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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To feel I've been lied to about China

267 replies

Sulettamercury · 16/07/2026 22:47

I'm well aware the country is far from perfect but no where is and I've just come back for the summer after spending 2 years there working as a teacher I'm going back in a few weeks.

What I can't get over is the fact all my friends seem to be indoctrinated into thinking China is this 1984 style hell hole where you can't criticise the government or do anything without being in constant fear.

I have to say living there really opened my eyes and I was shocked when in my first months of teaching one of the Chinese workers (now a good friend) started openly moaning about government policy and I'll admit I was nervous at the time but soon realised nothing would happen and that despite what I was told no one came after her and she didn't disappear and that every one was moaning about government policy if it didn't suit them with no consequences.

The infrastructure is also wonderful and far from the cheap rubbish you're told it is and housing isn't all on the verge of collapse or at least no worse than some of the rubbish I've seen here in the UK

Again it's definitely not perfect but AIBU to say I I feel like we're lied to in the west about how bad China really is and that some of the things we accuse them of we either do ourselves or we blow out of proportion?

OP posts:
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ToffeeCrabApple · 17/07/2026 09:46

Sulettamercury · 16/07/2026 22:47

I'm well aware the country is far from perfect but no where is and I've just come back for the summer after spending 2 years there working as a teacher I'm going back in a few weeks.

What I can't get over is the fact all my friends seem to be indoctrinated into thinking China is this 1984 style hell hole where you can't criticise the government or do anything without being in constant fear.

I have to say living there really opened my eyes and I was shocked when in my first months of teaching one of the Chinese workers (now a good friend) started openly moaning about government policy and I'll admit I was nervous at the time but soon realised nothing would happen and that despite what I was told no one came after her and she didn't disappear and that every one was moaning about government policy if it didn't suit them with no consequences.

The infrastructure is also wonderful and far from the cheap rubbish you're told it is and housing isn't all on the verge of collapse or at least no worse than some of the rubbish I've seen here in the UK

Again it's definitely not perfect but AIBU to say I I feel like we're lied to in the west about how bad China really is and that some of the things we accuse them of we either do ourselves or we blow out of proportion?

Were you in a large city or a rural area? Theres a big difference

Secretseverywhere · 17/07/2026 09:48

I do think China is a mixed bag, there have been amazing developments within urban / metropolitan areas. They are investing heavily in renewable energy and plan to hit carbon neutrality in 2060, ten years after UK’s goal but I suspect we will delay and they will get it done.

That said there are issues the treatment of the Uyghurs, rural poverty, I was surprised to learn that a child’s education is tied to place of parents birth so you can’t simply move to a city for work and expect a school place gor your child. You may have to pay for (mediocre/ poor) private schooling if away from household district and your child may be refused permission to take high school entrance exams. Lots of children have to be left behind with extended family whilst parents leave to earn a living.

Marmalademorning · 17/07/2026 09:51

BunfightBetty · 16/07/2026 22:57

This reads like planted party political propaganda from the Chinese Communist party.

I believe there’s a growing push for communism in the UK from certain quarters, and It wouldn’t surprise me at all if this post is just further evidence of that.

Corvidsarethebest · 17/07/2026 09:56

Marmalademorning · 17/07/2026 09:51

I believe there’s a growing push for communism in the UK from certain quarters, and It wouldn’t surprise me at all if this post is just further evidence of that.

Despite the post having generated some interesting responses, I agree it comes over as very naive and not as a rounded view of someone living two years in China. The issues of privacy, state control, and surveillance are very complex and if you even visit for a few weeks you will encounter them in all aspects of daily living in China, even just that they have their own internet- which interestingly enough we are not able to access in the West (due to their government)- although if you go there you can set up an account and then access it once you are back.

I am a big believer in free speech, and don't think Western governments should have blocked Russian media channels during the Ukraine war, I like to see the propaganda and make up my own mind, but I don't think that excuses the Chinese control over both social and other media which is immense.

EmmaOfNormandy · 17/07/2026 10:05

Very big, China.

ExtraOnions · 17/07/2026 10:15

Marmalademorning · 17/07/2026 09:51

I believe there’s a growing push for communism in the UK from certain quarters, and It wouldn’t surprise me at all if this post is just further evidence of that.

I’m not sure you could class China as Communist anymore. The economic model included extensive private ownership and investment. The party is totalitarian, and exerts huge control, but the means of production are private companies (albeit with control from government)

SixtySomething · 17/07/2026 10:18

Sulettamercury · 17/07/2026 02:05

I posed a question even in my OP I say the country isn't perfect. There's a difference between saying.

"Hey OP you're wrong about X,Y,Z please read this"

And

"Hey OP you liked your time in China so you're either a Bot, Chinese spy or must suddenly become a world history expert and answer for all these terrible things".

If my posting style annoys you I'm sorry I'm not trying to wind you up.

OP. I visited China on holiday, albeit almost ten years ago. I was impressed by their intercity train service, with free water and food as part of the deal, handed out by smart air hostess types. Perhaps this sort of positive experience impressed you?

I'm wondering whether you're more like a volunteer than a teacher and perhaps haven't spent that long in China. So basically you're generalising from the nice time you had in China to the fact it must be a good place, which the wicked Imperialist Brits are trying to smear.

However, you don't actually know anything much about the wider political scene , unlike some of the posters here. You're also infected with a smattering of this anti British Imperialist nonsense, which seems to be going out of fashion anyhow. You didn't know that China is a great Imperialist nation.

A lot of people are horrified by the widespread human rights abuses in China. It's great you've put yourself out there and perhaps found out a little you were unaware of. It's not a personal attack on you. It's people setting the record straight on human rights abuses.
.

What do you think about the harvesting of organs from ethnic minority citizens? Do we do something as bad in the UK?

CloudBuster66 · 17/07/2026 10:22

One thing that strikes me is people in the West frequently say there's no point doing anything about climate change whilst China is creating huge amounts of emissions. When actually they are way way ahead of us in renewable energy

Jezzballs2000 · 17/07/2026 10:24

JHound · 16/07/2026 23:01

You should listen to the Trevor Noah podcasy episode on “ChinaMaxxing”. He covers this really well.

Thank you listening now!

CloudBuster66 · 17/07/2026 10:24

Marmalademorning · 17/07/2026 09:51

I believe there’s a growing push for communism in the UK from certain quarters, and It wouldn’t surprise me at all if this post is just further evidence of that.

You what??! Says who? Who is pushing for communism? Are you confusing this with an appetite to try and roll back neoliberalism that has been responsible for the decimated industries in this country and rampant profiteering from privatised utilities and public services 🤔

Fleurdavril · 17/07/2026 10:29

How fortunate to have the opportunity to live in a very different country and experience its culture. Of course China is portrayed in a less than favourable light in many western media. China is probably THE greatest threat to western, ie US, world domination.

Plus the Chinese way of life, politics, values, traditions, culture, religion, just about everything in terms of core belief systems, are vastly different to those of most westerners. One imagines most people, ie visitors, really do not understand what is going on below the surface. But that can be said of any country with its own history and mores which nonetheless welcomes foreigners to some extent or other Of course native English-speaking teachers are going to be valued there in China with English being a highly desirable asset in business and other areas of life.

As others have mentioned, it's a vast country with differing local traditions and varying standards of living. Shanghai might appear thoroughly modern on the surface. But who knows what the labour laws and wages are for sweatshop workers where our clothes are made? One reads occasional articles about the labour forces housed in dorms, far away from family, on call 24/7. Is this true? You decide.

Similarly, Chinese anti-western propaganda is probably hard at work but perhaps you don't read the Chinese papers or listen to the TV broadcasts.

With modernisation, no doubt, much appears superficially similar in larger cities. The Chinese have certainly kept abreast of and ahead of modern technology. Plus people speak very highly in personal anecdotes about Chinese hospitality.

The situation with the Uiguhrs is horrific. As is China's takeover of Tibet, its culture and oppression of its religion (down to attempting to appoint its own Lama). Ditto Taiwan - a successful country now in its own right. Constant insatiable expansionism seems to be the order of the day (yes, like Trump).

Chinese companies are also financially colonising parts of Africa through vast and aggressive investment in massive infrastructure and there are many stories of oppression, nasty racism and suchlike. Chinese workers were recently exposed videoing African children who were taught to sing self-derogatory ditties about themselves which they didn't understand. Nasty. These videos are posted on the Internet (now that it's been exposed,perhaps it has stopped).

These things - racism, colonialism, workers' oppression, lying propagandising - do go on everywhere to various degrees. And I guess that's all one can say ultimately - it's about degree and scale and control. British politicians are also corrupt but they don't suddenly disappear, scrubbed from photographic records.

I think China has an absolutely fascinating culture and history. Being there for an extended period must offer so many opportunities to explore. I'd personally be interested in seeing what remains of the older culture - theatre, architecture, opera, costume, painting, poetry.

Maybe read up about artist Ai Wei Wei while in the UK and see what happened to him and why. I think his story suggests that dissent is not viewed kindly. As with another famous Chinese poet who was imprisoned and maybe died there, I can't recall.

Such a vast place, so much history. Its recent political turbulence is not all of what China is. No foreigner can ever know the entire picture. But what a wonderful experience to live and work there.

Kunik · 17/07/2026 11:09

"I'm going to stop replying to the more political stuff"... but of course! 🤣

MrsGaryMcNumanface · 17/07/2026 11:13

What about Tibet?

PerkingFaintly · 17/07/2026 11:15

Kunik · 17/07/2026 11:09

"I'm going to stop replying to the more political stuff"... but of course! 🤣

Indeed.

BunfightBetty · 17/07/2026 11:18

Marmalademorning · 17/07/2026 09:51

I believe there’s a growing push for communism in the UK from certain quarters, and It wouldn’t surprise me at all if this post is just further evidence of that.

They’ve got two hopes of turning the UK communist!

MN is used for propaganda purposes all the time, and the Chinese are always trying to manage their PR. They want to have their cake and eat it - have a brutal and repressive regime for their own citizens, deploy aggressive expansionist policies overseas, denying other nations their autonomy, while enriching an elite with obscene levels of wealth, while the majority get crumbs. And wreck the global environment with their hideous pollution.

They want to do all that, while also wanting us to think they’re benign and enlightened. It’s ludicrous.

MinLynn · 17/07/2026 11:23

EmmaOfNormandy · 17/07/2026 10:05

Very big, China.

Inhabited by many Chinese

GasPanic · 17/07/2026 11:26

I've spent some significant time working in countries that have significantly different/non democratic political systems.

By and large my view is that generally if you are a normal person going about your business the state is not that intrusive on your life, although you may on occasion be subject to certain injustices with little opportunity for recourse. Engagement with the authorities is something largely to be avoided where possible.

If you choose to raise your head above the parapet (that may include things like criminal activity, engagement in politics or protest etc) then it is a different issue.

As an aside it is also true to say from my experience that people pretty much want the same things the world over. The ability to provide a stable home and food for their families, the idea that they will be cared for in their old age, the idea that their children will be educated and live better lives than they did.

It's probably not surprising that people who have little experience of living in different countries and political systems form their view on what those countries are like to live in from the media, which nearly always tends to be about the negative headlines rather than positive ones.

viques · 17/07/2026 11:26

FeistyFrankie · 17/07/2026 09:21

I have only heard great things about China from people who have lived there.

  • state-owned utilities keeps costs for electricity, gas and water incredibly low
  • food is cheap and plentiful
  • over the past 2 or 3 decades, their economy has grown at an unprecedented rate

Older generations have literally witnessed the country transform thanks to the industrial revolution. Living standards in China now easily surpass what we enjoy in the West. Work pays well (relative to cost of living, although this is ofc dependant on industry, city and province etc)

The fact the Government does not have to worry about democratic elections means it can run far more efficiently. They make long 10-year plans that they KNOW they can implement fully. The power of the CCP also means they don't have a slow, cumbersome and beauracractic process that bleeds money out of building projects and so on. The scandal of HS2 would never happen there (certainly not to the degree it has happened here), thanks to the efficiency of the system. So public money is well spent, and the government wants to invest in the country's infrastructure.

Conversely, there are downsides too. While privately complaining about the government won't get you into trouble as such, you can certainly find yourself in hot water for things you post online, or say in public. Something everyone in China is aware and mindful of.

Fuethermore, their State-owned media simply cannot be trusted to fully report the facts and is often filled with propaganda. Alongside that, mayors of provinces can feel the wrath of Beijing and not have any power to do anything about it.

The one key difference, to me, is the lack of regulation and enforcement of certain rules. You can park pretty much anywhere you want. There are very few construction regulations. Healthy and Safety laws aren't really a thing. What you see on the groud can often feel chaotic, disorganised, and dangerous. But it's also free in a way that we no longer have here in the UK (for better or worse).

Another aspect of Chinese society that is often missed by foreigners who live there is the State's interference in people's lives. There are constant directives issued that curtail freedom of expression, especially for the LGBTQIA+ community.

China is an incredible place. Yes it's far from perfect. But i would argue the UK isn't actually that much different. It's more expensive here, but with arguably just as many laws and regulations that curtail our freedom. It'a just not quite as direct or as obvious as the Chinese system.

HS2 might not happen in China, but to claim that large infrastructural projects are without issues is naive . A quick google ( perfectly possible to do outside , China, not so possible inside!) will show that while there have been huge and very expensive projects which have been successful there have also been huge and very expensive projects which have failed miserably or been the cause of terrible accidents and death, and projects completed so poorly because the fear of whistleblowing and the hierarchical nature of command stopped people expressing worries, leading to collapsed dams, flooding, insecure bridges and other disasters. Often hidden from both internal and outside view because they are seen as shameful failures.

And to the poster who upthread says they would like to live in China I would like to know their opinion on the very efficient mobile death vans that the Chinese government uses so effectively to maintain their high ranking in the Regimes That Kill Their Own Citizens Club.

viques · 17/07/2026 11:29

CloudBuster66 · 17/07/2026 10:22

One thing that strikes me is people in the West frequently say there's no point doing anything about climate change whilst China is creating huge amounts of emissions. When actually they are way way ahead of us in renewable energy

I think they are one of the last coal based economies. They have huge reserves which they are not going to leave just because the West has used up all their coal and is getting righteous about carbon.

GasPanic · 17/07/2026 11:33

CloudBuster66 · 17/07/2026 10:22

One thing that strikes me is people in the West frequently say there's no point doing anything about climate change whilst China is creating huge amounts of emissions. When actually they are way way ahead of us in renewable energy

Define "way ahead of us in renewable energy".

China could generate 3x as much of its power from renewables as we do, but still be way behind us on % of total power generated from renewables, because it is a huge country of at least 20x the size.

EmmaOfNormandy · 17/07/2026 11:37

are always trying to manage their PR. They want to have their cake and eat it - have a brutal and repressive regime for their own citizens, deploy aggressive expansionist policies overseas, denying other nations their autonomy,

I thought this thread was about China. Turned out it's about the US.

Funny old world innit ?

PippaHugo · 17/07/2026 11:45

China is the world’s largest CO₂ emitter (about one-third of global emissions), burns more coal than the rest of the world combined, still gets around 55% of its electricity from coal, and continues to build new coal power stations. Whatever progress it is making on renewables, it remains the single largest contributor to global carbon emissions.

Walikota · 17/07/2026 11:58

I thought this thread was about China. Turned out it's about the US.
Funny old world innit ?

Its an even funnier world when you realise that some US businesses could still operate in China after the revolution.Take a look at all that empire building during the 90 year stint of the Yangtze naval patrol and the scale of U.S ambitions in 'stabilizing' and 'westernizing' China over that long period and then of course ask why a large segment of rich U.S citizens made/make their fortunes directly from China in a magical cycle of having their gold deposits at Fort Knox backing up the Renminbi via trillions of the good ole Greenbacks sitting in banks in Beijing. Rich 'old money" U.S families and the C.C.P red aristocracy in a supportive partnership of elitist cronyism on backs of the colossal exploitation of Chinese workers.As the ancient English proverb says- 'same a*s different cheek'.

PippaHugo · 17/07/2026 12:01

Freedom House currently scores mainland China 9 out of 100 for political rights and civil liberties and classifies it as “Not Free.” Its press freedom is not merely somewhat worse than America’s or Britain’s. Reporters Without Borders ranks China 178th out of 180 countries in its 2026 World Press Freedom Index. It reports that 121 journalists and other media professionals are imprisoned, the highest number in the world. Britain is ranked 18th.

There is also substantial evidence of arbitrary detention, torture and ill-treatment. The UN human-rights assessment of Xinjiang found credible allegations of torture or ill-treatment—including beatings, interrogation techniques, sexual violence and coercive medical treatment—and concluded that the scale of arbitrary detention and associated abuses may constitute crimes against humanity.

In January 2026, UN experts described a persistent pattern of alleged state-imposed forced labour involving Uyghurs, Tibetans and other minorities across multiple Chinese provinces.

There is no same-sex marriage or national civil partnership, no comprehensive nationwide protection against discrimination based on sexual orientation or gender identity, and LGBT organisations and public advocacy face censorship and organisational restrictions. That is plainly not equivalent to the legal freedoms and family rights available in Britain or most liberal democracies.

Women hold only 26.5% of seats in the National People’s Congress. Women also remain severely underrepresented at the highest levels of Communist Party power.

An authoritarian country does not have to feel like a prison every minute to everyone. Most people in authoritarian states live ordinary lives—working, socialising, travelling and complaining about permitted subjects. The defining issue is what happens when someone crosses the political red lines, attempts to organise independently of the state, or belongs to a group the state has selected for coercive control.