Zack Polanski and the guillotine

[Everanewbie]

AIBU to be sceptical that much will be done about Zack Polanski's tweet of an image of man wearing a t-shirt depicting a guillotine and the words "making plans for Nigel"?

Now I am not in favour of prosecuting people for words, and I don't want ZP sent to prison. But I would like to see this level of hate stop.

And I am finding the left to be extremely hypocritical with the violent rhetoric while simultaneously celebrating the arrest of Lucy Connelly and Graham Linehan?

Back in the real world, both extremes behave despicably trying to scapegoat whomever is their favourite figure of hate, and yet are surprised that such behaviour attracts a similar response from the other extreme (or pretend they are) and are outraged and try to claim the moral high ground when both are utter hypocrites.

One side welcomes overt racists and thugs convicted of beating up women, fraudsters, incites riots and arson, threatens to burn people alive, demonises disabled people, even disabled children, tries to blame foreigners for the UK’s problems, etc.

The other side is misogynistic, also racist, tries to “cancel” people who don’t agree with them, is violent to women and issues death threats against them, is homophobic.

Both extreme sets of views have resulted in murders of people. Both rely on propaganda and misinformation and manipulation and, frankly, are aggressive and bullying towards anybody who disagrees with them.

Neither side represents the views of anybody reasonable or rational. Both are immensely hypocritical and disingenuous with their outrage at the other when they engage in the same type of behaviour. I think, finally, more and more people are realising this and that no positive way forward in the UK will be found at either extreme. There’s little to choose between them and neither can claim any kind of moral high ground.

Calling people scum is part of the problem. Angela Raynor called conservative ministers ‘a bunch of scum’ at a party conference only a month before David Amess MP was murdered.

I fully agree with you on that. I am in the real world. I just thought your comment about the t shirt was fatuous and not particularly helpful. Don’t straw man me or put words in my mouth.

I think Polanski is odious and dangerous, much like Farage. As much as I despise him, I think this was carelessness rather than calculated.

Following the murder of Ann Widdecombe surely all political leaders should be diligent in checking that they are not inciting hatred. Not convinced that JP should be charged, but the printer of the t shirt should be.

And, @Ereshkigalangcleglike I said, you clearly didn’t understand my original comment which was satire mocking the utter hypocrisy and the way that these extremists dismiss their own extreme behaviour while behaving in exactly the same way. I

t’s not much of a criticism to say that you found a post disingenuous when said post was blatantly obviously deliberately satirically disingenuous in order to mock the faux outrage which both sides employ to try to justify their behaviour. We have a long tradition in the UK of satirising politics to make serious points. You becoming enraged about this and going on the attack neatly makes my point for me.

Oh I see, now you’ve started making accusations. What a surprise. 😆😒🙄 You’ve demonstrated precisely what I was satirising.

It seems I need not have bothered since the actual supporters of all of these extreme looneys become a parody of themselves without even realising.

It wasn’t “obvious satire” and you’re still being disingenuous IMO but it’s a derail I’m not interested in participating in, so I’ll leave it there.

I agree.

As pp said I think this sort of thing is just wallpaper to many politicians and they don’t notice it.

Haha! Perfect example. You derailed the thread with accusing me of being “disingenuous” for making what was quite clearly a satirical comment and now try to accuse me of derailing things. How amusing.

Yes, I suggest you do stop now.

😄 And I was trying to be polite!

I didn’t call people scum - there is a subtle difference. Scummy is far less vicious, and I think, mild, for someone who publicly wishes a cruel death on another person.

But anyone who talks about Tory scum can’t be taken seriously- it shows mindless prejudice and a worrying level of aggression.

Exactly this. The Greens and Reform are 2 cheeks of the same arse. They are both populist extremist sympathising parties. The Greens are obsessed with Reform. Someone is in custody for murdering a prominent Reform figure and apparently had a list of Reform figures he wanted to kill. So instead of thinking ' Oh maybe we might be influencing crackpots here' they have a complete blind spot to people casually advocating murder. They claim to be a political party yet can't see the optics of people looking at them calling Reform ' hateful' while they casually advocate murdering people who disagree with them. They constantly do Reforms work for them by making them sound reasonable.

You're making huge, sweeping generalisations about "the left" / the Green Party based on one friend's opinion, you realise?

This is ONE example.
And of course there's plenty of normal left people and I believe normal green supporters exist, too.
But doesn't change the fact that some of the left stuff is horrendous so I don't like them acting like the holy people.

Some of every point on the political spectrum are “horrendous”. That’s why sweeping generalisations are meaningless.

He is the leader of the “Hope not Hate” party and that is on his Instagram. He is someone who has illusions of a seat at the table after the next GE and that is on his Instagram.

He is just an egotist who is heading up a bunch of radicals/Islamist opportunists/the deluded and has seized the Green name and gravely damaged it.

And for that it's worth, my views are as follows:

I'm pro choice.

I'm pro IVF.

I'm pro transitioning but I don't think biological males should compete against biological females in sports and I don't think children should be allowed to transition - this alone makes me far right in some people's eyes.

I'm pro legal migration but think that asylum seeker system needs a major overhaul as a lot of them coming in are the ones that are making the countries they're coming from dangerous and unlivable - this makes me far right in some people's eyes.

I'm all for deporting serious criminals - this makes me far right in some people's eyes.

I don't think that any religion should be pushed down people's throats.

I'm a feminist so I'm not pro burhka - this also makes me far right in some people's eyes.

So I'm pretty sick to be called far right just because some leftists have lost their minds. Someone lost their shit just because I said I don't like greens (not on Mumsnet but in real life). Luckily, lots of people in my circle are the same as me.
I also witnessed a fall out between two people because one of them said that kids should never be called 'boys and girls' and had a tantrum when someone else said they could.

And somehow the far left are the ones celebrating the deaths of what they consider far right.

US polling shows that those who categorise themselves as "very liberal" are far more likely to belive political violence is justified, and more likely to think its ok to be happy at an opponents death than those further right on the political spectrum. I think most people can see that a similar dynamic exists in the UK.

Oh and Polanski calling everyone fascist and racist and what not has had an impact on his followers too.
I lost a friend who couldn't hold a conversation without 'oh but he is a fascist ' 'oh but he is a racist ' talking about literally any political person. Whenever I would try and see that someone has done a good job, it would always be 'but he is a fascist', anyone who wasn't green, was called that.
So I do feel scared because I genuinely see Polanski as someone who wants to be a dictator and I think people won't be safe in this country when he and his sheep ensure you're only allowed to have one set of very specific views or you'll be getting called a racist and a fascist.

This was my thoughts exactly.
Do you think the right celebrated the death of Jo Cox? Maybe some nutcases did but with the far left, even someone who works at a uni thinks it's ok to celebrate a politician's death online.
It's pretty obvious how comfortable far left feel about death of their opponent, the tweets were never ending when Charlie Kirk died.
I think they're so detached from reality that they don't feel much apart from the constant feeling of being offended about anything and everything.

I think the reaction to Charly Kirk though was extreme on both ends of the scale.

Killing someone in front of their wife and children is absolutely abhorrent and absolutely nobody should have been celebrating that.

But by the same token, when Charly Kirk was shot he was all but turned into a hero and a saint, and he was in fact a nasty piece of work with some vile views and opinions.

Perhaps if people hadn’t been so quick t paint him as some kind of modern-day saint which he most certainly wasn’t, there wouldn’t have been quite so much strong feeling on the other side either.

I think he's dumb. But I don't think he should go to prison

I was really sad when Charlie kirk died.

Excuses excuses and youve fallen for it. Polanski knew what he was doing and Farage called him out. The left doing what they do best - being full of hate.