The only child free friend in the group, always asked to compromise or organise for others.

[RooRooRu]

I sadly don't have kids. I have 2 close friends who have young and young(ish) kids. We have been friends for roughly 10 years. I completely understand that when you have kids your priorities change, and things don't stay the same as when you had less ties. We have always been pretty good at making an effort to see each other, but I feel the effort is now resting firmly with me to organise our catch ups and for me to compromise on where / what / when we do it to fit in with family life.
The time we meet always fits around nap / routine / weekend sport, I'm often asked to rearrange any pre-existing commitments to accommodate them.
It's often left to me to arrange and book what and where we are doing, because after family life and work they 'just need someone to make the decision for them'
The location is always closer to where they live to make it convenient, not close to where I work or live. Never early dinner in the city after work for example, because that's too hard for them but easy for me.
AIBU and I just don't get it because I've not had to manage the juggle?

If people "can always find a way" then why on earth is OP suggesting a time to meet up that coincides nursery/school pick up?
Surely its blatantly obvious why that isnt going to work- there is no point getting pissy about it.

And if its a long and expensive Uber drive to her friends house then why should the friend be obliged make that Uber journey either?

There are phases in life when you may well have to accommodate a friend's other life responsibilities and yes, you might not like it but the world does not revolve around you.

I am at the stage of life now where some of my friends have elder care responsibilities (parents who are frail or have dementia) so I have to fit in to meeting my friends around that - no problem. I dont expect their lives to revolve around me and I care about them so also want to see them meaning that I will work around them. Thats what friends do. It also wont be forever, it's just a phase of life so I am happy to do that knowing its temporary.

You need to look up what the word "dependent" means. How do you imagine an early dinner in the city would work exactly?

When you have small children they come first in every situation. There's no postponing or moving childcare like you can with your plans - every aspect of their routine has to happen every day.

There's no point talking about "equality" in the relationship with your friends. You have the flexibility they just don't. If you value them you'll bend for them during these years, if not find other people in your position. You've no idea of the mental, emotional and physical load of having children.

It's difficult for both sides.
When you have young kids, their needs do tend to come first and things can change quickly if they get unwell or haven't napped etc. Evenings can be particularly challenging as well.
It's upsetting for me as a parent to 2 young kids, how hard it is to maintain friendships even with other friends who do have kids, because all the competing needs of kids are so hard to manage.
It will get easier as their kids get older to, for example, just leave them with the partner and go off and socialise, but while they're young it's exhausting every second of the day and organising social plans is a massive juggle.
I have friends in our social group who don't intend to have children and they've joined a social group specifically for childfree women because the dynamic has changed so much and it just doesn't fit what they need and want right now from a friendship.
We do all still hang out when possible but it's not the same as it was.
We're planning a girls trip for a big birthday when everyone's kids are old enough to be left with partners!

I've just organised an event with three others who are retired and they have more going on that me (working, grown up kids) and we struggled to find a date they could all do. I could have done any!

Even booked in advance he wouldn't t be able to do it- if your business advertises shutting at a certain time, you cant just shut early so yes it IS relevant

I think this is just parent life. I think you need to see if you can add some childless / childfree people to your circle.

Correction, i prioritise our longstanding, pre-existing childcare plans. Not his feelings.

otherwise I'd be doing what OP is alluding to, which is asking him to cancel long-standing client meetings which have been scheduled in advance to work around the children so that I can make other plans.

Yes, a bit tedious. You sometimes find yourself wondering if there is one brain cell on MN shared out across the threads.

I wouldn't re-arrange pre existing plans.

I think the way forward is you see them less but try to make more of a day of it that suits all of you.

Having young DC is exhausting, tiring and time consuming.

If the issue is their partners aren't pulling their weight then that's different but OP hasn't mentioned that at all.

I think you've totally missed the point. Ah well.

I should have been clearer.
The early dinner was an example of what suits me best, not them. We see each other roughly once a month. I don't think it's too much to ask for that maybe 1-2 times a year for their partners or GP's to help.
We tend to meet up weekend mornings or early afternoon which impacts DH and I.
Yes I will never understand the juggle, but what I do understand life is hard. 5x failed rounds of IVF, countless failed transfers and early losses. I've cried before baby showers, and in the toy aisle buying gifts. But I've always shown up for them, regardless of how hard it is.
(Disclaimer I also do have other friends)

You have been friends for a long time, and can still be friends, but as people you have changed. They have different priorities and challenges that you won't understand. This isn't a criticism, its just a fact. My life changed completely when I had my son - I had to cancel so many things due to childcare or child being ill, and everything had to be planned around naps, meals etc, because the impact from not doing so, was often not worth it. You are not unreasonable, but neither are they and you don't need to go along with every change or suggestion. Maybe find other friends who have more in common with.

I haven't missed the point at all. I've understood it perfectly well. I simply don't agree with the rather self-centred premise that if people really want to see you, they'll find a way, regardless of what else is going on in their lives.

OP is entitled to feel disappointed, of course. She's not, however, entitled to conclude that her friends don't value her simply because they can't rearrange their lives to fit around her preferred arrangements.

There's a rather important distinction between someone not making an effort and someone having entirely legitimate reasons why your preferred time and place don't work for them. Thats what you dont seem to understand.

Friendship isn't a competitive sport in which everyone takes turns proving how much they care by making increasingly elaborate sacrifices. Sometimes one person does more of the travelling; sometimes the other does. Sometimes you accommodate childcare, sometimes work, sometimes elderly parents, sometimes any one of the thousand other responsibilities that come with being an adult.

I'm at the stage of life where some of my friends have elderly parents with dementia or significant care needs. I fit around those responsibilities because I care about my friends and want to see them. I don't interpret every logistical inconvenience as evidence that I've fallen down their list of priorities, nor do I expect them to somehow magic an extra three hours into the day to prove their affection.

The world doesn't stop turning because we'd quite like a dinner with a friend. And if friendship only works when everyone else continually bends around your availability, perhaps the problem isn't that they're not making enough effort.

Thank you for getting all of this down. This is the reality when kids come along. I cut my friends serous slack, by realising this early.

My friends all had their children years before me. This was their lives. They didn’t live near me. I was single, living in the city.

I made a group of new friends that wanted early dinners, cocktails, nights out, good times.

My friends all have teenagers / college age kids now. And my child is out of the baby years.

We’re seeing more of each other now. And I didn’t see as much of my city friends when DS was small. It’s just a cycle, a life phase.

Keep in touch with your friends, but I’d recommend finding a new social circle for now.

With your update, no, I certainly don't think that's too much to ask and I made that much time for my friends.
So sorry for your losses.

So sorry for your struggles, bloody hard.

You're not being unreasonable here. It seems you are the better friend, the glue that sticks everyone together. Sorry that it seems you're not being valued.

1-2 times per year is reasonable so an important clarification.

I think if you schedule these with plenty of notice it should be doable. Perhaps anchor them around certain events, like going out to celebrate for birthdays?

Very sorry for your personal circumstances x

Yes you have missed it, 100%.

Read the OP's update. Cheers.

Well yeah, they've got a lot going on, just like if you had kids and a partner or looked after your parents or had dog kennels with 12 dogs in them.

How does meeting up on the weekend impact you and your DH? Surely their partners are having the children at that point?

I can absolutely understand that, after everything you've been through with IVF, it must have been incredibly difficult to show up to baby showers and buy gifts when you were experiencing so much grief yourself. That sounds genuinely heartbreaking.

But I think there's a distinction here. You chose to show up for your friends despite your own pain, which was a lovely thing to do. It doesn't necessarily follow that their circumstances are equivalent to yours, or that their partners or grandparents should be expected to step in to make your preferred arrangements possible.

You're comparing your willingness to put your own emotional pain aside with their ability to rearrange childcare, family life and potentially work commitments. Those aren't necessarily comparable sacrifices.

And I'm not sure why meeting on weekend mornings or early afternoons is automatically an unreasonable compromise because it impacts you and your DH. Presumably, meeting in the evening impacts the parents too, just in different ways.

Having children doesn't mean someone else's time becomes more valuable than yours, but equally, not having children doesn't mean your time should take precedence over theirs.

So I’ve been in both positions as I had kids later than many of my close friends

first, they are making mum friends to do buggy walks and midweek sensory play classes with. You kind of need to do the same now to do stuff that you might like - evening theatre, galleries, cool inner city wine tasting etc. lots of lovely single women in their 30s and 40s would love a friend for this stuff.

Assuming they have partners, then I’d suggest weekend brunches over evenings. The kids dad can hopefully cope. But don’t assume their marriages are fair or happy just because they have a dad at home.

if they are single parents or solo parenting, babysitters are so expensive it triples the cost of a night out (I spend £300 recently all in on attending a friends bday dinner, babysitter and taxis would have been £120 food and drinks and a night bus if I was child free)

young kids wake up so early. To get ready and go out after their bed time, and then travel into town and travel back when you’re going to be woken up at 6am being needed means if they head out far away they’ll need to head back. I can sympathize with ‘please come to mine’ as they are literally on duty till about 8.30pm but you’re in their minds free from 5.30-6pm and sitting on a tube seems more relaxing to them than doing dinner bath and bedtime . If you don’t want to do this travel maybe you go back to Covid times and just do a wine on zoom from 9-10pm for a catch up?

they are probably exhausted from the mental load there is so much to think about all the time with young kids nd their algorithms will only advertise kids stuff not fun stuff with friends.

however if they are really good friends I would send something like :
ladies I would love us to have some really good quality time together. These are some ideas, could you say if you’d like to do any (create a poll) and if we all want to then I’ll send out dates

then make some suggestions that can work for you.

as a single mum, if a friend is willing to come and hang out with me and child or come to me when he is asleep I am so so grateful and I will owe her one in the next season of life we’re in.

I don't get how the update changes anything?

I've read the update. It doesn't change my point in the slightest.

You keep telling me I've missed the point, when what you actually mean is that I haven't reached the same conclusion as you. Those are two entirely different things.

Disagreement isn't a comprehension failure. Cheers. 😘