Question for those who are againts surrogacy

[TabooOfNoSex]

Particularly if it’s reasoning such as ’using’ woman’s body and commodifying women's bodies.

How do you feel about porn?
Not necessarily about the industry itself, but watching it?
Do you watch it / what about other’s watching it / would you date (if you care about that stuff) someone who watches it?

Hey welcome, you’re new here I think?
what do you think about surrogacy and porn?

Welcome to Mumsnet.

Don’t watch porn, never watched porn, wouldn’t be with anyone who watched porn.

Against paid surrogacy, against porn. HTH.

I don’t see the connection but since you asked no, I don’t watch porn

Never watched porn.

I’m ‘against’ both surrogacy and porn.

Against Porn, against prostitution and against surrogacy. Women/their bodies are not consumer goods.

And don't understand why it's acceptable to be honest. It looks to me as though the commodification of women's bodies is the only explanation.

Though perhaps men's bodies have been similarly commodified in heavy labour and war. Hmm.

Both are industries that expolit women, especially young vanruble women.

Your question is a non brainer!

No to porn, no to being with someone who consumes porn, no to surrogacy. HTH.

WRT surrogacy. I do not agree with creating a child with the deliberate intention of separating it from its mother at birth. That is unbelievably cruel. Adoptive parents undertake therapeutic parenting to help their child adjust to their loss. Creating a child that you will wound deliberately, is unconscionable. HTH, too.

Hey, thank you, not new really.

But I am learning about surrogacy, reading through other thread (not TAAT) and even though not the same I think there is similarities of exploiting women and their bodies for other’s benefit.
And I asked about porn, not much talk about it lately around here, but I’ve been on threads where it seemed quite a lot were okey with porn.

So, I was just curious.

I’m against both for not quite the same reasons

I was made to watch porn in an early relationship and found it repulsive and it also made me question my attractiveness and value in the relationship. One look at Laila Micklethwaite's work will surely result in understanding why all porn is wrong and it should be banned globally so to keep children safe from sexual abuse and human trafficking.

As is obvious for my posting history, I'm strongly against surrogacy. I'm also against prostitution and strongly reject the "sex work" terminology which suggests it's simply a matter of choice, body autonomy as "sex work is work", which is applied to surrogacy by pro-surrogacy lobbyists and supporters.

Surrogacy and porn and prostitution all involve women 'using' their bodies to earn money. Only one of these three things deliberately involves creating a new human life. There are similarities and but also very, very important differences.

(Sorry not a native speaker so please forgive me if i use weird phrasing)
I am against commercial surrogacy. But not against all porn. The majority of the porn on the internet is awfull an abusive to women… but … There is porn around that is directed by women, womanfriendly, for other woman to enjoy. I think that is part of feminism as well: not to be forced into stereotypical male sexual fantasies but to be free to explore our own female sexual fantasies fully. And if you really want to make sure no actors were abused you could always watch animated-porn.

I think you’re right in saying that surrogacy and porn both may easily lead to exploiting woman and abuse their bodies. But in both cases there could be women who just want to do this job with full consent. And in the case of porn I wouldn’t want to stop them, they’re free to do as they please. But in the case of surrogacy there is the unborn baby that also has right to know were he came from and form a bond with his mother. The baby has no choice, therefore we must protect him as a society.

Anti surrogacy
Anti porn
Anti prostitution

Women's bodies are not commodities to be bought and sold.

Against all of it.
Try reading up on the mother- child dyad to understand how awful surrogacy is for the child apart from the issue of commodifying women's bodies.

If we accept that our sexual drives are moulded by our experiences, then watching porn is likely to lead people to want more porn or the experiences portrayed in porn.

It seems unproductive to me to seek out porn instead of building a relationship with someone to have sex with.

@TabooOfNoSex You'll see comments that are pro porn or anti women because this board is open to anyone online, and its not just feminists who post here.

I don't believe you should be able to rent or buy the inside of women's bodies. But there is an added element to surrogacy which is the child being created in order to be removed.

I firmly believe that if you managed to stop child abuse in all its forms, treat and manage addiction in all its forms, and tackled poverty properly,, porn and prostitution would be massively curtailed. You need women with trauma in order to staff it. Any other industry that's the case for?

Dehumanising women and children through the commodification of their bodies is grotesque across all the various mechanism in which that occurs.

Surrogacy, especially paid one is clear exploitation. It is something women do for money only as a result of inequalities, not because it would be a good idea. It is a relatively new thing, so the societies are setting the rules now and shouldn't make this type of exploitation supported/normal.

I don't see any conditions when surrogacy would really benefit the woman.

With porn, while I suppose majority of the porn is a " bad type" of porn, I kind of can imagine that in some ideal world (unconditional income and so on) some women would still decide to create explicit materials, just for the thrill. It would probably look differently, but it would count as a porn.
I'm against normalisation of porn and prostitution as is now, but I see a qualitative difference between pregnancy and images.

I don't watch porn.

Not sure what porn has to do with surrogacy.

I am against children being born to someone who has been paid to do so.

Against surrogacy, against porn, would not date someone who used it. Why?

Not sure if you were trying for some kind of “gotcha”; but of course you’re going to find a wide variety of opinions across this board.

I also think there’s a large number of women who have been socialised to “accept” porn use as normal; because to do otherwise marks them out as some sort of prudish conservative harridans. And (let’s face it); no one likes to think about the fact that there’s a high chance they’re getting off watching someone get raped; so they just block that thought out.

Since reading these comments OP what do you think about porn (and prostitution) and surrogacy?