I should always be welcome in DP's home, regardless of who's there - AIBU?

[SecretsAndLies77]

I will try to not make this too long, but also not drip feed. Please help me distinguish reasonable actions from my own emotions because, to put it simply, everything's at stake.

Been with DP for 4 years and, on the whole, it's a very loving relationship. He's good to me and my kids, fun to be around, reliable and helpful, contributes financially to my household. We don't live together but spend much (most) of the week at each other's homes (although more mine than his), as well as every weekend and holidays.

At the same time, it's been a turbulent relationship (I know that sounds odd after what I've just said, but it can be both good and turbulent, as it's about very defined areas of problems, i.e. one problem = his adult daughters). I have a good relationship with his youngest DD (early 20s) who lives with him, but his eldest (30) who lives away doesn't want to have anything to do with me. At times she's been really rude to me and various members of my family. Most recent example is a message she sent where she was incredibly rude and disrespectful (before blocking me, so I couldn't even respond - a coward's move, IMO). My DP did reprimand her, sort of, via text and heavily prompted by me, which I hate as I don't think it's my job to stand up for this relationship and my dignity, but his. I think left to his own devices he would just always avoid all conflict. He is very scared she will cut him out of his life.

I feel I've come to the end with being able to accept that he doesn't stand up for me of his own free will, and that when he sees her he doesn't feel a shred of annoyance, resentment or anger about the awful ways she's behaved. I understand we all love our children, and I understand he's scared of losing her. I'm not even saying that he should necessarily show her that he's upset about her bad behaviour, but simply that he should feel something for me, the way she's treated me (in other words, show ME - show some kind of outrage, empathy, solidarity). If someone mistreated my DP, even if it was my kids, I'd be pretty livid. I know people are different, and I know men and women can be very different in their emotional processing. But still. How can it be true that he loves me, but that he doesn't feel anything when someone repeatedly hurts me?

The other thing is that, when she comes to stay at his, although at all other times I'm (more than) welcome in his house, there's an expectation that I won't come while she's there. Now, I get that it's her former home, she still has a room there. But, at all other times, I have complete access to his house, not just that but he's even repeatedly hosted friends of mine for long weekends (because the house is big and has spare rooms and bathrooms), but when his daughter is there, the quiet understanding is that I'm not welcome. But, just as an example, we're spending Xmas at mine this year and he of course invited her too. I knew she would say no, but that's not the point. So, she's meant to be always welcome in my house, but I'm not only not welcome at family events, but also my own partner's house when she's there? It strikes me as very unfair and unreasonable.

I've been living with this for a while, and this morning I woke up and thought, I don't know if I love him any more. This has seriously eroded my feelings for him. It's a huge shame, as four years is a lot of time together and he's amazing in many ways and I love(d) him possibly more than any other man before him, including my ex husband. But this continued unfairness and indignity has eaten away at the core of our connection.

YABU - this is a reasonable compromise in a complicated family dynamic because parents will always put their children first, even when they're nearly 30, and most women would find a way to live with this, even if it hurts them

YANBU - this is a major breach of love and loyalty towards me on his side, and if he's not prepared to let her know that his home is always open to me, I should walk away even after 4 years together.

Can I just say (if you're read this far), if you're not divorced and in a relationship with a man who's got adult kids, you won't have any kind of realistic perspective on a situation of this kind. I'm looking for some thoughtful and considered responses based in first hand experience of these kinds of dynamics - thank you (and I'll disregard any responses that are rude or unkind, as often I see "pile ons" when it comes to these kinds of questions)

I could have written this although I am 10 years further down the line and we are now married. I get on marvellously with his younger DD and she and my DD act like sisters. But his elder DD just hates me.

I met him many years after his divorce (I too was divorced) and from the get go his eldest DD told me her dad would never have a serious relationship again. She really resented us becoming serious and also would send me awful messages. The strange thing is she is nc with her own mother so its not that she was upset her parents split.

I think a pp may have nailed it when they said his DD was used to bring the centre of her dads universe and in her eyes him being with me upset that, which to a certain extent is probably true. But as far as I was concerned we could all be part of a family group.

All these years later I have given up reaching out and being the bigger person, her dad has let the relationship slide as frankly it is my input with family that binds us all together. His eldest occasionally asks her dad to help with childcare (which of course involves me) which we do as it’s not her children’s fault there is no close relationship and she seems quite happy for me to do that. It’s all quite sad as she misses out on so many joint family occasions by her refusal to be around me.

You are being wildly unreasonable. You want to swan in and out of his home when his kids are there even though you know they don’t like you. You don’t live together, if you did then yes his kids have to suck it up, but for now you don’t and unfortunately you don’t get to damage his relationship with them by spitting your dummy out.

I think if you’re a grown adult it’s time to say “you know that dad has been telling that story all these years and he actually made it up. It was him that liked suede.” - why passively accept someone else’s lies about you? If they’re dumb enough to have a row about it, let them.

This.
It's kind of the point I was getting at.

I'd put money on the fact that instead of saying 'nice to see you DD, I'd love to spend time with you right now but I have dinner/night out booked with OP and I want to go to that. Are you free tomorrow to meet up? Etc etc', he said 'OP isn't happy that you keep showing up unannounced. I'd love to see you, but OP doesn't like it and wants to go out to dinner. You understand don't you. Don't want any grief so I better do what she wants haha'.

Daughter then thinks, this OP is a bitch. She's controlling my Dad and stopping me seeing him. Never talking to her again. The fact that you now think she's a spoilt princess, and he probably tells her that, is compounding her hatred of you.

She probably hasn't even said she doesn't want you there. He just doesn't want the awkwardness, or difficult questions as to why you hate each other so actively keeps you apart.

Ask him specifics!

What did she message you?

Honestly I think your dp is between a rock and a hard place. More than likely his dd will cut him out if he has a go at her.

Id be happy to keep my distance when she is about and let your dp get on with it.

Did she demand it though? Or did he willingly cancel and blame his DD?
OP gets fed up with this and tells him to put a stop to it. He can't tell DD he's been blaming her, so he then blames OP.

I think this scenario is much more likely than an adult just developing a hatred of another adult for absolutely no reason at all.

Hi. Love and kids. Difficult process for you.

However, if YOU wish to remain happy, YOU have decision to make. You are either to be married to your DP and accepting the inevitable grief which will follow, or cut your losses and run. Both parties have made it clear that they are not gonna budge (Father/daughter relationships are always tight).

Life is not always fair but I find it very difficult to imagine this menage a trois getting settled.

Any how. I wish you luck in the future. Just look before you let, next time.

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head to be honest. I think OP has probably realised that this man will always take his daughters’ side. It sounds as though he hasn’t got the backbone to put a stop to the bad behaviour

Ooof, yet more disdain from op towards the daughter
"no wonder she's got no friends"

Not sure how this started but you sure as hell won't end it with such a low opinion of her.

Also, you still haven't told us why she messaged you, what went before that.

You are painting her purposefully in a shit light in order to get internet randoms to agree with you?

You sound incredibly entitled so that’s probably the reason the daughter doesn’t like you.

Just stay at your place when she is at her dad’s. It isn’t difficult.

So logically DD then hates OP for what she thinks has been happening. Could well be. Personally I think OP’s statement that she’s not sure she still loves him is very telling. It’s more likely the fact that after four years it’s dawned on her that the relationship isn’t going anywhere because DD - or her dad, as the case may be - is the blocker.

He can’t make her like, respect, or even tolerate you. The reality is that not all situation are fixable, and you just have to do your best with the reality in front of you. He has no choice, unless he’s willing to lose his daughter, than to keep his relationships with both of you independent of one another.

I do see the logic in inviting her to yours, even though he’s either not considered or prioritized how you feel about it. Having you ‘invade’ her territory would make the situation erupt, whereas inviting her to yours is a less emotionally charged prospect - it lets her know that the door is open to her if she wants, but if she doesn’t then that’s okay too. He’s not going to force the issue.

If he wants a relationship with his daughter then all he can do is accept, and respect, how she feels. He’s not letting her control him, if he were he’d have broken up with you. He’s also not letting you control
him, because if he were he’d have blown up his relationship with his daughter. He’s just trying to maintain his relationships with both of you as much as he can.

Ultimately, if you’re not happy then I don’t think there’s any other option than leaving open to you. He isn’t going to choose you over his daughter.

Can you tell us what this recent fall-out was over? How were you in a situation where she is being rude to you by text and blocks you? It would just help to understand what's actually going on. What is her criticism of you?

I have to say, and I have lots of experience of a similar situation...you absolutely must not get between your DP and his daughter. However unreasonable she may seem - it has to come from him and if he isn't taking the lead then you are always going to be the fall guy. If she's already 30+yrs, she isn't going to grow out of this behaviour. You must not talk him into sending responses...it needs to come from him and him being so conflict avoidant is a big red flag. Honestly, this would give me a major ick and I would cut my losses now. If he is a wuss then that is a very painful future for you.

On the other hand, to give him the benefit of the doubt, maybe he isn't a wuss and his conflict-avoidance is just wisdom...of course he doesn't want an escalation when he loves his daughter. People don't forget these rows and he sounds like his way has got him stuck in the middle. She isn't coming first - he's with you 99% of the time. If she came first, he wouldn't be with you at all.

My partner and I are both divorced, he has two adult daughters. There is no way in hell he would let either of them be rude or disrespectful to me. I wouldn’t stand for it if he did. We get on fine btw. His view is that he is entitled to happiness and they have their own lives as adults now.

An honest question: …the expectation that I have (…what I'm feeling)…if she doesn't want to "allow me" in his house - which isn't hers NOR IS IT YOURS to allow or not allow anything - then they should be meeting in a restaurant for lunch? WTAF. I CANNOT BELIEVE YOU HAVE THE NERVE TO EVEN IMAGINE THIS.
I’m not surprised he has compartmentalised his life.
And yes, I was the AC who was five years younger than her, had the same arrangement with my DF as she does with him.
I hated him being lonely, wanted him to have a relationship but I didn’t want one with her as I found her pushy, disregarding of my feelings, judgemental: She doesn’t have any friends. WELL, AREN’T YOU KIND?

Hiya, I’d love to read this study - please could you DM a link if you have it ? Thanks 🙏

what did the message she sent you recently say?

Ignore me - quick google and I found one from 2013 👍

Interesting and I think you could be right.

I'd not noticed you mentioned a younger DD. If anyone should feel intruded upon and resent the Op surely that should be the younger DD, she lives at home still so has the Op around regularly and yet she and Op get on well. For me that makes the older DD reaction stranger, she chose to live and work elsewhere yet still deeply resents anyone else being there.
I do understand what you mean Op about suddenly not being welcome when his DD there but next day he acts as if nothings happened, it puts you out because there's always going to be this issue, you can't do anything to resolve it and he won't try,he just expects you to pretend you're fine about it.

A very wise reading of the thing

Nothing bad would happen, he just ended up saying he wasn't available (if he had a prior plan with me). But that was kind of the start of the problems with her because she would think it's unreasonable of him not to see her when she's driven from a long way away (but she often wouldn't even be coming specifically to see him - she might be going to her favourite hairdresser, meeting the mother, etc, so why should he cancel existing plans? Anyway that's all been sorted and doesn't happen any more, but I think that was the start of her hostility)

Im also surprised. I think this is a totally different situation to teenage children visiting, this is a grown woman of 30. Why does she get to dictate who her father has in his home while she visits?!

What will happen if OP and her partner decide to live together - will OP be expected to make herself scarce if the grown up daughter visits?! Its absolutely ridiculous and quite controlling - shes trying to imply to her father that if he lives with this woman she won't visit.

And no im not a 'second wife' im a happily married first wife!

I don't actually believe the children do come first when they are not children anymore - they should have spread their wings and moved on with their lives as adults? Yes the 'children come first' when they are U18, or even perhaps up to say age 21 when their parents house is often still 'home'... But not at age 30!!!

OP id let this man go. I agree you are right to feel very upset with your partner for allowing his daughter to be so rude. If as an adult i was rude to a friend of my parents because i 'didnt like them' Id expect them to be pretty cross with me quite frankly.
If i was OP i would not have permitted the partner to invite the 30 year old daughter yp to spend christmas in my home, not a chance. He is not the host.

that's the only way I can explain it, a feeling - that at all other times I'm welcome at his house, but not when she's there. But then the next day I'm meant to just go back to normal life and accept that now I'm welcome there again and let's all eat at his house....I feel like, my feelings / sense of dignity / place in his life shouldn't be on some kind of switch so now it's off, now it's on again
Sense of dignity? Come on OP. This not about dignity at all. It's about the fact that for the very few times she comes, your wishes are not put first and you don't like it.

Yes, he is switching you off on these few occasions because you and her don't like each other. It's really not the end of the world. Your expectations are unreasonable, self-serving and entitled. That's probably why she doesn't like you. Maybe her expectations are the same too.

The bottom line is noone is going to be happy when all together. It's not going to happen. So what do you expect? Him to not see her? Not allow her in his home which was hers for years yet never been yours? Ask you when it suits you that he can see her, even if it doesn't suit them?

Have you tried to put yourself in his shoes? What if a family member of best friend since childhood didn't like him. What would you do? Be fine with him demanding you only met her in a restaurant when you haven't seen her for month and she travels far just to see you?

Do you think he'd be respecting your dignity if he was demanding this of you?

How do you know what was said to her?
That is my point. Do you just have his word for it, that he said 'sorry DD I'm not available', instead of 'sorry DD, OP says I'm not available'.

Two very similar, but very different statements.