To ask about Jeremy Corbyn and anti semitism

[TheoriginalLEM]

So having decided to vote labour I had a conversation with a Jewish work colleague who said she couldn't vote for him, hated him even. It took me a few seconds and then i realised why. I said that I had stuck my fingers in my ears and my head in the sand somewhat about this, hoping it was just the media etc.

We didn't get into it as I could see she was uncomfortable.

So can someone tell me if and why he is an anti-semite? It doesn't sit well with me to vote for someone like that but I desperately want the Tories gone and my politics is definitely to the left.

I'm honestly not being goady and I know I could google but i wouldn't know where to start to get an unbiased view

@wafflyversatile beautifully put.

I'm still waiting for you to say what things have been posted that Corbyn has said or done are incorrect please Jolly?

I’m also waiting to hear what advice SomeUsername would give to Luciana Berger, Ruth Smeeth and Dame Margaret Hodge

Labour is less sexist less racist less anti semitic less islamophobic than most IME

And in Luciana Berger’s experience do you think?

How many other parties have hounded out heavily pregnant Jewish MPs with antisemitic abuse?

Any thoughts on why Luciana Berger needed police protection at the last Labour party conference she attended?

I'm still waiting for you to say what things have been posted that Corbyn has said or done are incorrect please how about his support of anti-Semitic mural

JC stands up for minorities totally- such as terrorists

@EnthusiasmIsDisturbed

“ I’m also waiting to hear what advice SomeUsername would give to Luciana Berger, Ruth Smeeth and Dame Margaret Hodge”

Well to Dame Margaret Hodge - how about why did she ignore the allegations of child abuse and paedophilia made about council run care homes in the 1980s - which she was responsible for?! How about why did she secretly tape and edit conversations with Jeremy Corbyn in order to portray him in a bad light?

We are discussing anti semitism within the Labour Party and what advice would be given about this issue

Along with the other MP’s I named

@EnthusiasmIsDisturbed

As to Luciana Berger - how about the fact her CLP were actively trying to de-select her before she switched parties to Change UK, on the basis of her unquestioning support of Israel and for very right wing Tory policies? Much more a case of jumping before she was pushed than “hounded out”.

@EnthusiasmIsDisturbed

How about Margaret Hodge’s smearing of a victim of child abuse as “an extremely disturbed person” and her subsequent payout to him of £30,000 to settle the claim against her? What about her previous comments about blacks and ethnic minorities and her comments that council housing should be reserved for “indigenous” British people? Comments which were, unsurprisingly dismissed and downplayed by the Jewish Chronicle.

SomeUsername do you think Luciana Berger, Ruth Smeeth and Dame Margaret Hodge have been over sensitive in their fears

Do you think the number of MP’s who have quite the Labour Party due to the party not dealing with anti Semitism within the party have imagined it all or its a conspiracy against Corbyn

What would you say to these MP’s ?

Now we can go around in circles about this or the straight forward questions can be answered

@EnthusiasmIsDisturbed

How about Margaret Hodge confronting Jeremy Corbyn and calling him “a fucking antisemite and a racist” ? How many of us would have jobs if we treated our boss like that? Note the subsequent disciplinary investigation into Margaret Hodge was discontinued.

I think if you want to complain about racist and misogynist bullying and abuse, you should make sure your hands are clean!

Oh so you are saying she has no right to call out anti semitism that impact her and other Jewish colleagues

Right I see

Those using the fact the Labour Party did not wholesale adopt the definition of antisemitism in the IHRA:

A coalition of 36 international Jewish anti-Zionist groups signed a letter of opposition to the IHRA definition, calling it a “distorted definition of antisemitism to stifle criticism of Israel“.

@EnthusiasmIsDisturbed no, not when she has been guilty of horrendous bullying, including of child abuse victims and of racism herself, no. It is so transparently political as to be laughable.

how about the fact her CLP were actively trying to de-select her

Yep, one of the people who proposed the vote of no-confidence in her, the chair of the CLP, appeared on a David Icke sponsored radio show and spread Rothschild conspiracy theories.

And all the other MP’s ?

Yet all the excuses made for Corbyn are not laughable

Ok

@noblegiraffe care to share any proof of this? I happen to know many people in her ex-constituency Labour Party, so would be really interested to see the evidence behind what you claim.

Flawed reporting on antisemitism claims against the Labour party

www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/sep/30/flawed-reporting-on-antisemitism-claims-against-the-labour-party

Yes after this report from some of Corbyns most loyal supporters 9 Labour MP’s stepped down one of the main issues being the lack of leadership in dealing with anti semitism within the party

Maybe they are getting confused and being over sensitive it’s probably all just a bit of banter

@ZacharyQuacks I will assume you are a left-wing socialist and a Labour member, which I am.

If a woman colleague told you she had been sexually assaulted would you demand the proof before accepting that she had indeed been sexually assaulted? Would you accuse her of having an ulterior motive, would you tend to think she faked it? If a gay person told you they had been harassed would you say it is all a fabrication? If a BAME colleague told you they had been discriminated against would you accuse them of making it up for some reason? Even if you thought they were mistaken wouldn't you work with them to try to understand why they felt that way and try to get to the truth?

You have mentioned Jewish Labour members who have described being subjected to antisemitic abuse. And suddenly you disbelieve . It is all a lie and a fabrication to undermine the leader and the party. What has made you throw your principles out of the window on this one issue? This is inherant bias. You may not see it that way but that is what it is.

It’s just another media smear campaign. So much fake news and hysteria around these days. Be careful what you believe. Remember what some people call “evidence” won’t be real or will have been grossly manipulated.

Anti semitism exists in society as do other forms of racism. I personally see hard line right wingers as far more racist and far more worrying. That’s my opinion anyway - and I don’t intend to justify it to anyone.

This thread is actually very very revealing. It shows very clearly the level of dismissing/minimising and justifying anti semitism amongst the Labour Party or by Jeremy Corbyn, on the grounds that

They've never seen it themselves
Some of their own friends are Jewish
Some Jews haven't seen it themselves
Some Jews haven't behaved well themselves so...
Anti semitism has been weaponised
Anti semitism is exaggerated
Other racism exists too you know
Well funded Israel supporters are just pissed off and have an agenda
Jewish people mostly vote conservative anyway
Society as a whole is even more anti Semitic
Anti Semitism is just an easy accusation to make without having to prove it
Other labour leaders didn't deal with it either
Non Jewish people are just identifying as Jews to attack others
The press haven't tried to expose anti semitism before Corbyn
Anti semitism only exists in same level in Labour as in the general public
It's only Corbyn's friends who are anti semites
The conservatives are even worse
Anti Semite comments were taken out of context when reported
People reported their experiences of anti semitism are just running a smear campaign
People don't understand what anti semitism is
People just didn't completely read or investigate when they endorsed anti Semitism
It's only because Labour Party is bigger they have to do more to erase anti semitism
You shouldn't complain about anti semitism if you've called your boss a "fucking anti Semite"

Just in this thread alone. So thank you LEM for starting it as it actually illustrates the extent of the problem so well. Very depressing though.

I forgot to say, if people want the point hammering home any more, please replace "anti semitism" in my post with sexism.