Question for those who are againts surrogacy

[TabooOfNoSex]

Particularly if it’s reasoning such as ’using’ woman’s body and commodifying women's bodies.

How do you feel about porn?
Not necessarily about the industry itself, but watching it?
Do you watch it / what about other’s watching it / would you date (if you care about that stuff) someone who watches it?

I quite agree @beAsensible1

"Then again without poverty there is no need for survival sex work."

I hadn't ever encountered 'survival Sex work' as a term before but it fits. I'll be using that. As always, language is important.

Agreed.

One important thing to note, I don't agree with laws that prosecute a woman who has been used as a performer in porn, a mother in surrogacy or a "sex worker" in prostitution primarily because even if she had "free will" and "consented" I see her as a victim of an exploitative industry. Decriminalize the victims, criminalize the Johns, pimps, porn producers/users, commissioning parents.

In altruistic surrogacy, I think it's trickier as women can still be exploited but it's not quite the same thing. When a sister or mother is to be a surrogate for a sister or daughter at least the baby has a chance to be breastfed and not take from its mother at birth. HOWEVER, the optimal altruistic surrogacy is very rare and there are still abuses in these situations - especially if the father and inlaws want to control the surrogate mother.

I dont think pregancy for itself would have the same emotional effects in the child.
We don't allow kittens and puppies to be taken away from their mother at birth but let this happen to human babies. Why do you think it would have less of an impact on a baby than on a kitten to be removed from it's mother?

Also, I HATE the term sex worker but prostitute also seems like blaming the victims. I prefer to say, "women who have been abused by prostitution," but some people have assumed that means many women are just fine being bought for sex and prostitution can exist without abuse.

I want to focus on protecting women and girls from sexual exploitation in all its forms.

Porn is abusive. Don’t watch it or “date” anyone who watches it.

I use sex workers when I talk about women I know because that's what they say. Prostituted women if it's a general comment.

I agree there's no good way to call it what it is while being cognizant that I want no shame or fault to fall on the women.

One important thing to note, I don't agree with laws that prosecute a woman who has been used as a performer in porn, a mother in surrogacy or a "sex worker" in prostitution primarily because even if she had "free will" and "consented" I see her as a victim of an exploitative industry. Decriminalize the victims, criminalize the Johns, pimps, porn producers/users, commissioning parents.

I agree with you absolutely @Delphinium20 and think a number of PPs need to re-think their position with regards to "consent", "choice" and "free will", and ask themselves as to why these are choices that in the main only have to be made by women, and normally poor or vulnerable women at that.

Formatting fail - that first para should have been in bold as I was quoting @Delphinium20

MrsTerryPratchett
I agree it's less about finding the right terminology and more important to respect and help the women regardless how they call themselves.

Hate porn and have no interest but porn does not create life surrogacy does which have means creates a person with their own thoughts and feelings

Not comparable

Have never had much of a view on surrogacy. But the more I see the rich using it even for the best intentions , shows there must be something bad going on or poor people would have the same opportunity: which they don't. So money is potentially buying these women somehow. And these women never have a voice.

Against porn.

Don't have an issue with surrogacy.

I've just posted this elsewhere and I remembered this blog that links to a report on surrogacy reform.

There was a question around a capacity assessment for a 16 year old girl to be a surrogate mother. As a 16 year old can consent to contraception and abortion then I guess this is the next (il)logical step.

Scroll right to the bottom.

stopsurrogacynowuk.org/2023/03/02/surrogacy-reform-letter-to-mps/

I don't know why you are linking porn and surrogacy. Porn can be an addiction, surrogacy is a long drawn out process it's not an impulsive 5 minute wank or an addiction.
I don't watch or support porn or prostitution or strip clubs and I'm against surrogacy.

That’s absolutely shocking. Many girls start having periods in primary school, some as young as 9. Many young teens make contraception decisions prior to legal age of consent (Gillick). This inhumane discussion suggests that any girl capable of conceiving could be considered as a surrogate. This is just another reason why surrogacy should be banned in all forms.

I guess if you are asking if there is a link, then clearly people who are against surrogacy are also against porn😂

You have to be 18 to enter into a contract in the UK so I wouldn't worry too much, that law isnt going anywhere anytime soon.

Porn doesn’t bother me as much as surrogacy.

Mainly because it doesn’t produce a baby who then has to live without knowing half its family and ancestry (if donor) and it doesn’t cause the same damage to a woman’s body or carry the risks of birth.

I don’t watch it, don’t know if DH does, have never asked him.

Exactly. Both exploit women, using them for their parts.

Your question is not a gotcha.

Fairly anti both tbh