My nk results were 0.79 million/ml, 16% for the pregnancy tissue test they do (should be under 20) and my balance of good/bad immune cells was also normal, as was my thyroid. I guess I’m hoping the only implantation we had happening while on low dose pred was a coincidence. Hopefully our issue is DH’s sperm and not my immune system as well, but we can’t know for sure.

@Enfys23 thanks! We sent all of DH’s results off to him tonight, some more to come back yet, really hoping he can help. How is the cycle going?

I use the oral physioflor, can never get the vaginal one.

@thislittlebird I had uterine nk cell numbers tested in Coventry and they were normal and had the over under activated biopsy as well which was also normal. But my nk cells in the blood were slightly raised with a complete hla dqa1 match so I'm on an immune protocol for that.

You're right we need a summary of where everyone is at, I get confused trying to keep up!

@Gardenlady543 good luck at the scan tomorrow

@2021ivfagain I'm so sorry this cycle has been so awful. It's tortuous having to start and stop like that. For peace of mind I think it's generally better not to transfer if I have misgivings but then I have to balance this with the fact that I always have some misgivings.

@Spin101 I probably know a lot less about it than you as I'm definitely no expert on the defrosting process but my most recent transfer hadn't fully expanded and it was successful. But I'm not sure if that always means the same thing so may not be comparable with your situation I know x

@2021ivfagain I hope you're doing as ok as you can be.

@Gardenlady543 good luck today.

@thislittlebird congrats on the clear results. Although sometimes you want them to find something to fix. Hope you're feeling alright about it.

@seven201 it’s a bit conflicting really, like you say. My biggest worry is that the only implantation I’ve had from 3 x good (non-tested) blasts, and 2 x bad quality, non-blasts transferred has been the third attempt when I took 10mg of pred. Can’t help thinking there’s a correlation, but I know that’s confirmation bias. It will haunt me though, when we move into another cycle.

Scan has gone really badly, the follicles have not budged at all and the lining has dropped from 4.8mm to 3.2mm. The fyremadel was started too early clearly and has completely messed up the cycle.

Oh shit, I'm so sorry @Gardenlady543

Oh @Gardenlady543 I am so sorry 😞 I know how cancelled FET cycles feel. Its so upsetting. Sending love ❤️ do you have to work today?

Thank you for asking @thislittlebird he's still not better, but is slowly getting there I think. We go away early next week and he's despite feel OK for that.
Do you have autoimmune issues (seem to remember you do... ) its your nhs cycle isn't it? I can understand your worries. Would you consider private for the steroids?
Also second a news in brief! 😅

@seven201 how are you?

@Enfys23 ❤️

@Lori2022 hope you're doing ok

@2021ivfagain How's things with your cycle?

Love to all xxx

@VenusStarr
I had to cancel my transfer as I was worried about my infection which seems to be getting worse. Waiting to get the tablets recommended but need to sort out address details as they would not let me add house number! Also consent forms from embryology were delayed and when husband came home from work he said he needed to take a covid test. With me being on steroids and needing help with our toddler after transfer, I did not want to take the risk. My husband’s virus was final straw and it’s the fifth time in 6-7 months he is self-isolating. It’s horrible.

So the doctor spoke to me and said that my body isn't doing what it should be, he said he thinks we should cancel and then start again with the next bleed and scan cd1 or cd2 for the baseline. He said next time to use just menopur no letrozole.

He wonders if the follicles on cd8 were residual from the last cycle but I know they weren't as it was painful when they were growing.

I said that the fyremadel was started too early and it stopped everything and he said he had to start fyremadel on cd8 because my lh was 10. He said because my lining is so thin I won't get a period for a while, so we said since the menopur is open and will only go to waste to inject 112.5 today, 75 tomorrow and 112.5 Wednesday, no more fyremadel and scan on Thursday. It's pretty likely things will get cancelled but who knows, without the fyremadel there is still a chance and at the very least if my lining can at least thicken, I hopefully won't need to wait weeks for a period.

I have been checking my estradiol and know it's been low but I just didn't expect for absolutely nothing to happen with the menopur :(

@Gardenlady543 that sounds like a good plan. One last shot at this cycle and if not hopefully helps with an earlier bleed. Still very upsetting news though. Are you happy with the plan?

@VenusStarr your poor dh. Really hope he's recovered for your time away. How are you doing? I'm ok. Clearblue weeks is stuck on 1-2 (equivalent of 3-4) but I'm 5+3 according to CRP but I do think I implanted late. Google tells me clearblue weeks can just not work for some people and I have a strong line on first response, so clinging on to that. Hoping for my medichecks HCG fingerprick test to arrive today or tomorrow. Scan on 15th so hoping to at least make it to then! Currently in the dentist waiting room as I have a toothache. Also got a bunged up nose so not been sleeping. Gosh sorry, that was quite the whinge!

@seven201 it was good that the doctor could quickly bring me in and speak to me, he initially said to cancel but it's just l I have spent so much on drugs for this cycle, it's worth at least using up the menopur, I still have hope somehow, as I know things can turn completely around in 2-3 days but obviously the lining getting thinner is a pretty bad sign. I think maybe this is the rollercoaster nature of modified natural cycles. That's good that you've ordered a beta to hopefully get some clarity.

@VenusStarr sorry your partner is not feeling well still, I hope he starts feeling better soon ❤️

I've been taking the nytol and I'm feeling so drowsy :(

@Gardenlady543 I think it's good to at least try. From what I remember menopur doesn't last ages once open. Did I tell you years ago I wasted a whole bottle of menorpur when I accidentally turned the fridge off for a day when I mowed the lawn?! Fingers crossed for a u-turn on lining and follicles for you.

So the dentist said I have toothache as I'm stressed and anxious so probably clenching or grinding my teeth. A bit of a wake up call that I do need to try and de-stress and get off Google and occupy my mind! I think I should get a sewing project on the go. I'm now sat in a cafe (it's my day off).

@Gardenlady543 I’m keeping my fingers crossed for you. At least you have options. It’s not over. You still have a chance with this cycle. I know it’s hard. All you can do is take one day at a time.

@Gardenlady543 I’m so sorry your lining got thinner. That really sucks, especially if it’s because of the fyremedal being being started too soon. I really hope it thickens up again before your next scan so that you can continue with the cycle. Why did they tell you to take letrozole before menopur? How have you been measuring your estradiol levels?

@Janefx40 Thank you, that is reassuring!

@2021ivfagain I’d like to do some at home vaginal ph tests. Do you have any recommendations for tests?

Thanks everyone, they measured my estradiol on CD8 and it was 136... today's value at CD14 was 36 😳 so nobody has a clue what has happened. I feel a bit sad really because there was an opportunity to take bloods inbetween to pick up on this trend and it has been 4 days without a scan where nothing has happened in my body. I guess I'm back to CD1 type of appearance and with only 3 doses of menopur and then I run out. I guess letrozole isn't for me and adding in the fyremadel hasn't helped. I thought we had the formula right from the last cycle but it seems that the more hormones that are added in the worse my body copes.