ERA EMMA ALICE testing thread #6

[Gardenlady543]

@Janefx40 @birdbybird @seven201 @Gardenlady543 @patientpatient @MyEasterEggs @thislittlebird @Yuliaaa @Violette22 @2021ivfagain @OrangeBengal @Enfys23 @Loz2467 @DEIVF @Hopeful199 @ER12 @greendress789 @Douchas12111 @Lori2022 @AdviceForJane @Anonbaby @Molls87 @ChickenT2b @GoldenElephant @IVF22 @StillTrying10000 @warrior101 @whatcangowrong @Yaynayokay

Oh yes it really has happened we are onto thread #6.

All are welcome to join us, we started out as people interested in ERA EMMA ALICE but we seem to have had every test available between us.

So if you want to know about the microbiome, reproductive immunology or you just feel your case is complicated and what like minded people to talk to about it you've come to the right place

@Gardenlady543
What I meant is as my fsh got so high the only reliable way of suppressing it is with hrt doing oestrogen priming with dhea etc. My fsh got to 24 last July when I was oestrogen priming but not taking dhea and instead of norethisterone I took another progesterone which was terrible. You see norethisterone also helps to lower fsh. My fsh is really bad and yet when I do a superovulated FET cycle I respond perfectly as my fsh is suppressed. I’m 41 years old. My body has changed since 40.5. I produce less lactic acid naturally due to lower oestrogen levels. I did look into Chinese herbs but even the specialist producing the herbs said my fsh is so bad I would need some hrt with it. Also the Chinese herbs cost me £300. I cannot afford £300 a month for something that might not work as well. It also works well in conjunction with acupuncture which also costs £50 a session.

Did you recognise any of the ingredients? I might stop it but I’m still in this cycle so not in cd1 yet. Canesbalance says not for use when TTC due to lactic acid I think as well. I will stop and just use canesbalance. What worked well for me yesterday was vagibiom plus canesbalance even though I know vagibiom already has lactic acid. It does not have glycogen which I also lack due to lowering oestrogen levels. When I first hit 40, my amh was 16, but it had been preserved by pregnancy at 38 and breastfeeding.

@Gardenlady543

I will not take anymore. I only took one yesterday evening. Do you think I should cancel my next cycle or do you think one vaginal capsule on cd31 will do damage when I’m several days away from transfer? Sorry just feeling anxious as this is it for me.

@2021ivfagain I mean without knowing much about it, if it's just acid I would have used it too at this time and not been that worried. But I really don't know anything about whether the other ingredients are harmful is some way.

@Gardenlady543 Ok. Thanks. If I’ve only used one and I was on cd31 and about 3 weeks away from the transfer, would they effects last for 3 weeks? I won’t use anymore. I don’t know what to do as my IVF clinic don’t know much about probiotics.

It's got quiet on here, I'm having acupuncture tonight, I found someone local, they don't have much availability but I guess anything is better than nothing and I may as well try. Work is still really getting to me which is really hard as I need an easy life and I can't take this extra stress :(

That’s great @Gardenlady543 I find it so useful. My acupuncturist is just lovely and it’s a good space to vent and talk with someone not family/friend/medical. Especially given you’ve got work stress going on.
I’m just prepping for the review appt on Monday. Work’s been a bit better this week for me, less overwhelming.
Did people use sildenafil tablets vaginally or do you have to take by mouth if not special pessaries? I’m wondering about just adding them into natural cycle FET prep for lining.
I do feel it’s been right call to give myself some space. Though I’m so aware time pressing with the low ovarian reserve issue I just needed so breathe post the BFN.

@Enfys23 can you get vaginal ones? I've only heard of people in Greece having them. I used oral but I don't think it's as effective.

Acupuncture was good, she did the moxibustion and gave me some to go home with. DH and I celebrated v day at the weekend, he is away for work at the moment, it's very quiet out, I went to the supermarket and it's so quiet it's eerie.

I’m just wondering whether I can stick the oral tablets up there! The clinic seemed to suggest I could take Progynova oral tabs vaginally (I never ended up doing that as cycle cancelled anyway and then went for natural cycle next time) so just thought same could be true for Viagra tabs. It seems pointless to use orally from what I can read up on it so think I’ll only try if can do vaginally.

Glad the acupuncture was good @Gardenlady543 . My DH away with work too. Had loads of people in work asking either if I’m better (because they realise I was on sick leave) or if I had nice time/break (because they think I was on annual leave) so hard to know what to say!

@Enfys23 it is hard, when I came back after Xmas having had the chemical I was asked how my Xmas was and I replied terrible and then they asked if I have plans to go away and I said no. My life sucks and I can't go anywhere as I needed all the tests after the chemical and I also couldn't afford it anyway due to all my money going on IVF. I don't even try to pretend I'm ok. I don't think you can do this with oral viagra because I'm pretty sure the place in Greece is having to prepare the meds somehow.

@Gardenlady543 that's good you've found an acupuncturist. Anything is worth a try. Sorry about work, hopefully the acupuncture will help with the stress from that too.

@Enfys23 I've only ever done viagra orally. I've done estrogen tablets mix of oral and vaginally though - some doctors have been a bit eyebrows raised at that - it was a doctor who told me to! I'm glad you feel some space has helped a bit.

I'm also away from DH for Valentine's Day, I'm at my sisters. Had a 6 hr round trip to CRP clinic today while my sister looked after my dd. It was for my after ovulation scan to check on my excess fluid in uterus. It's less than before ovulation and he referred to it as minimal, but obviously there shouldn't really be any that shows on a scan. It measured just under 2mm. My lining was 8mm and it's probably 5 days after ovulation so I'm happy with that! Prof S is going to check with the surgeon next week but he doesn't think there's much that can be done for my fluid, given I already had surgery on my c-section niche. He said there's not much evidence on fluid stopping implantation but hopefully just a little is ok. So ignoring that problem for now. Some months it's worse than others, and this month seems pretty low/good.

Hi everybody. Hope you are all ok. I’m conscious I just drop in here once in a while to ask a question as you are all so helpful! I was wondering if anybody knew of any guidance on how far in advance of Alice/Emma biopsy it is ok to take vaginal probiotics? I dont want to end up with misleading test results. My clinic saying don’t need to take anything as we don’t have your alice/Emma results yet but I want to get myself in best position possible ahead of the test.

Ive been reading a few of the messages on here and it seems quite a few people are having a hard time with things. I’m really sorry, this process is so hard. I had quite a depressing time over Christmas as well and so much ivf admin to deal with now! Good to have this as a support network which I think is really important x

@seven201 that’s great news about the lining thickness but I’m sorry there’s still uncertainty about the niche issue. I hope you get some answers. I take it you’ve already had 2nd/3rd opinions on it?

@IVF22 I was taking probiotics anyway as I had recurrent thrush issues before, so just continued for my ALICE/EMMA. I had really good lactobacilli and a normal result otherwise, which I don’t think it’s a bad thing to influence it with probiotics, especially as I’ll continue the Optibac for women throughout treatment anyway, and at least reassured me what I was taking was doing a good job.

@seven201 I'm glad you've had it checked, sorry there's more real answers or solution but I guess if it was an issue, Dr S would say stop ttc until its sorted, so there's definitely still hope! Great lining too 👍 When's your test day?

How's the work situation @Gardenlady543 hope things are improving. Glad you liked acupuncture. I do like it, but not doing any at the moment.

@Enfys23 glad your review is coming up, I always like to have a couple of questions prepared. How you feeling about it?

We've had a week off and both been unwell 😕 I've had a terrible sore throat and just felt run down, it feels like a virus, just feeling 'off'. I've not been ill since before covid lockdowns, I'm quite fascinated by it. Dh is still suffering from tummy issues, last day of antibiotics tomorrow 🙌 here's hoping they've done the trick.

I said I'd update about my psoriasis rash... since starting back on hydroxychloroquine, it's now completely gone. Kind of wish I'd done a photo diary of it. It was awful at Christmas and now, no sign it was ever there but a couple of weeks ago it was still pretty bad.

I've got my superovulation protocol now, I'm just waiting for my 3 month blood results, once they're back I'll order my meds.

Lots of love to everyone 💕 💗

@IVF22 The place where I got my vaginal swab done (Juno) said to not use Vaginal probiotics for two weeks before re-testing, in order to give accurate results. When I queried, they said one week would be ok…
Not the same as EMMA/ALICE but hope that gives you an idea.

@IVF22 personally I wouldn't take anything before the biopsy, but probably start probiotics straight after.

@Enfys23 thanks. I've also seen Mr Lower and he said he'd do a hysteroscopy if they did find fluid, but he didn't think they would and didn't really think it was a big issue. I will email him to check but hoping the 'minimal' amount means he still thinks it's fine. @VenusStarr test day next Thursday. Yes, I'm clinging on to them letting me carry on with treatment so there must be a chance.

Sorry you've been unwell Venus. I've been catching everything going but thankfully have had half term with only a runny nose, so feel a bit refreshed. That is interesting about the psoriasis. Well done for getting your protocol sorted. What's on yours? It's probably similar to mine. Pred, hydroxy, intralipids, CoQ10, 75 letrazole, intralipids, aspirin, cyclogest? I think you have that extra med too that I can't remember the name of? I have levothyroxine, a blood pressure med and metformin as well. I have managed to get my gp to put all except the intralipids, CoQ10 and aspirin on a repeat prescription, so that has helped cost wise!

Does anyone know about smear tests and ttc? I've been trying to book a smear test for months around cd 6-12 ish but failing as appointments are very limited. Can I do it after ovulation or is that a bad idea?

@seven201 I wouldn't do it after ovulation if you've ttc that cycle. I'm sorry you're having a difficult time booking it.

Keeping my fingers crossed for you for Thursday.

I'm doing superovulation with gonal f injections, think it's cd2-7 and 5mg of letrozole cd2-6. Plus progynova. Am on hydroxy, ovulation intralipids and will start pred after trigger. Then gcsf injection 6dpo. I'm on 50mcg of levothyroxine. Metformin is in my plan too but I've stopped it (not told Dr S 😬) but I don't think I need it, have no pcos or diabetes and I started having the lining issues so just decided to stop.
That's great that your GP will prescribe! Mine won't...

@VenusStarr that all sounds like a good plan. I've not done any research into gonal-f. I don't blame you on the metformin - it's not a nice one to take. So annoying your gp won't prescribe! I must have been lucky.

I will hold off on the smear for now then, thanks.

@IVF22 you don't want to use vaginal probiotics right before the test as the test will just pick up the one you've just put in. I was told it would be at least 7 days without using them when I did a test in the past. But I think it's best to see what your result is like at baseline without using any.

@VenusStarr oh no sorry you're unwell, that's interesting about the rash going.

@seven201 I'm surprised we aren't all rattling the amounts of meds they put us on. Can you book the smear when you know it's a negative before a period, I did this at the end of a clearly unsuccessful FET cycle once. You could stay on progesterone a bit longer to get it done before your bleed comes on.

I had slightly tinged discharge yesterday so convinced myself it was from some recent implantation, but I think it was just the colour of the vaginal probiotic as I'm 10dpo with a BFN frer. My app says CD1 is due Monday so I'll be starting the FET cycle around then.

@IVF22 I missed the vaginal bit - yes I would agree not to use vaginally pre test.

Hope you’re feeling a bit better today @VenusStarr . I’m feeling okay, I have a few Qs and hope that they’ll have some good ideas.

@seven201 yeah best avoid anything that could cause uterine contractions post ovulation etc.

@Gardenlady543 how are you feeling about starting a new FET cycle?

@Gardenlady543 snap again! My CD1 is due on Monday too, though it might fluctuate a day or two due to the down regulation...
I’ll then book my down reg scan for seven days later, then stims.
Hope your FET prep goes smoothly.

Sorry I’ve been MIA. Just tried to read the latest posts and seems like everyone is onto a plan.

Nothing new with me apart from they kept moving my lap so I’ve decided to go with an FET in March. Well start a down Reg cycle day 1 (hopefully). I haven’t got my protocol yet. So I guess my transfer will only be April time… or later. I had to persuade her for 2 months of down Reg rather than starting prostap on day 21. I was trying to see when I ovulated this month to see when to expect my period and have my meds ready etc but I’m not sure if it’s already happened and I’ve not noticed! Which is typical.

Does anyone find it harder to build lining in FET as I only got to 9mm in the fresh on a 450 and then 300 menopur. So I’m worried I won’t get what I need. Plus like I said lining looked odd on transfer day!

wishing everyone luck who’s starting soon! X

@Loz2467 best of luck with FET. My lining typically gets to 9 - 11mm for medicated FET. I don’t know what it is in a natural cycle, never did one. I guess you won’t know until you try.

Did you recommend Fertility Network for meds? I tried them and will save around £300, thanks!

Thanks everybody for your help with my question x

@seven201 im a follower on this thread but just wanted to say that a consultant told me a little free fluid after ovulation is normal in the pouch of Douglas x