The only child free friend in the group, always asked to compromise or organise for others.

[RooRooRu]

I sadly don't have kids. I have 2 close friends who have young and young(ish) kids. We have been friends for roughly 10 years. I completely understand that when you have kids your priorities change, and things don't stay the same as when you had less ties. We have always been pretty good at making an effort to see each other, but I feel the effort is now resting firmly with me to organise our catch ups and for me to compromise on where / what / when we do it to fit in with family life.
The time we meet always fits around nap / routine / weekend sport, I'm often asked to rearrange any pre-existing commitments to accommodate them.
It's often left to me to arrange and book what and where we are doing, because after family life and work they 'just need someone to make the decision for them'
The location is always closer to where they live to make it convenient, not close to where I work or live. Never early dinner in the city after work for example, because that's too hard for them but easy for me.
AIBU and I just don't get it because I've not had to manage the juggle?

But if you’re the one who always does the organising, surely that gives you a disproportionate amount of the power in choosing venue and time?

You have to accept that parents will prioritise their children over everything else but you don't have to agree to change your own plans. Maybe you need to do more things without these old friends and make some new ones now.

I don't have any children. Most of my friends are the same. Im in my 50s so even for those that do have children, children care is not an issue etc. I think it is not unreasonable for you to fit in with them and their commitments. What is not fair is that you do all the organising. Don't do this. If this means you see less of each other, then that's something you will have to accept. It frustrating i know.

It is hard. I’d love to have an early dinner after work but most of the time I have to rush home to drive the kids to their activities. I’d try and be flexible though if I can, it works both ways.

As for being the organiser - I think all groups regardless of children tend to have one. Some of my friends are hopeless at organising anything but always happy to come along.

I would stop bothering with them

I haven’t voted because it’s a bit of both.

Early dinner after work in the city probably is hard to manage for them for example, but ypu shouldn’t have to rearrange your life to accommodate them.

Finding a workable time needs to be everyone’s job not just yours. My friends and I used to create a survey monkey we could fill in ypu find the best time for a group.

While their children are small the reality is that they aren’t entirely in control of their own schedule they can’t just get up and go. They will need to work around eg breastfeeding and their DP/DH’s work schedule too.

But that doesn’t mean your time is less valuable. Don’t allow yourself to be forever to cancel or rearrange your own life to suit them. Improve your boundaries around saying “no” and you’ll resent them less.

For these few years ypu might just have to accept seeing them less. They will wander back your way eventually.

It is definitely harder to juggle when you have childcare, travel and kids activities to sort out. Some people just wouldn’t be able to go out for drinks/ dinner straight after work as they need to get back for nursery picks. Ime lots of patents have very little slack in their systems.
that said it would be nice if there was compromise on their part now and again. Do you have a sense of what days/ times best suit everyone?
A night out is meant to be fun but when you’re a parent of young kids if the stress of going outweighs the fun then I’d say most would just say no.

I was always very motivated to see my friends so I did make the effort and were in a friend group of 5 parents and 3 non parents and we’re still close 30 years later- nights out, dinners, weekends away. Not everyone goes to everything though and that’s fine.

@Wineglassesif I organised a dinner after work in the city for example. One of them would say, no can’t and either wait for me to suggestion something else or suggest a takeout at their home. Which means a long drive or expensive uber.

I can see both sides.

It is difficult to do the juggle, but it's also soul destroying when it's always you doing the compromising and your needs and preferences are always the bottom of the pile.

I suggest you start to push back a bit, decide what compromises you are prepared to make and what you are not, and stick to it.

It's not unreasonable for parents to choose to prioritise their child's routines, but it easy to forget how this might impact on others, especially if the others don't say anything.

If you actually start to say "that is awkward for me, shall we pick a different date?" then they might realise they have to do a bit of compromising too.

Well, their lives are reforming and will naturally lead to them spending more time with new friends with kids because the kids slot in and the other parents are in the same situation. It's a lot easier to do coffee at a soft play than taking the car to meet you and having to navigate that her taking the car means kids can't get to sports practice.

it is entirely reasonable for your friends to plan around nap times because that is their priority at this stage. Its not fair for you to rearrange your other plans, but typically when I'm meeting friends, which I do fairly often now they are older, those plans are made 6 weeks in advance.

They will come back to you, but it will take time. i cant even tell you how much I appreciate my friend, who had kids a good 20 years before me, coming to me and doing 80% of the legwork. Tbf though, where been friends for so long that I went to her a lot when her kids were small.

so gently, yes, you don't really get it because you've not been through it.

It would help to know the ages of the kids and their life set up to get a better opinion though. Like if the kids are primary, it's not likely they will find it easy to do a city dinner, but might be able to book a lunch with you on a week of annual leave, if they don't work term time and have the money. It will also depend if they have flexible jobs.

You need other friends to do the activities and times you want. And just see these friends for occasional at home meet-ups.

in what way have you had to rearrange gour calendar for them? especially if you are organising?

I agree it's a bit of both: I've been the childless friend and I am currently the mother of a child who still naps trying to meet up with friends without children.
you could put your foot down more but ultimately they'll choose their kids over you

Well, unfortunately, having young children is a logistical challenge. A long journey to the city after work can go from being a hassle to an impossibility because you can’t just leave a child alone. I can see why it’s annoying for you, but their lives have changed to include a very real commitment that unfortunately does get in the way of things like going out for dinner or at least makes it a lot more tricky.

that said, nothing is forcing you to continue making the effort if it doesn’t work for you. You always have the choice to step back from the organisation and accommodations you are making.

Honestly, it was a massive juggle having small children and working full time. It was really hard to see friends often, and only really worked for me as dinner after work (in London where my friends also worked) on a weekday night.
I totally get you feeling unhappy with it but it’s just a fact that they have far less capacity and headspace for making arrangements than you do.

But you also have the power to say ‘No, doesn’t work for me’!

It is what it is. Naps and schedules and things just can't change when kids are small. When the youngest kids from the group are around 6 is when you'll start to find you get your mates back, if you can wait that long.

Remember motherhood isn't just logistics - it's a full rewiring of the female brain based on powerful chemicals which mean your mates will probably have experienced pretty substantial personality changes as well. Things they used to prioritize they won't any more.

The good news for you is it's not permanent, though does last longer than the 6-12 months our society expects. In my experience 6 years or so where in my mind my kids were the most important thing in the world and I couldn't comprehend that their schedules might flex for my social engagements. After this your friends will seem more themselves and probably start to be a bit more reasonable in terms of reciprocation, things being balanced etc. For now, it's best to remember that what would feel fair and balanced to an outsider just won't feel that way for them because of their brain chemistry right now (there is a wonderful book called Matrescence which explains this well).

More good news is you can make other friends in the meantime, you don't have to sit around friendless and wait.

We had one childfree friend in our group and she decided to go and make new childfree friends when we all had young kids. It's a shame as we're out the other side now and back to our old selves but she was checked out. I wish she'd known it wasn't going to be forever.

I haven't voted as I think both sides are a bit unreasonable.

It is hard organising a social life when you have kids and work full time but also they shouldn't be asking you to rearrange your own plans or leaving all the planning to you. You might just have to have longer between meet up and arrange further in advance. Or push back on 'sorry that doesn't work for me' more.

Ultimately it depends how much you want to continue those friendships. For friends I do not want to lose I am a lot more flexible, met ups are arranged months in advance so we actually get to see each other. Even for those locally just down the road. We all make the effort to arrange and see each other and compromise. For those friends that do not compromise ever, those are the friendships that slip away after a while.

I can see both sides however, I’ve been the friend who had kids before everyone else and I used to meet in the city after work (although I had kids at home and didn’t work in the corporate world!) I’ve made the effort and so did my childfree friends, it’s not about being childfree or having children it’s about the friendship feeling one sided. Which tbf it does sound like the relationship is a bit one sided.

To be fair though share of a takeout + uber is probably similar price all in to night out at a restaurant?

But I get it feels unbalanced if what you want to do is go out.

All I can say is for me (and all my mates), the postpartum period was nothing like the 6 months the literature would describe and was more like 6 years after my youngest. One day a few years back I woke up and was like - wow - I feel like me again!

During those 8 years (birth of my eldest until second child was 6)

• I didn't have the attention span to read a book
• Any time I went to the cinema I'd fall asleep (so didn't go)
• Theatre same
• If I went to a restaurant I'd just feel I wanted to go home as I'd feel so tired
• Really struggled to engage in non-child related topics
• Struggled to make non child related plans
• Would forget major things like people's birthdays.
• Lost touch with most of my mates as between work, nappies, organizing childcare, organizing baby classes, constantly having someone who was sick or not sleeping or throwing tantrums or not eating vegetables or needing new shoes or suddenly afraid of spoons... I had no mental capacity for anything. And when I did see people I just felt rubbish and boring as I had no time to go places or do things or read or any of the things that make a person fun company.

^^ All of these things represented a TOTAL personality change. Now I'm back to my old self but yes, I get I was a rubbish unavailable friend during that time. And the times I was available I was bo-ring.

Have you thought about what a dinner after work means for them?

If primary age, they will have gotten up and taken kids to school, gone to work, finished earlier than normal to travel into the city, to have dinner and their husband, who may normally do school run on other days, will have had to book an early finish with his work to be on time for collection. It may not even be possible to do a split school run if they share a vehicle with drop offs arranged by that, so even if the husband takes all school runs and car, she would have to finish work even earlier to use public transport to meet you.

So do you see, it's not just you and her in these plans, she has multiple people around her to factor in.

I agree with those saying it is a bit of both, especially if the kids are really little.
My daughter is 3, and I am just now getting to the stage of being able to be more flexible with plans again.
During maternity leave, I was able to be really easy about meeting whenever, because it was just me and Alice and she actually napped better in the buggy - it was just her night sleep that was impossible for a couple of years.
But once I was back at work and she was at nursery, weekdays were just not possible. I don't drive so I was trying to get from our home, to nursery, then into Manchester and along to campus, and then doing the whole thing in reverse at 3.30pm to pick her up for 5pm.
It was really tough.
And once she was 12months old, popping into a restaurant became a whole thing because she was a loud, happy, curious baby! Restaurants were not really her vibe! 😂

So I did have to ask more from my circle to accommodate us if they wanted to see us, but absolutely no worries with being text-buddies for a while if it wasn't convenient for them.

My sister is 27, child-free, and it's really damaged our relationship because she wanted me to come down to London for the day, or to come down and stay overnight, and I just had to say no. It didn't work for us. My daughter wasn't going to manage two two-hour train journeys in one day, and I didn't want to be sleeping on a sofa in a shared house with a little kid who didn't sleep through the night even in her own home.
My sister was welcome to come up, and I'd gladly pay the train fare to make it fairer, but she saw it as having to put all the effort in and I got sick of feeling like I had to explain myself over and over that for her, the journey was just chilling with her phone or kindle for a bit, and for me it was a lot more complicated.

Well you can pull back on organising and either one of them will pick it up or you will see less of each other. Or you could have a conversation and ask for it to be shared more equally, they will likely say it’s easier for you because you don’t have kids. And assuming you don’t have any other big responsibilities they may have a point.
I would stop prioritising them over your activities, if you have something on just say it won’t work for you.

When you suggest something and they shoot it down say ok let me know what works for you and leave them to sort.

I think.you need to compromise a little for a while, but you don't need to organise all the time.

Have you told them how you feel?

It sounds like you just need to accept that friendships change and very often end when people have children and you don't.

They either come back or you get a new set when the children are in their teens, then it all goes pear shaped again when the grand children arrive, ime.