To think Laurel Hubbard should not be competing against other women

[Belle82]

I know I am going to get ripped apart for this.

I have no problem with the transgender community, that is your life/body and I am not one to judge anyone else, do what makes you happy.

There is something fundamentally wrong about a person who is biologically a man competing against a woman in sport as significant as weightlifting.
I am not taking anything away from women weightlifters, however when competing in that sport, a person who was born a man will always have an unfair advantage over a woman.

I am all for equal rights but it seems political correctness has now put us in a position that we will only consider the equal rights of those in the transgender community. What happens to the equal rights of all the other women who have worked extremely hard to get to the olympics who should be competing against biological women.

There needs to be clearer cut criteria on entrance requirements to every sport, to give every person the equal rights they deserve.

My heart goes out to all the other women competing who I’m sure must be somewhat disheartened about their chances of success now they are competing against a biological man.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/sport/2021/jul/29/ioc-praises-weightlifter-laurel-hubbard-ahead-of-transgender-athletes-olympic-debut

@RedDogsBeg

Laurel Hubbard should not be competing in the Women's category, nor should any of the other TW athletes that are competing against women in this Olympics, nor should the TW be competing against women in the Paralympics, nor should athletes with DSDs which are only found in the male sex be competing against women.

There is nothing brave and stunning about this it is no more than a Cheats Charter introduced by the IOC and surprise, surprise the committee that recommended this is totally male.

This is ALL about men and those who support the decimation of women's sports are equally showing that they care nothing for women they only care about men.

Any medals won by TW at these games will be as devalued as those ones won in previous games by athletes who were doping.

Yes!

🏆

@bellinisurge

Women's sport is not a retirement plan for mediocre men.

So many brilliant comments on this thread. This is an excellent summation of what's happening!

So, women have fought for decades to establish their own sports with very little support and funding, often facing ridicule and opposition, so that they could have their own competitions with an equal playing field. This was necessary because men are stronger than women, something evidenced by every human being on the planet from a very young age. And now, males of mediocre sporting ability are being admitted because they claim to 'feel' like they're women

This in absolute fucking spades. I am fortunate that the sport in which I compete (equestrianism) has males and females on a genuinely even footing because the bulk of the physical aspect comes from the horse but I would be gutted to work hard only to lose out to someone who has a unfair advantage. We have rules against people riding a top level horse at lower levels of competition - because it’s not fair - so it’s not unreasonable that human playing fields should be similarly level.

I don’t see “hate” here in the UK, I see increasing refusal to accept a situation that is blatantly unreasonable and where women are - yet again - thrown under the bus for men, however they identify.

@NotBadConsidering

^I don't have words for this, so it's pointless for a women to ever try and compete in the 800m.*

No, not any more, because males are now banned from distances 400m to 1500m. Nothing will ever give back to those women who lost out over 10 years like Lynsey Sharp, (see above).

But there is nothing to stop a male from competing in women’s 100m, 200m or 3000m up. Semenya tried to qualify for the 5000m but is just too rubbish. Nisonyaba is better over 5000m and qualified. Still a mediocre male and not as good as the best women thankfully.

Sorry to keep coming back to this as it is an aside, but I've just watched the 100m women's race. Were they women?

For those who are saying this thread should be moved to the Sex and Gender topic in FWR, what are you afraid of?

More people seeing the result of your ideology and it's impact on women?

Free and fair debate on the issue?

Or

Do you think only feminists that post in Sex and Gender on FWR should/do care about the decimation of women's sports? Do you think no other women do or should? Do you think they are no other women on MN who have daughters who may be good at sport and wish to progress in their field on a fair and level playing field?

Sorry to keep coming back to this as it is an aside, but I've just watched the 100m women's race. Were they women?

Yes.

Who'd want to live with such hollow victory?

Quite. I compete to quite a reasonable level and I would be ashamed to win or even compete in the way that LH is.

@bellinisurge

Women's sport is not a retirement plan for mediocre men.

It bloody shouldn't be. It should showcase the best of women's abilities, not middle aged males who could never have made it in their own category.

1310 votes , 98%.

@bellinisurge

Women's sport is not a retirement plan for mediocre men.

Absolutely.

It's appalling it is being allowed and justified by the usual be kind/you're all transphobic crap.

@Jackgrealishscurtains

Sorry to keep coming back to this as it is an aside, but I've just watched the 100m women's race. Were they women?

Yes.

Wonderwomen!!! Amazing exhibition of female strength and speed

@LizziesTwin

A woman has been pushed out of this event by someone old enough to be their mother or father.

I think there’s a poor young woman from Nauru who missed out on this Olympics due to someone from New Zealand with a millionaire father.

This cannot be said enough times. It's not inclusive. It's excluding women.

I still haven't come across a single, rational explanation for how this is fair. Just false cries of bigot and transphobe.

I also agree that this should stay in AIBU. I think the poll result should illustrate to Mumsnet HQ that these issues are for all women to see and participate in, and should not be hived off to a hidden board.

That's quite a lot of votes, I'll be adding mine (why can't I do this on the app?) for YANBU.

Interesting to see the comments here, more so since if posted elsewhere they would probably be deleted and maybe even get the poster banned 🧐

I too support this thread being in AIBU.
Look at the poll.
This is not just a subject for a small group of women with particular ideals- this affects all women.

I don't think body shaming anyone is going to help

If Hubbard wants to compete as a woman, body shaming goes with the territory. Especially when you're trying to keep your genitals tucked in to Olympic regulation uniform.

I still haven't come across a single, rational explanation for how this is fair. Just false cries of bigot and transphobe.

Because there isn't one.

If you don't want men's sporting records to be recorded as women's sporting records (98%!) then you probably don't want men's crimes recorded as women's crimes.

Please look at the petitions board
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/petitions_noticeboard
And
"Please sign this petition to have crimes by men, recorded as men's crimes"

Wow! 98% YANBU. Highest ratio I have EVER seen on AIBU. And not even tucked away in Feminist Chat so we can't even assume a high proportion of lesbian or far right terven bigots funded by the us Christian far right witches, or whatever women that say no are today.

Thank you Laurel, really, for what will be the critical peak. You've messed with armchair sports and now the average bloke is triggered and it's no longer just mere women to bully into submission.

So, women have fought for decades to establish their own sports with very little support and funding, often facing ridicule and opposition, so that they could have their own competitions with an equal playing field

So true. I think 2012 was the first (and last) Olympics that finally had women competing in every category. Since then it's been mixed-sex. I suppose we should be grateful to have had one

For anyone who can't see the poll

This isn't about winning either. Laurel has a injury and was only ever a mediocre lifter in the male event. A skilled woman at the absolute top of her game, like the Chinese athlete will beat Hubbard in all likelihood.

This is about the young woman's space that was stolen for Hubbard to compete.

This is about the girls watching the Olympics who won't have an inspiring woman to look up to when Hubbard walks out.

This is about the women who will have been excluded before they even got there.

This has already been discussed at length. And almost everyone agreed this person shouldn't be competing in the female only events.

The women weightlifters should send a message and step down.

She's already won so utterly pointless even completing.
It's outrageous this has happened.

So by the organisers reckoning it would be acceptable for a trans woman heavyweight boxer to enter a women's event.

Someone could get killed, is that what it's going to take?

Personally I think it's great she is competing.

Why?
Because when she wins, it will show the insanity of the situation to the whole world, and people might start thinking about doing something to change it!